The Kyle Rittenhouse verdict deforms natural law

[rachael]

5 hours ago, Didacus said:

Not sure about that...

If my neighbor is being attacked - is it my business to intervene and help defemd him? Or just bare witness come hell or high water?

If a man comes at me with a bat - I would have no issue with reaching for a gun.  If yhe attackwr is dimb enough to match his bat to my gun - that's his own stupidity, not mine.

Kyle was attacked with people who were armed were they not? A testimony admitted a pointing a gun to Kyle prior to Kyle using force?

Now if the attacker trying to wrestle the gun from Kyle did not have a gun themselves - then them guys were stupid in themselves.  If I don't like my neighbor flashing a gun in front of my kids, I'll pose a complaint or report him.  I wouldn't charge him and try to take the gun from him.  If I did, my neighbor would be fully justified in shooting me (and spare this world my stupidity, as Tolkien would say).

My personal (and I guess, my own logical) issues with it come from the fact with Kyle came from another to defend a property that wasn't even his. Why? Was he seeking out a fight? He is not a police officer, and I am not defending the protestor's/rioter's actions against him. The protestors were OK to be there (again, not defending the rioters). Really, what the hell was he doing there with a gun? It does not add up. But, I can see where you're coming from.

[Anomaly]

1 hour ago, rachael said:

My personal (and I guess, my own logical) issues with it come from the fact with Kyle came from another to defend a property that wasn't even his. Why? Was he seeking out a fight? He is not a police officer, and I am not defending the protestor's/rioter's actions against him. The protestors were OK to be there (again, not defending the rioters). Really, what the hell was he doing there with a gun? It does not add up. But, I can see where you're coming from.

Please check the AP news reports. 
Kyle lived a few minutes away in Antioch, Illinois, with his mom.   His dad, grandma, aunt, and other family lived in Antioch.  
He went with his friend, who knew the car dealer whose cars were burned in previous riots, to protect property.  Kyle was ambushed in the lot.  
This came out in testimony.  

There are other mitigating factors and it wasn’t cut and dried which is why it took weeks of trial, testimony, and days for the jury to consider and reach a verdict.  

[Norseman82]

On 11/22/2021 at 5:10 PM, Mercedes said:

The point is why was a 17 year old with no armed defense training as a security guard, allowed to bring an AR15 to a used car lot as a self designated defender during a protest?  Why doesn't that give you pause for thought?  It's a guaranteed recipe for some people to get killed. To not see that shows a serious blockage in reasoning.

 

5 hours ago, rachael said:

My personal (and I guess, my own logical) issues with it come from the fact with Kyle came from another to defend a property that wasn't even his. Why? Was he seeking out a fight? He is not a police officer, and I am not defending the protestor's/rioter's actions against him. The protestors were OK to be there (again, not defending the rioters). Really, what the hell was he doing there with a gun? It does not add up. But, I can see where you're coming from.

Well, he was in a police explorer program and was wearing some gear issued to him by the program, so I'm not sure that is 100% correct.

Moral of the story:  don't bring a skateboard to a gun fight...

[rachael]

5 hours ago, Norseman82 said:

 

Well, he was in a police explorer program and was wearing some gear issued to him by the program, so I'm not sure that is 100% correct.

Moral of the story:  don't bring a skateboard to a gun fight...

Fair, but was he entitled to actually serve?

8 hours ago, Anomaly said:

Please check the AP news reports. 
Kyle lived a few minutes away in Antioch, Illinois, with his mom.   His dad, grandma, aunt, and other family lived in Antioch.  
He went with his friend, who knew the car dealer whose cars were burned in previous riots, to protect property.  Kyle was ambushed in the lot.  
This came out in testimony.  

There are other mitigating factors and it wasn’t cut and dried which is why it took weeks of trial, testimony, and days for the jury to consider and reach a verdict.  

I did check, and some others. The owners of the dealership said themselves that they did not ask Kyle to come and protect: https://www.fox6now.com/news/kyle-rittenhouse-trial-car-dealership-march

[Didacus]

12 hours ago, rachael said:

My personal (and I guess, my own logical) issues with it come from the fact with Kyle came from another to defend a property that wasn't even his. Why? Was he seeking out a fight? He is not a police officer, and I am not defending the protestor's/rioter's actions against him. The protestors were OK to be there (again, not defending the rioters). Really, what the hell was he doing there with a gun? It does not add up. But, I can see where you're coming from.

Would you apply the same logic to the protesters amd rioters who are bised from town to town?

2 hours ago, rachael said:

Fair, but was he entitled to actually serve?

I did check, and some others. The owners of the dealership said themselves that they did not ask Kyle to come and protect: https://www.fox6now.com/news/kyle-rittenhouse-trial-car-dealership-march

Did the owners ask for the rioters and looters to burn his cars in the previous riot?

[Anomaly]

3 hours ago, rachael said:

Fair, but was he entitled to actually serve?

