The Essential Question

[Seatbelt Blue]

May the peace and blessings of the Trinity be upon you!

The essential question of Catholicism is not "how far can I go before
I get in trouble," but "what can I do to be a holy person;" not "what
am I permitted," but "what am I to be?" The answer to the essential
question is, of course, Christ: I am to be Christ, to form and be
formed in That image. But how to accomplish this?

I understand the terms, the concepts, the premises of our faith, that
we are to participate in what Scott Hahn calls "the life of the
Trinity," the familial existence of the Church, with is family love,
self-sacrificing rather than self-asserting. However, the question I
have never been able to answer is the real-world application of this
idea, the "what" and "how" to this "why." I feel much like the rich
young man who was told by Christ to give up everything and follow Him;
however, I have difficulty seeing Christ before me, and figuring out
exactly where He's going.

I feel like I live, as John Paul II puts it, "in the shadow of the
Law." Every time I ask "how do I follow Christ more closely, how do I
emulate Him," I am told "pray the Rosary. Attend Mass regularly." But,
like the rich young man, "all these things I have done." Surely there
must be more!

Essentially, how do I pass from an externalized, compartmentalized
faith to one fully lived?

I am not fully or even properly formed. I've spent most of my
Christian life in debate, looking more to win arguments than to live
in the life of the Trinity. I did this under the guise of "love;" I
love these poor Protestant souls, and so I will yell them into
Catholicism. Needless to say, I was less than successful, and I have
since been shown the error I perpetuated, an "us and them" mentality
that destroys authentic faith. I am the victim, too, of this mind
which calls me to be a crusader against error rather than a
participant in the family love of the Trinity.

How do I live this faith fully? How do I comprehend and know Christ as
Christ is to be comprehended and known, which is in love, obedience?
How do I come to stop viewing God as my King and instead as my Father?

This is, of course, the fundamental challenge of V2 as taught by Pope
John Paul: self-donation, inner conversion and formation, a new
freedom where the rules hardly matter (for example, St Augustine's
"Love God and do what you will;" when you love God fully, the "rules,"
as I put it, become unnecessary as one is living a life _conformed to
the Person of Christ_). But how is this acquired? How does one _live
this life?_

I have a very Franciscan notion - more like a Christian notion, I
think - that we are, first and foremost, called to self-giving
service, which is love, to mankind, and I feel very strongly called to
some sort of "radical, revolutionary," authentic Christian life of
service/love. George Sim Johnston writes, "We are created in the image
of a Trinitarian God, three persons in the act of eternal, mutual
self-giving. We have the 'law of gift' inscribed in our being. There
are two sentences from Gaudium et Spes that John Paul quotes
repeatedly; they are the leitmotiv of his pontificate. First: Man 'can
fully find his true self only in the sincere gift of self.' In other
words, contrary to our hedonist culture's notions of happiness, we
find our humanity more in self-giving than self-assertion, in
relationship rather than self-sufficiency. And the second is like it:
'Christ the new Adam...fully reveals man to himself.' The truth about
ourselves is ultimately not a proposition but a Person, who Himself is
defined by total self-donation."

I often read these writings by varied and sundry authors, online and
off, that make this point - self-giving service, love, Personhood in
Christ - but none will even begin to offer practical advice on how to
go about living this authentic Christianity. So, having ploughed
through my verbose communique, I pray that one of you can offer some sound
advice on the matter.

Thank you.
--
Pax et amor,
Brian

[Paladin D]

I'm going to post my reply later, it's 1am and I can barely think. Be patient.

[-I---Love]

This is possibly THEE greatest post I've ever read here or original thought on faith I've ever read not published!

I am serious and this may not mean one cent coming from one you do not know, have never talked to, will probably never meet, and who lurks around this phorum, but doesn't post too often.

I really mean this - tears came as I read this - BECAUSE THESE WORDS ARE AUTHENTIC - THEY ARE REAL - THIS IS WHAT JESUS IS LONGING FOR US - THIS PLAN YOU'VE CAPTURED IS THE REAL GOSPEL - THE REAL LAW!

You ended by asking for sound advice on the matter of living authentic Christian faith - man you've got more sound advice than we can give you - maybe I'm being rash but when I read that it was like I was listening to Peter Maurin share one of his easy essays with Dorothy Day (who was me listening)

Sit in front of the Blessed Sacrament and speak few words. That's the only advice I have that I need to take myself.

Thank you for your post!

Don't let that fire in you of the HS die, please! Remember this thing you wrote twenty years from now - I am serious - cause faith is crazy w/ ppl and who knows if you'll think this down the road - so seriously remember it!

