reelguy227 Posted August 30, 2004 Share Posted August 30, 2004 [quote name='Aloysius' date='Aug 29 2004, 08:31 PM'] clarification to #1: 1. God created everything out of nothing. [/quote] Exactly !!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StColette Posted August 30, 2004 Share Posted August 30, 2004 [quote name='reelguy227' date='Aug 29 2004, 08:30 PM'] But.....the Church says we are not suppost to believe in evolution from apes ,I know that for sure. Evolution of animals to others im not sure of. [/quote] -------------------------------------------------------- Evolution & Concepts involved evolution does not state that humans came from apes does not say there isn't a God does not involve the creation of life Evolution is the change in DNA over time within a population Charles Darwin "Origin of the Species by means of natural selection" - did not use the term evolution -------------------------------------------------------- that's taken directly from my Zoology notes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StColette Posted August 30, 2004 Share Posted August 30, 2004 [quote name='Aloysius' date='Aug 29 2004, 08:31 PM'] clarification to #1: 1. God created everything out of nothing. [/quote] correct Al, but the Evolution theory doesn't teach a single thing about creation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iacobus Posted August 30, 2004 Share Posted August 30, 2004 [quote name='StColette' date='Aug 29 2004, 08:40 PM'] correct Al, but the Evolution theory doesn't teach a single thing about creation [/quote] Yuppers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StColette Posted August 30, 2004 Share Posted August 30, 2004 Catholics and Evolution One of the most important questions for every educated Catholic of today is: What is to be thought of the theory of evolution? Is it to be rejected as unfounded and inimical to Christianity, or is it to be accepted as an established theory altogether compatible with the principles of a Christian conception of the universe? We must carefully distinguish between the different meanings of the words theory of evolution in order to give a clear and correct answer to this question. We must distinguish (1) between the theory of evolution as a scientific hypothesis and as a philosophical speculation; (2) between the theory of evolution as based on theistic principles and as based on a materialistic and atheistic foundation; (3) between the theory of evolution and Darwinism; (4) between the theory of evolution as applied to the vegetable and animal kingdoms and as applied to man. (1) Scientific Hypothesis vs. Philosophical Speculation As a scientific hypothesis, the theory of evolution seeks to determine the historical succession of the various species of plants and of animals on our earth, and, with the aid of palæontology and other sciences, such as comparative morphology, embryology, and bionomy, to show how in the course of the different geological epochs they gradually evolve from their beginnings by purely natural causes of specific development. The theory of evolution, then, as a scientific hypothesis, does not consider the present species of plants and of animals as forms directly created by God, but as the final result of an evolution from other species existing in former geological periods. Hence it is called "the theory of evolution", or "the theory of descent", since it implies the descent of the present from extinct species. This theory is opposed to the theory of constancy, which assumes the immutability of organic species. The scientific theory of evolution, therefore, does not concern itself with the origin of life. It merely inquires into the genetic relations of systematic species, genera, and families, and endeavours to arrange them according to natural series of descent (genetic trees). How far is the theory of evolution based on observed facts? It is understood to be still only an hypothesis. The formation of new species is directly observed in but a few cases, and only with reference to such forms as are closely related to each other; for instance, the systematic species of the plant-genus Œnothera, and of the beetle-genus Dimarda. It is, however, not difficult to furnish an indirect proof of great probability for the genetic relation of many systematic species to each other and to fossil forms, as in the genetic development of the horse (Equidæ), of ammonites, and of many insects, especially of those that dwell as "guests" with ants and termites, and have adapted themselves in many ways to their hosts. Upon comparing the scientific proofs for the probability of the theory of evolution, we find that they grow the more numerous and weighty, the smaller the circle of forms under consideration, but become weaker and weaker, if we include a greater number of forms, such as are comprised in a class or in a sub-kingdom. There is, in fact, no evidence whatever for the common genetic descent of all plants and animals from a single primitive organism. Hence the greater number of botanists and zoologists regard a polygenetic (polyphyletic) evolution as much more acceptable than a monogenetic (monophyletic). At present, however, it is impossible to decide how many independent genetic series must be assumed in the animal and vegetable kingdoms. This is the gist of the theory of evolution as a scientific