Grace

[phatcatholic]

[quote name='MichaelFilo' date='Aug 16 2004, 03:35 PM'] thank you! Thank you very much. One last thing, if I can get it clarafied.

Faith is supernatural. So we'd need sanctifiying grace to be able to have faith correct? This is also true for good works, since they are supernatural ( in the sense that their intention is to glorify God ). Am I correct, or dead wrong?

God bless,

Thank you,

Mikey [/quote]
sanctifying grace is not the only type of "supernatural" grace. Grace in general is supernatural, by definition. so, actual grace is supernatural as well, and it is this grace that prompts our acts of faith.

[MichaelFilo]

Maybe I worded it funny, but I didn't mean ACTS of faith. I meant faith itself (belief).

God bless,

Mikey

[phatcatholic]

[quote name='MichaelFilo' date='Aug 16 2004, 03:56 PM'] Maybe I worded it funny, but I didn't mean ACTS of faith. I meant faith itself (belief).

God bless,

Mikey [/quote]
my answer still applies

[MichaelFilo]

So we don't need spiritual grace to have faith, just receive actual graces? Wow, well, I totally was wrong.

God bless

Mikey

[phatcatholic]

[quote name='MichaelFilo' date='Aug 16 2004, 10:23 PM'] So we don't need spiritual grace to have faith, just receive actual graces? Wow, well, I totally was wrong.

God bless

Mikey [/quote]
that's how i've always understood it. check the links that "thedude" provided earlier in this thread, as well as this one:

--[url="http://www.catholic.com/library/Grace_What_It_Is.asp"][b]Grace: What It Is and What It Does[/b][/url]

let me know if u have any more questions.

pax christi,
phatcatholic

[MichaelFilo]

If anything has made grace unclear it has been that article (only because it should mention the grace they are referring to at all times, since both are being discussed).

The article however seems to point in a different direction then what you are saying,

[quote]Our souls don’t become something other than souls when God cleanses them and pours his grace into them (what the Bible refers to as "infused" ["poured"] grace, cf. Acts 10:45, Rom. 5:5 Titus 3:5–7); they don’t cease to be what they were before. When grace elevates nature, our intellects are given the new power of faith, something they don’t have at the merely natural level. Our wills are given the new powers of hope and charity, things also absent at the merely natural level.[/quote]

It does however say that acts of faith come from actual grace,

[quote]To regain supernatural life, you have to receive actual graces from God. Think of these as helping graces. Such graces differ from sanctifying grace in that they aren’t a quality of the soul and don’t abide in it. Rather, actual graces enable the soul to perform some supernatural act, such as an act of faith or repentance. If the soul responds to actual grace and makes the appropriate supernatural act, it again receives supernatural life. [/quote]

This very article is where I got my views from. Maybe I've misread it... and I can get a little clearing up. I am sorry I'm dragging this on, but if I'm right, it would make more sense to me, and I'd be more certain in my apologetics.

Thank you

God bless,

Mikey