[stagefairy]

Wow! Your question is exactly something I pray about and strive for each day. I don't have a concrete answer, but I can pass on some of the things my spiritual director has said to me.

He advises daily mass, rosary, frequent confessions... all of this seems apparent in seeking holiness. Some more of his advise is...

have 3 times throughout the day to spend in prayer to offer up the rest of the day and all of your actions as prayer. He compares the three set times to telephone poles holding up the wire of communication with God. A funny analogy, but useful.

Once we are rid of habitual sin, we start working on our attachments. I once asked how to identify attachments. He said that anything that distracts you during times of prayer or in mass is usually an attachment. Something you are thinking about that you probably spend too much time thinking about. For me it's family problems, finances and occasionally movies or games. Some of these are obvious how to rid ourselves of them. Things I am worried about like finances or family trouble needs to be given to God in prayer. Hard, but do-able. Movies and games are usually things I have spent too much time on and I realize it's time to cut back and use a little sef control, because when I spend less time on these things, they don't distract me in mass. That simple. We aren't to be attached to anything in this world. Everything is a gift from God that we can enjoy, use and appreciate, but shouldn't get attached or become dependant on. He uses the example of a soccer player who love his sport and practices every day. But if this person for some reason could no longer play soccer, he would be okay with that. It's not his fulfillment, because only God can truly fulfill. This made me question my relationships with people, because many of my attachments lie in relationships. I asked about my husband. I love him very much and if I didn't have him anymore, I would definitely NOT be okay with that. He explained that we are to love people (especially our spouses), with the love of the trinity which is in self giving. But I have to recognize that my husband is a precious gift from God. I argued that he meets so many of my needs and I would just die without him. He answered that God uses my husband to meet my needs, but it is really God who meets my needs and if my husband were to die or something, God would continue to meet my needs in a different way. I don't know if that really made sense. Basicly, this is the message I got in a nutshell:
First we work on ridding ourselves of sin (especially those sins which are habitual... you know. the ones you seem to confess every single time)
Then we identify attachments and rid ourselves of them.

Which saint was it that said, "Let me decrease, so that He may increase." ?

Father also reccomends frequent self denial in little things. Sitting in the less comfortable chair. Not having coffee in the morning, fasting from music for a day, using time spent online or in front of the TV in prayer. Etc.

Okay. Well, I'm not sure how understandable this is. It's really late and I just summed up a year and a half of spiritual direction in one paragraph. Probably not a good idea. I will check tomorrow and clarify anything my late night brain confused.
I don't even know if this is what you are asking, but your post really caught my attention, because it's something I question quite often. Okay. that's all. goodnight.

[stagefairy]

After posting and reading my post I realized that I sound very prideful and like I have all the answers or something. I don't. I struggle so much and don't live out all the advice I get. So please don't take my post the wrong way. goodnight.

[Philippe]

bump cause this is really good

[cmotherofpirl]

Seatbelt that is one of the best posts I have ever read, so I'm pinning it.

[Seatbelt Blue]

[quote name='cmotherofpirl' date='Aug 13 2004, 10:19 AM'] Seatbelt that is one of the best posts I have ever read, so I'm pinning it. [/quote]




Thanks.
Hoping I, ya know, [i]get some replies now[/i]

[Seatbelt Blue]

[quote name='cmotherofpirl' date='Aug 13 2004, 10:19 AM'] Seatbelt that is one of the best posts I have ever read, so I'm pinning it. [/quote]
Hey, does this mean I get to be in Church Faithful

[lifeteenchick527]

wow seatbelt...that was awesome!!!


also...the people who repied i like your answers!!

[stagefairy]

Something to add to my thoughts last night.
In spite of everything else, questions are best answered when taken directly to Jesus in adoration. I'm washed over with peace when i take a question and just sit and listen.

[Seatbelt Blue]

[quote name='stagefairy' date='Aug 13 2004, 12:08 PM'] Something to add to my thoughts last night.
In spite of everything else, questions are best answered when taken directly to Jesus in adoration. I'm washed over with peace when i take a question and just sit and listen. [/quote]
Would that I could. The Cathedral doesn't offer adoration.

[lifeteenchick527]

u should talk to the priests at your church about that...maybe they will be able to setup a day once a month for adoration...at my church once a month there is adoration

[Aloysius]

Amen.

overintellecutalization and argumentation can never be good

[-I---Love]

[quote name='Aloysius' date='Aug 13 2004, 01:27 PM'] Amen.

overintellecutalization and argumentation can never be good [/quote]
Amen to that too!