Papal Great Invocation

[phatcatholic]

[quote name='catholicguy' date='Jul 28 2004, 03:06 PM'] His idea that peace comes from false religions agreeing not to fight, etc. is wrong because he doesn't know what peace is if he thinks not fighting is peace. Read St. Thomas Aquinas's writings. I agree with him before the Pope's opinion (which would not necessarily be something I would say 75 years ago, but, like I said, with Modernism, you have to be careful now). God bless. [/quote]
again, as i said to budge, the pope is not claiming anything about the potential for or nature of peace in other religions. he is just hoping and praying that peace--as well as justice, forgiveness, life and love--will come from these places, regardless of the likelihood.

i must repeat this:
[b]--justice, peace, forgiveness, life and love are essential to communion with God and our fellow man. there is nothing wrong w/ praying for these things, and especially with praying that these things will come from the most unlikely of sources.[/b]

what is wrong w/ praying that noble virtues will come from unlikely places?

[catholicguy]

"Whosoever is separated from the Catholic Church, however praiseworthy his life may be in his own opinion, he shall for this single reason: that he is at the same time separated from the unity of Christ, not see life, but the wrath of God shall abideth on him. In the Catholic Church, there are both good and bad, but those who are separated from her cannot be good. For, though the conversation of some of them appears commendable, their very separation from the Church makes them bad according to Our Savior: 'He who is not with Me, is against Me.' " St. Augustine

Because of this we cannot expect virtue from the virtue-less, as St. Augustine has said no one is good outside the Church. "...neither can an evil tree bring forth good fruit. Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit, shall be cut down, and shall be cast into the fire. St. Matthew VII. 18, 19

[Don John of Austria]

All religions except the Catholic Faith have a bit of Truth meaning they also have a "bit " ( or a lot more than a bit) of Lie, Satan is the Father of Lies therefore he is the Father of qall religions except the Catholic Faith( including Rabbinical Judaism whic is not the Faith of the Apostles) therefore all of them serve Satan in someway even if by only causeing the seperation of those who wish to be faithful from the saving Graces of the Sacraments, but usually by direct Challenges to teh Truth, therefore no other religion can offer piece they are the Children of "e who was a murderer from the beginning" I hope the Pope did not say this as this is blatantly not in keeping with Catholic Tradition.

[Budge]

Please everyone think about what is being said that isnt just surface stuff. Who can argue with peace? I like peace, but Christians KNOW that only Christ will bring peace.

Im sorry but things are getting really weird in the Catholic Church---Today I read on Catholic blog I visited this:
www.runningoff.blogspot
[quote]
MARK'S BLOG AND "OUR LADY"

Mark (or perhaps it was Elliot) has a post titled "For People Given to Freaking Out about the Hindus Who Visited Fatima" in which he indicates [b]"The only prayer offered by the Hindus was directed to Our Lady." He asks if Catholics ever consider that "it might be Faith that is infiltrating paganism rather than vice versa?[/b]"[/quote]


I believe that a glass of water with rat poison (little bit of lie) is still going to kill and lead to destruction.

God warns of false religions throughout the Bible. Come on everyone without Jesus they are LOST!

Don I got those quotes directly off Vatican website...please reread top post.

Sigh we probably wont agree on this stuff. You all probably havent been around false religions in ashrams and Buddhist temples nor around the false spirits.(UU church) To be Christian after being lost in those evils is to KNOW THE DIFFERENCE. A Christian should not be aligned with these things but do their best to GET PEOPLE OUT OF THE BONDAGE.

[M.SIGGA]

Hi Budge,

Buddy this is your third post screaming a "new world order / universalist" agenda by the Pope and the Church. The message you are ignoring is that a degree of goodness can exist in people who are of non-Christian religions who are ignorant of the Gospel of Jesus Christ, and since all goodness comes from God, people who happen not to be Christianized (yet?) still have the possibility of goodness. Any act of goodness or peacemaking would have to come from God because it can't come from anything else. Their uninformed conscience and ignorance doesn't totally nullify them from promoting peace and justice in thier torn lands because they have never been instructed and catechised about the Prince of Peace. Christian or not, all people are still created in the image of God, and have the ability to love and show kindness, because God is love. All goodness comes from God (the one true Father, Son, and HS AlphaOmega God). It has never been an excuse not to evangelize; I think the Catholic Church has historically demonstrated this the best of all. Yes, only Christ brings peace.

Peace

Edited July 29, 2004 by M.SIGGA

[Don John of Austria]

Budge -- I can agree with you completly, I have been around Witchcraft and Satanism, Mormanism, and Hinduism, not to mention the ever present Jehovahs Witnesses. I was baptised in the Episcopal Church 30 years ago( before they went Crazy) and agree completely that nothing brings Salvation or Peace except Christ Church. However, the only Church that qualifies as that is the One Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church, The Roman Church Founded by Christ Himself on the Rock -- Peter-- it is the only Church that is truely Christ Church and it is the only one which can bring either Peace or Salvation. If our Pope said this thing then it was a thing outside of Catholic Tradition, but Popes can express things as men, or as priest or as theologians which can be mistaken or even heretical and not lose the Authority granted them by Christ and the Father, as The Pope and in that role, "from the Chair of Peter" they cannot be mistaken or heretical, the Holy Spirit will not allow them to.

[jmjtina]

[quote]If the Pope said there is no God or that the Catholic Church is not the True Church or that contraception is OK, would you need the context to know its wrong? NO! [/quote]

he didn't, and he won't. This is the Catholic Church. She has already declared her stance on both those items. Again, you think us faithful to the Mother Church and a love for the Pope makes us ignorant and blind.

Have you read Humane Vitae?


[b]The March for Life [/b]is they prime example of uniting with ALL faiths (or lack of) to come together to [u]stop murder [/u]in the womb. We all pray for an end. And put on by Priests for Life I believe. Here the Diocese puts on thier own mini March for Life and invite EVERYBODY. Are we to stop that? If so, why? People are praying in thier own way (or not praying at all but holding visible signs) yet all united to stop the killing. the Diocese is in NO WAY promoting other ppl's faith, but calling all to become one to stop this evil we ALL suffer from. Is this not the same with the Vatican? Calling all faiths to pray and show a visible sign of unity to end a great evil?

God Bless.

[Chucho]

Budge, you said that you like peace and are all for peace. That’s what the Pope wants as well, peace. Do you think that maybe the Pope calls for peace in this violent unmerciful world so as to help the people of other religions allow themselves to take a closer look at Christ who brings true peace? I certainly do.

[b]EDIT*[/b]:Wrong link, but now corrected
[url="http://www.catholicexchange.com/e3news/index.asp?article_id=162518"]http://www.catholicexchange.com/e3news/ind...ticle_id=162518[/url]
This may also be a reason for the Pope to call for peace in the world among different religions. To call for peace so as others might live is certainly a noble cause. And if this then leads to interfaith dialogue that promotes Christianity, then this is even more noble. You just quoted that at Fatima, Hindis were praying to the Mother of God. This is a matter to rejoice at! But for whatever reason you say that this is wrong. I would like for you to explain this because I just don’t understand how it is so.

You say:

[quote]Who can argue with peace? I like peace, but Christians KNOW that only Christ will bring peace.[/quote]

Yes this is most certainly true. No one has taken a different position from you on this at any time. Could it be that the Pope asks for peace among the different religions so that they will stop and see that it is Christ that brings true peace?

As a matter of fact, you take on the same position of peace that the Pope does, but for this you call him a universalist. We know that you want peace and are not a universalist, so why do you call the Pope one when he wants peace?

Edited July 29, 2004 by Chucho