Ice_nine Posted October 17, 2021 Share Posted October 17, 2021 On 9/23/2021 at 8:28 AM, Peace said: Come now. I've admitted when I've been wrong on this forum numerous times. This ain't one of them. POIDH Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrysostom Posted October 17, 2021 Share Posted October 17, 2021 (edited) Catholic philosopher Edward Feser on this topic. Quote Serial killer Jeffrey Dahmer was murdered in prison almost thirty years ago. Suppose that, before his body was removed from the crime scene, a prison guard had clipped off some of his fingernails as a ghoulish souvenir. Suppose further that this guard dabbled in genetics and cloning as a hobby. And suppose he somehow figured out a way to make exact copies of the fingernails, so that he could sell them on eBay to people interested in serial killer memorabilia. Now suppose that almost thirty years later, you develop a novel nail clipper design. You work up a prototype and test it – using one of the cloned Dahmer fingernails as your test material. They work great, and you go on to manufacture and market the clippers. Suppose they are so successful that all the other nail clipper manufacturers go out of business. If people want to clip their nails, they need to buy your product. If people buy these nail clippers, would they be doing something immoral? Would they somehow be cooperating in the evil of murdering Dahmer? Would they be contributing to a “culture of prison murder”? Are your nail clippers now forever morally tainted by virtue of the fact that you first tested them on cloned Dahmer nail clippings? Should you destroy your stock of clippers, burn the blueprints, and try to forget the design? Are people morally obligated to walk around with long fingernails and toenails rather than buy your clippers, since they have no alternative products to buy? https://edwardfeser.blogspot.com/2021/10/covid-19-vaccines-and-jeffrey-dahmers.html?m=1&fbclid=IwAR0BBZ-kSM18EUTWRsc_-KJA1bzO8InUR-ZciAeDeleEFgUt9jcKZRflBwo#more I like his take. Edited October 17, 2021 by chrysostom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mercedes Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 On 10/17/2021 at 2:25 PM, chrysostom said: Catholic philosopher Edward Feser on this topic. https://edwardfeser.blogspot.com/2021/10/covid-19-vaccines-and-jeffrey-dahmers.html?m=1&fbclid=IwAR0BBZ-kSM18EUTWRsc_-KJA1bzO8InUR-ZciAeDeleEFgUt9jcKZRflBwo#more I like his take. By that logic, because America made so much wealth off slavery, it's immoral to continue to reap those benefits today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peace Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 12 hours ago, Mercedes said: By that logic, because America made so much wealth off slavery, it's immoral to continue to reap those benefits today. Oh but it is Merecedes. It is! All anti-vaxxers should Venmo any excess savings to Peace immediately as reparations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrysostom Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 12 hours ago, Mercedes said: By that logic, because America made so much wealth off slavery, it's immoral to continue to reap those benefits today. This article's argument is that these vaccines are not immoral for a Catholic to take. It supports Vatican guidance on the issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MIKolbe Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 you people are whack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rachael Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 20 minutes ago, MIKolbe said: you people are whack. true. i've had it since march. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrysostom Posted October 20, 2021 Share Posted October 20, 2021 6 hours ago, MIKolbe said: you people are whack. Can't deny it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dominicansoul Posted October 21, 2021 Share Posted October 21, 2021 I prayed about it and received the Pfizer vaccine. I'm also going to hook up with a doctor who gives out human grade ivermectin for a prophylactic. I probably won't take it unless I come down with the virus... but it would be good for me to have a stash saved somewhere... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rosamundi Posted October 21, 2021 Share Posted October 21, 2021 2 hours ago, dominicansoul said: I prayed about it and received the Pfizer vaccine. I'm also going to hook up with a doctor who gives out human grade ivermectin for a prophylactic. I probably won't take it unless I come down with the virus... but it would be good for me to have a stash saved somewhere... Ivermectin is an antiparasitic and has no effect on viruses. Merck (the pharma company which discovered it) say there is no basis for it to work, no evidence that it works, and there's a lack of safety data in the studies about it possibly working. If it did work, Merck would be shouting it from the rooftops as they own the patent and they don't have a vaccine in trial, but instead, they're saying "it doesn't work and you might die." TL;DR don't take antiparasitics for a viral infection. