Abstaining from meat on Friday

[PadrePio]

Can we have meat on Fridays if we are abstaining from meat on other days, say 2 other days in a week

[truthfinder]

Depends where you are and what your bishops’ conference has decided. At a minimum, you must do some sort of penance on Friday. In the UK, for example, the bishops reinstituted meatless Friday’s. What you do on other days of the week doesn’t really matter. 

[Peace]

1 hour ago, truthfinder said:

Depends where you are and what your bishops’ conference has decided. At a minimum, you must do some sort of penance on Friday. In the UK, for example, the bishops reinstituted meatless Friday’s. What you do on other days of the week doesn’t really matter. 

I'm not sure if there is a Friday penance obligation that's strictly in force in the USA, although many people say that or seem to think that. I think we are encouraged by our bishops to do a Friday penance, but when I look at the document I have trouble finding anything that indicates that we "must" do a Friday penance in the USA. From what I understand the US bishops were given an option to substitute abstinence with another form of penance, but the bishops never actually did so. They only encouraged the faithful in the US in the US to do a penance on Friday (meat or otherwise), without strictly requiring them to do so. That's how I read the document at least.

But that being said, if there is a Friday obligation in the USA, I'd agree with you that you can't swap another day for it.

https://www.usccb.org/prayer-and-worship/liturgical-year-and-calendar/lent/us-bishops-pastoral-statement-on-penance-and-abstinence

[truthfinder]

44 minutes ago, Peace said:

I'm not sure if there is a Friday penance obligation that's strictly in force in the USA, although many people say that or seem to think that. I think we are encouraged by our bishops to do a Friday penance, but when I look at the document I have trouble finding anything that indicates that we "must" do a Friday penance in the USA. From what I understand the US bishops were given an option to substitute abstinence with another form of penance, but the bishops never actually did so. They only encouraged the faithful in the US in the US to do a penance on Friday (meat or otherwise), without strictly requiring them to do so. That's how I read the document at least.

But that being said, if there is a Friday obligation in the USA, I'd agree with you that you can't swap another day for it.

https://www.usccb.org/prayer-and-worship/liturgical-year-and-calendar/lent/us-bishops-pastoral-statement-on-penance-and-abstinence

Thanks, Peace, for digging up the USCCB file.  Not being in the US, I was not familiar with it.  I'd agree with your interpretation.  Especially paragraphs 21-24, with the last stating that the law of abstinence (binding under sin) had been removed, but that they hoped that the traditional Friday abstinence would remain a practice. (Although now I'm seeing that this document was published in 1966 - has there been no other document since then?)

[chrysostom]

10 hours ago, PadrePio said:

Can we have meat on Fridays if we are abstaining from meat on other days, say 2 other days in a week

As mentioned above, if Friday abstinence is required where you are, you can't substitute with another day.

If in the United States, it's completely up to you anyway so yes you can in any case.

Where positively required, the letter of the law counts. Where not required, devise any system you like.

[Peace]

28 minutes ago, truthfinder said:

Thanks, Peace, for digging up the USCCB file.  Not being in the US, I was not familiar with it.  I'd agree with your interpretation.  Especially paragraphs 21-24, with the last stating that the law of abstinence (binding under sin) had been removed, but that they hoped that the traditional Friday abstinence would remain a practice. (Although now I'm seeing that this document was published in 1966 - has there been no other document since then?)

There could be, but I'm not aware of one. But yeah a lot of folks seem to think that there is a strict Friday penance here, even some priests I've talked to, so I'm not 100% certain that there isn't one in effect.

I try to do something myself, but I'm not super strict about it if I miss.

[Lady Grey, Hot]

This isn't totally related, but what exactly are the parameters for an acceptable substitute penance? Does it have to be giving something up, or could you, for example, add a substantial period of prayer (maybe the Stations of the Cross) in addition to what you would do any other day of the week?

[chrysostom]

23 minutes ago, Lady Grey, Hot said:

This isn't totally related, but what exactly are the parameters for an acceptable substitute penance? Does it have to be giving something up, or could you, for example, add a substantial period of prayer (maybe the Stations of the Cross) in addition to what you would do any other day of the week?

As far as I know (someone correct me if I'm wrong) in the USA there are no specific requirements for penance, period - just a strong encouragement. In this case, then, it would be entirely up to you, and you would not sin even if you did nothing at all.

Edited November 7, 2021 by chrysostom

[PadrePio]

In some parts of the world (eg: kerala, india which is the home to Syro Malabar Catholic church , an Eastern rite) the devotees often abstain not only from meat, but also from fish and egg as well (During lent season), where as in some other parts of the world there is only requirement to give up meat..

[truthfinder]

12 hours ago, Lady Grey, Hot said:

This isn't totally related, but what exactly are the parameters for an acceptable substitute penance? Does it have to be giving something up, or could you, for example, add a substantial period of prayer (maybe the Stations of the Cross) in addition to what you would do any other day of the week?

Paragraphs 25-27 might be helpful in that document that Peace posted. 
But, again, if you’re elsewhere or part of a different rite, different rules might apply.