Same-sex Marriage Amendment Didn't Pass

[Paladin D]

Lost by a [b]48-50[/b] margin, it needed 60 votes.

God have mercy on us.

[url="http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,125628,00.html"]http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,125628,00.html[/url]

[Spiritual_Arsonist]

Can we really expect anything stellar from the United States Govt?

Typical.

Democracy is only good for about 300 years.

[StColette]

This is just sad

[Oik]

It's unfortunate, but I don't think it's going to just go a way. Already, 38 states "ban" same-sex marriage as being equal to marriage. I think the push to amend the constitution will continue.

[catholicguy]

[quote name='Spiritual_Arsonist' date='Jul 14 2004, 01:52 PM'] Can we really expect anything stellar from the United States Govt?

Typical.

Democracy is only good for about 300 years. [/quote]
Democracy is NEVER good. Democracy started with the over-throw of Catholicism in the government (French Rev, or if you consider American Rev the "first democracy" which is actually a Republic, which is equally as bad, it lost its Catholicity back with the heretic Henry VIII), and it remains that way in every democracy ever. This has been condemned by numerous Popes.

Edited July 14, 2004 by catholicguy

[Thy Geekdom Come]

[quote name='catholicguy' date='Jul 14 2004, 03:45 PM'] Democracy is NEVER good. Democracy started with the over-throw of Catholicism in the government (French Rev, or if you consider American Rev the "first democracy" which is actually a Republic, which is equally as bad, it lost its Catholicity back with the heretic Henry VIII), and it remains that way in every democracy ever. This has been condemned by numerous Popes. [/quote]
Well, no. Democracy started in ancient Athens.

It works much better on a small scale like that than it does in a whole country.

Of course, this is only somewhat relevant, because the US is a Democratic Republic.


Other than that, I agree. I'm not a fan of democracy.

[mmmerf]

Hold Up.

Democracy is NEVER good? That's a little strong, don't you think?

I can think of plenty of good examples when Democracy was a huge help. It's a good way of discerning what people want. It's just not a good thing in matters of truth. Because truth is what it is, it cannot be changed by popular vote.

That's all.

[catholicguy]

[quote name='Raphael' date='Jul 14 2004, 02:51 PM'] Well, no. Democracy started in ancient Athens.

It works much better on a small scale like that than it does in a whole country.

Of course, this is only somewhat relevant, because the US is a Democratic Republic.


Other than that, I agree. I'm not a fan of democracy. [/quote]
Oh, you're right, I forgot about the pagans in Athens, where it all started, which is basically what secular society is today.

[Thy Geekdom Come]

[quote name='catholicguy' date='Jul 14 2004, 03:53 PM'] Oh, you're right, I forgot about the pagans in Athens, where it all started, which is basically what secular society is today. [/quote]
Now I'm against paganism, but how is that relevant?

Many of the advocates of democracy and republicanism were considered proto-Christians...

[BurkeFan]

[quote name='Oik' date='Jul 14 2004, 02:41 PM'] It's unfortunate, but I don't think it's going to just go a way. Already, 38 states "ban" same-sex marriage as being equal to marriage. I think the push to amend the constitution will continue. [/quote]
Those state laws are but mere fodder for the courts. They don't let little things like laws get in the way of promoting radical, destructive social changes.

*says a prayer for the prevention of the death of society*

[catholicguy]

[quote name='Raphael' date='Jul 14 2004, 02:54 PM'] Now I'm against paganism, but how is that relevant?

Many of the advocates of democracy and republicanism were considered proto-Christians... [/quote]
It goes to show that democracy leads inevitably to error. "No authority, no truth" is a great article I read recently. It is by Eileen Spatz. You should read it if you can, but I can't mention the group who publishes it, or it will be against the forum rules.

In any event, who considers pagans proto-Christians? That is what the JEWS were. Maybe those who support democracy would come up with something off-the-wall like that.

Edited July 14, 2004 by catholicguy

[catholicguy]

[quote name='mmmerf' date='Jul 14 2004, 02:53 PM'] Hold Up.

Democracy is NEVER good? That's a little strong, don't you think?

I can think of plenty of good examples when Democracy was a huge help. It's a good way of discerning what people want. It's just not a good thing in matters of truth. Because truth is what it is, it cannot be changed by popular vote.

That's all. [/quote]
Exactly. It does not lead to truth but error. That is why it is wrong. It doesn't matter what "the people want" if it is not Truth that the people want. Truth only should they receive and nothing else.

[ilovechrist]

ick....
i hope that this Amendment is pushed... we need it passed!!!!

[Thy Geekdom Come]

[quote name='catholicguy' date='Jul 14 2004, 04:22 PM'] It goes to show that democracy leads inevitably to error. "No authority, no truth" is a great article I read recently. It is by Eileen Spatz. You should read it if you can, but I can't mention the group who publishes it, or it will be against the forum rules.

In any event, who considers pagans proto-Christians? That is was the JEWS were. Maybe those who support democracy would come up with something off-the-wall like that. [/quote]
[quote]In any event, who considers pagans proto-Christians? That is was the JEWS were. Maybe those who support democracy would come up with something off-the-wall like that.[/quote]

Ahem. The Church in the Middle Ages, before the refined process of Canonization, considered Plato, Aristotle, and Virgil to be proto-Christians. This according to Fr. Peter Stravinskas, a personal acquantance, and an extremely tradition-loving and well-educated priest.

[catholicguy]

Oh... you presented it as "pagans were proto-Christians" (your actual words were many of the supporters of democracy, etc., which I thought was in reference to Athens, the first one) as a generalization. Of course those philosophers could be considered such, but their religion is false, and error that comes from democracy, which was the major area of this debate, that democracy leads to error, especially in religion.

Edited July 14, 2004 by catholicguy