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dominicansoul Posted October 21, 2021 Share Posted October 21, 2021 55 minutes ago, rosamundi said: Ivermectin is an antiparasitic and has no effect on viruses. Merck (the pharma company which discovered it) say there is no basis for it to work, no evidence that it works, and there's a lack of safety data in the studies about it possibly working. If it did work, Merck would be shouting it from the rooftops as they own the patent and they don't have a vaccine in trial, but instead, they're saying "it doesn't work and you might die." TL;DR don't take antiparasitics for a viral infection. Well, a well-established medical clinic near me, that has been treating Covid patients for the last year and a half, is prescribing it as a prophylactic, and I know of some cases where people were really really really really sick with covid have taken it and were better in a few days with dosage monitored by doctors. Anecdotal of course, but maybe there is something to it? I don't know the Merck details you know, but I think I'll trust the doctors here who are prescribing it... Lots of my friends are on it in combination with other alternative medicines and supplements. Ivermectin is an anti-parasite, but it helps lower inflammation and some studies DO show it interferes with the way the virus is transported from cell to cell... (I'm speaking of the human grade Ivermectin, not what your pony takes for worms). I don't quite understand the mocking and the derision when it comes to alternative medications... If by chance you are lucky to be near doctors who are willing to try it out and monitor your dosage, I would give it a shot... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rosamundi Posted October 22, 2021 Share Posted October 22, 2021 19 hours ago, dominicansoul said: I don't quite understand the mocking and the derision when it comes to alternative medications... If by chance you are lucky to be near doctors who are willing to try it out and monitor your dosage, I would give it a shot... I'm not mocking or deriding, and I'm sorry if I cam across that way. All I'm saying is that the company which discovered ivermectin and holds the patent (and would benefit significantly if ivermectin was a cure for Covid) are saying that there is no evidence that it works, that there are significant safety gaps in the trials that have been done, and that the mechanism by which it works isn't a mechanism that works on viruses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dominicansoul Posted October 22, 2021 Share Posted October 22, 2021 I find it interesting that Merck is "developing" a pill to fight covid. Perhaps they are remarketing ivermectin as a "new" drug... just not calling it ivermectin because this one comes with a HUGE price tag... Or it could be they downplay cheap ivermectin in order to boost the sales of this new wonder drug... https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/oct/14/merck-drug-prices-us-healthcare-big-pharma 46 minutes ago, rosamundi said: I'm not mocking or deriding, and I'm sorry if I cam across that way. All I'm saying is that the company which discovered ivermectin and holds the patent (and would benefit significantly if ivermectin was a cure for Covid) are saying that there is no evidence that it works, that there are significant safety gaps in the trials that have been done, and that the mechanism by which it works isn't a mechanism that works on viruses. Oh I wasn't accusing you of mocking or deriding, I meant in general... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nunsuch Posted October 22, 2021 Share Posted October 22, 2021 7 hours ago, dominicansoul said: I find it interesting that Merck is "developing" a pill to fight covid. Perhaps they are remarketing ivermectin as a "new" drug... just not calling it ivermectin because this one comes with a HUGE price tag... Or it could be they downplay cheap ivermectin in order to boost the sales of this new wonder drug... https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/oct/14/merck-drug-prices-us-healthcare-big-pharma Oh I wasn't accusing you of mocking or deriding, I meant in general... You do realize, don't you, that a drug company can't simply seek approval of an old drug under a new name--there are actual tests, documentation, etc., that go into a very rigorous approval process and these mechanisms are explicitly intended to uncover fraud. Full disclosure: my cousin used to be head of research at Merck. His accounts of the processes and standards are far removed from the imagined conspiracy you seem to be suggesting here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Totally Franciscan Posted October 23, 2021 Share Posted October 23, 2021 When the virus hit India, hospitals and doctors realized that it was impossible to care for the millions of people of India, so they gave every person a supply of Ivermectin and saved so many lives. From my experience with my doctor and my research, the powers that be want you to take the "vaccine" and not something that will cure the virus easily and cheaply. One wonders why this attitude. Well, just follow the money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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