Jesus, The Descention To The Lower Parts..

[White Knight]

[b]Ephesians 4:9-10 (Now This, "He Ascended"--- what does it mean but that He also first descended into the lower parts of the earth? He who descended is also the One who ascended far above all the heavens, that He might fill all things.)[/b]


I'm wondering, Did Jesus ever acually go to Hell? because it doesn't say anything like that in the Gospels Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John. If so, Why didn't the Gospels mention this? I'm just cerious.

Edited September 2, 2004 by White Knight

[Cure of Ars]

I think you will find this interesting:

[quote]It has only been very recently in the history of English that the term [hell] has taken on the exclusive meaning of the place of the damned. In fact, when the King James Version was being translated, it was still used in its broader sense of the place of the dead. Thus we read the King James Bible discussing Jesus' soul being in hell:

"[David,] seeing this before, spake of the resurrection of Christ, that his [Christ's] soul was not left in hell, neither his flesh did see corruption. This Jesus hath God raised up, whereof we all are witnesses" (Acts 2:31-32).

Twentieth-century translations have the problem of how to deal with the fact that now the word "hell" means to most people "the place of the damned" and so to avoid implying Jesus went there, they use a different term when rendering this verse.

The Revised Standard Version transliterates the Greek word used here and speaks of "hades." This Greek term, like the original meaning of the word "hell," simply meant the place of the dead. Unfortunately, also like the word "hell," the word "hades" has also taken on the connotation (but not quite as strongly) of being the place of the damned.

To sidestep this, the New International Version says Jesus was not abandoned to "the grave," but this isn't very satisfactory either because the Greek word "hades" meant more than "the grave." It meant the netherworld.

This problem of references to the netherworld taking on connotations of the place of the damned has happened elsewhere, too. Originally, the Latin word infernum simply meant "the lower region" and was also used as a reference to the place of the dead. It, too, or rather its English derivative -- inferno -- has also acquired the firey connotations of the place of the damned, though these were lacking in its original use.

The only ancient language term I know of that this hasn't happened to is the Hebrew word sheol, which (since it hasn't been known to most English speakers) still simply means the place of the dead. The Revised Standard Version took the bold step of using this word when it appears in the Old Testament, but even though it is the Hebrew word that the Greek New Testament renders using hades, the RSV translators did not see fit to use it in the New Testament. If they had, it would have cut through the negative connotations associated with hell, hades, and inferno, but at the price of confronting the English-speaking reader with a totally unfamiliar word used in familiar New Testament passages.

In any event, the reason that we say in the Apostles Creed that Jesus descended into hell is because he did. He descended to the place of the dead. Whether one is most comfortable calling it sheol, hades, infernum, or hell, it doesn't matter. That's where he went, and the New Testament says so, not only in places like the Acts passage we quoted, but in places like this:

"For Christ also died for sins once for all, the righteous for the unrighteous, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh but made alive in the spirit; 19 in which he went and preached to the spirits in prison, 20 who formerly did not obey, when God's patience waited in the days of Noah, during the building of the ark" (1 Peter 3:18-20a).

"For this is why the gospel was preached even to the dead, that though judged in the flesh like men, they might live in the spirit like God" (1 Peter 4:6).

The Apostles' Creed was simply translated at a time when the word "hell" had a broader meaning in English than it does now, but it doesn't say anything different than the Bible. Jesus went to the place of the dead when he died.
[/quote]




[url="http://www.cin.org/users/james/questions/q103.htm"]Jesus descended into hell?[/url]

And if you want to learn more about the this subject look at this:

[url="http://web.archive.org/web/20030416191714/ic.net/~erasmus/RAZ304.HTM"]The Development of Old Testament and Jewish Views of Sheol, the Afterlife, and Eternal Punishment [/url]

And this:


[url="http://phorum.phatmass.com/index.php?showtopic=16867&hl=hell"]Paradise [/url]

[Socrates]

It's in the Apostles Creed: "He descended into Hell. On the third day He rose again and ascended into Heaven. . ."

Jesus descended into Hell (or Limbo) to release the souls of the just who were waiting for Christ to open the Gates of Heaven.

(By the way, I think this would make a good argument against certain ultraconservatives on this site that say it is impossible for anyone who is not a formal, practicing Catholic to get to heaven (before Christ, there was no Catholic Church.))

Edited September 2, 2004 by Socrates

[jasJis]

Just had a thought on this.

Wouldn't this be a good arguement for Purgatory? When these people died, they remained seperated from God and the gates of Heaven were not open. When Jesus came and washed there sins away if they accepted Jesus' grace. It shows there is forgiveness in the next life which ties in with the rest of Scripture.

[Archaeology cat]

Good thoughts, Socrates & jasJis. I hadn't thought of that. Thanks

[White Knight]

Ummmm...... a billion or more chances to receive the Lord Jesus Christ's Grace, and theres a chance to receive his grace in the afterlife is that what your saying [b]jasJis?[/b]

[HartfordWhalers]

[quote name='White Knight' date='Sep 4 2004, 10:01 PM'] Ummmm...... a billion or more chances to receive the Lord Jesus Christ's Grace, and theres a chance to receive his grace in the afterlife is that what your saying [b]jasJis?[/b] [/quote]
That is not the Church's teaching, if that is what he meant. So, since you wanted to know the Church's teaching, when the Apostles' Creed says: "He descended into Hell" this refers to the Limbo of the Fathers who could not yet be saved until Christ suffered for their sins to make retribution. In any event, this place must be, as St. Thomas Aquinas says, in the same place or near the same place as Hell or the Apostles would not have called it Hell. Therefore, Limbo is the same place or nearly the same place as Hell. This would also fit into the picture that Purgatory has the same fire as Hell, as those who were in LImbo of the Fathers were being purged of their sins, as well, as all men must be to enter Heaven. Therefore, just as they were purged in the Old Testament, so too are the just of the New Law in Purgatory.

[jasJis]

I have no idea what you mean about a billion more chances. The souls that passed before the Ressurection were somewhere and had 1 chance to accept Jesus' Salvific Grace. Grace (of various degrees) is still operative after death, even now, as we pray for souls in Purgatory and souls are praying for us if that is what you mean. There is only 1 Judgement of our souls. My point was there is more than than earth-or-heaven-or-hell.

[White Knight]

The billion chances here, while your alive, means you have many many chances to come to know Jesus.... Thats what the billion chances mean.

[MichaelFilo]

I always figured Jesus went down to hell. Why?

Apostles creed:

[quote]
I  BELIEVE in God the Father Almighty, Maker of heaven and earth: And in Jesus Christ his only Son, our Lord; who was conceived by the Holy Ghost, born of the virgin Mary, suffered under Pontius Pilate, was crucified, dead, and buried; [i]he descended into hell[/i]; the third day he rose again from the dead; he ascended into heaven, and sitteth on the right hand of God the Father Almighty; from thence he shall come to judge the quick and the dead.
I believe in the Holy Ghost; the holy catholic church; the communion of saints; the forgiveness of sins; the resurrection of the body; and the life everlasting. Amen[/quote]

However, an older version (6th century) omits the descended into hell. Anyways, my 2 cents.

God bless,

Mikey