hypothesis. It is in perfect agreement with the Christian conception of the universe; for Scripture does not tell us in what form the present species of plants and of animals were originally created by God. As early as 1877 Knabenbauer stated "that there is no objection, so far as faith is concerned, to assuming the descent of all plant and animal species from a few types" (Stimmen aus Maria Laach, XIII, p. 72). Passing now to the theory of evolution as a philosophical speculation, the history of the plant and animal kingdoms upon our globe is but a small part of the history of the entire earth. Similarly, the geological development of our earth constitutes but a small part of the history of the solar system and of the universe. The theory of evolution as a philosophical conception considers the entire history of the cosmos as an harmonious development, brought about by natural laws. This conception is in agreement with the Christian view of the universe. God is the Creator of heaven and earth. If God produced the universe by a single creative act of His will, then its natural development by laws implanted in it by the Creator is to the greater glory of His Divine power and wisdom. St. Thomas says: "The potency of a cause is the greater, the more remote the effects to which it extends." (Summa c. Gent., III, c. lxxvi); and Suarez: "God does not interfere directly with the natural order, where secondary causes suffice to produce the intended effect" (De opere sex dierum, II, c. x, n. 13). In the light of this principle of the Christian interpretation of nature, the history of the animal and vegetable kingdoms on our planet is, as it were, a versicle in a volume of a million pages in which the natural development of the cosmos is described, and upon whose title-page is written: "In the beginning God created heaven and earth." (2) Theistic vs. Atheistic Theories of Evolution The theory of evolution just stated rests on a theistic foundation. In contradistinction to this is another theory resting on a materialistic and atheistic basis, the first principle of which is the denial of a personal Creator. This atheistic theory of evolution is ineffectual to account for the first beginning of the cosmos or for the law of its evolution, since it acknowledges neither creator nor lawgiver. Natural science, moreover, has proved that spontaneous generation–i.e. the independent genesis of a living being from non-living matter–contradicts the facts of observation. For this reason the theistic theory of evolution postulates an intervention on the part of the Creator in the production of the first organisms. When and how the first seeds of life were implanted in matter, we, indeed, do not know. The Christian theory of evolution also demands a creative act for the origin of the human soul, since the soul cannot have its origin in matter. The atheistic theory of evolution, on the contrary, rejects the assumption of a soul separate from matter, and thereby sinks into blank materialism. (3) The Theory of Evolution vs. Darwinism Darwinism and the theory of evolution are by no means equivalent conceptions. The theory of evolution was propounded before Charles Darwin's time, by Lamarck (1809) and Geoffroy de Saint-Hilaire. Darwin, in 1859, gave it a new form by endeavouring to explain the origin of species by means of natural selection. According to this theory the breeding of new species depends on the survival of the fittest in the struggle for existence. The Darwinian theory of selection is Darwinism–adhering to the narrower, and accurate, sense of the word. As a theory, it is scientifically inadequate, since it does not account for the origin of attributes fitted to the purpose, which must be referred back to the interior, original causes of evolution. Haeckel, with other materialists, has enlarged this selection theory of Darwin's into a philosophical world-idea, by attempting to account for the whole evolution of the cosmos by means of the chance survival of the fittest. This theory is Darwinism in the secondary, and wider, sense of the word. It is that atheistical form of the theory of evolution which was shown above–under (2)–to be untenable. The third signification of the term Darwinism arose from the application of the theory of selection to man, which is likewise impossible of acceptance. In the fourth place, Darwinism frequently stands, in popular usage, for the theory of evolution in general. This use of the word rests on an evident confusion of ideas, and must therefore be set aside. (4) Human Evolution vs. Plant and Animal Evolution To what extent is the theory of evolution applicable to man? That God should have made use of natural, evolutionary, original causes in the production of man's body, is per se not improbable, and was propounded by St. Augustine (see AUGUSTINE OF HIPPO, SAINT, under V. Augustinism in History). The actual proofs of the descent of man's body from animals is, however, inadequate, especially in respect to paleontology. And the human soul could not have been derived through natural evolution from that of the brute, since it is of a spiritual nature; for which reason we must refer its origin to a creative act on the part of God. www.newadvent.org/cathen/05654a.