I did check, and some others. The owners of the dealership said themselves that they did not ask Kyle to come and protect: https://www.fox6now.com/news/kyle-rittenhouse-trial-car-dealership-march

Maybe I’m wrong, then.  It’s an excellent point to consider Kyle’s motivation to be there.  
Surely motivation was presented by the prosecutors and defenders with sworn testimonies and evidence for 12 jurors to discuss and consider.   
Whom do you think is most likely are going to get it right? Anomaly or rachael surfing for profit news source, or jurors with hours of witnessing actual  testimony and deriving a unanimous decision?

[Luigi]

Why is all the focus on Kyle Rittenhouse's motivation? If motivation is worth considering in regard to Rittenhouse, then it's also worth considering in regard to the three rioters. Were they natives of Kenosha, or did they drive in from out of town for some impromptu street fun? Why did the one guy - the survivor - bring a gun to a "social justice protest"? Why did three guys attack Rittenhouse, when everybody knows that a fair fight is one-on-one? 

Personally, I haven't gone to any of the riots in my town - and there have been plenty - either to smash windows, steal other people's merchandise, burn businesses, or to stop people from doing all of the above. So I don't support Rittenhouse in going, and - equally - I don't support the rioters in going. On the other hand, I don't blame Rittenhouse, not even a little bit, for defending himself in a three-against-one fight when he was on the losing end. You beat the living hell out of me with your skateboard and threaten me with your gun, then you deserve anything you get in return. 

[Didacus]

For the safety of all, skateboards should be banned.

[Mercedes]

17 hours ago, Norseman82 said:

 

Well, he was in a police explorer program and was wearing some gear issued to him by the program, so I'm not sure that is 100% correct.

 

Was the gear he wore sufficient enough to let people know he was a legitimate law enforcer?  If I saw a kid who looked like a 12 year old, with a gun, I would assume a dangerous situation and prefer to see him disarmed before anything bad happened.  The guy with the skateboard thought he was an active shooter.  Even the police responded thinking it was an active shooter situation.  It's insane to me ( non American) that this kid and his actions were legitimised through the court system.  

[Vernon]

32 minutes ago, Mercedes said:

Was the gear he wore sufficient enough to let people know he was a legitimate law enforcer?  If I saw a kid who looked like a 12 year old, with a gun, I would assume a dangerous situation and prefer to see him disarmed before anything bad happened.  The guy with the skateboard thought he was an active shooter.  Even the police responded thinking it was an active shooter situation.  It's insane to me ( non American) that this kid and his actions were legitimised through the court system.  

Yep, in the US if someone tries to kill you you're allowed to defend yourself. He was in the process of running away when assaulted with a skateboard. I think you should be more concerned that corrupt Marxist/Democrat leaders allow rioting to go unchecked. All this could have been avoided.

[Mercedes]

53 minutes ago, Vernon said:

Yep, in the US if someone tries to kill you you're allowed to defend yourself. He was in the process of running away when assaulted with a skateboard. I think you should be more concerned that corrupt Marxist/Democrat leaders allow rioting to go unchecked. All this could have been avoided.

Like the British tried to do which resulted in revolutionary war of independence?  Injustice can sometimes only be addressed by revolution otherwise you are being hypocritical.

[Vernon]

59 minutes ago, Mercedes said:

Like the British tried to do which resulted in revolutionary war of independence?  Injustice can sometimes only be addressed by revolution otherwise you are being hypocritical.

I'm old but the Revolutionary War was before my time. So you think the rioters are on the side of Justice? If so, then with what are they going to replace what we have? Whatever it is, it won't be Christian-friendly. 

[Didacus]

10 hours ago, Vernon said:

I'm old but the Revolutionary War was before my time. So you think the rioters are on the side of Justice? If so, then with what are they going to replace what we have? Whatever it is, it won't be Christian-friendly. 

I was told by a friend who is sympathetic to BLM and antifa, that i should not worry about my christian status because if they take over, the 'good' christians will be left alone.

And no... that is NOT a joke.  True story.

 

 

Sad world we live in;

Skateboarders live in fear

Edited November 26, 2021 by Didacus

[Mercedes]

23 hours ago, Vernon said:

I'm old but the Revolutionary War was before my time. So you think the rioters are on the side of Justice? If so, then with what are they going to replace what we have? Whatever it is, it won't be Christian-friendly. 

Why couldn't a reform be Christian friendly?  What the US desperately needs is an authoritative national body of independent oversight.  Not politicians investigating politicians but citizen representatives serving as overseers.  Bodies that are duty bound to expose ethical abuses in non prejudicial and non partisan ways.

There is systemic racial injustice recognised by every moral authority in the world from Christianity to secular ethics bodies and international human rights bodies.  A government that is basically self referential isn't going to resolve any of the problems that are causing so much violence and hatred.

 

[Vernon]

They are not out to "reform" anything. It is a power grab using race as an excuse.

We have enough good people in our country to be a cause for just reform. I'm hoping and praying that begins on December 1 in the Supreme Court.

I think you might think about the things your own country needs to reform. I don't think you'd want a delegation of reforms to come from the US to do that work for you, as if they were morally superior. Do you as we do in the US kill your inconvenient unborn babies?