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reelguy227 Posted August 30, 2004 Share Posted August 30, 2004 This is reelguys cousin talking NOT reelguy: Im catholic, but the theory of evolution you guys are talking about is so misunderstood, evoltion dosent change one spieces into another, it is only small changes in a spieces. Its evolution but its called natural selection. For example, the appendix, scientists think we needed it at one time but now its just a worm like thing hanging there. Its evolution. thats what evolution is, not a dinosaur turning into a bird. But do that a thousand times over a million years and that can happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StColette Posted August 30, 2004 Share Posted August 30, 2004 [quote name='reelguy227' date='Aug 29 2004, 08:52 PM'] This is reelguys cousin talking NOT reelguy: Im catholic, but the theory of evolution you guys are talking about is so misunderstood, evoltion dosent change one spieces into another, it is only small changes in a spieces. [/quote] thank you reelguy's cousin lol the Evolution theory is often times soooooo misconstrude and it makes it very hard to explain the real definition of it when people have been misinformed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reelguy227 Posted August 30, 2004 Share Posted August 30, 2004 (edited) [quote name='StColette' date='Aug 29 2004, 08:56 PM'] thank you reelguy's cousin lol the Evolution theory is often times soooooo misconstrude and it makes it very hard to explain the real definition of it when people have been misinformed. [/quote] This is reelguy by the way. What do you mean colette? You think evolution is real ? I thought the Church was against evolution from apes? Edited August 30, 2004 by reelguy227 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StColette Posted August 30, 2004 Share Posted August 30, 2004 ugh lol Evolution theory does not say that humans evolved from apes !! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
White Knight Posted August 30, 2004 Share Posted August 30, 2004 (edited) But the Theory of Evolution Denines the Present of a Designer/Creator a.k.a God, in anyway shape, or form. Thats something Evolution does admit. Evolution is a attempted path to try to escape God's Righteous Wrath and Judgment. thats all it is. I would commit more on this but I have been in this topic on other forums and such, and it goes on for a long time, and Evolution usually loses. Because it can't support its so called phyicial evidence., Bring up what you may, but Creation scientists and non creation scientists believe that Evolution could not have happened, the Theory of Evolution is been falling apart for the past 4 decades, and there still teaching it as fact. its a shame. Edited August 30, 2004 by White Knight Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reelguy227 Posted August 30, 2004 Share Posted August 30, 2004 But a lot of people believe that they did when talking about evolution .Like the Darwinism theory is widely accepted as a form of evolution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StColette Posted August 30, 2004 Share Posted August 30, 2004 [quote name='White Knight' date='Aug 29 2004, 09:32 PM'] But the Theory of Evolution Denines the Present of a Designer/Creator a.k.a God, in anyway shape, or form. Thats something Evolution does admit. Evolution is a attempted path to try to escape God's Righteous Wrath and Judgment. thats all it is. [/quote] The Evolution theory neither denies nor affirms the existance of God. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
White Knight Posted August 30, 2004 Share Posted August 30, 2004 Then where is he in all of it? why dont they acknowolege him in anyway? The main theory of Evolution says that we came by blind chance, and have no devine purpose or meaning in life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StColette Posted August 30, 2004 Share Posted August 30, 2004 [quote name='reelguy227' date='Aug 29 2004, 09:32 PM'] But a lot of people believe that they did when talking about evolution .Like the Darwinism theory is widely accepted as a form of evolution. [/quote] Darwinism has nothing to do with Evolution, Charles Darwin never used the word Evolution or any form of the word. Yes people believe when speaking about Evolution that they are saying humans came from apes etc. This is a misconception and is totally a twisting of the theory. Any college professor will tell you this if they have studied the theory correctly in its correct form. hehe Zoology notes one more time -------------------------------------------------------- Evolution & Concepts involved evolution does not state that humans came from apes does not say there isn't a God does not involve the creation of life Evolution is the change in DNA over time within a population Charles Darwin "Origin of the Species by means of natural selection" - did not use the term evolution -------------------------------------------------------- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StColette Posted August 30, 2004 Share Posted August 30, 2004 [quote name='White Knight' date='Aug 29 2004, 09:40 PM'] The main theory of Evolution says that we came by blind chance, and have no devine purpose or meaning in life. [/quote] The Evolution theory does not speak on the creation of anything. It speaks on the change in DNA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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