Can Someone Interpret

[Quietfire]

Douay-Rheim
Revelations Chapter 1
v.4 John to the seven churches which are in Asia. Grace be unto you and peace, from him that is and that was and that is to come: and from the seven spirits which are before his throne:


What or who are the seven spirits before the throne? I have an idea but would rather hear what others say on this.

Also, it is my understanding that the seven golden candlesticks are the seven churches, is that correct? (Rev 1:v12)

Thanks.

Peace :peace:

[Guest JeffCR07]

The seven spirits before the throne could be the Archangels, traditionally they are numbered as (not counting Lucifer) seven. It could also be the "spirit" of those seven Churches, that is, the collective souls of those saints who came from the churches, interceeding on their behalf.

In no way is this an authoritative interpretation, rather, I would advise you turn to a more respectable source than I, and to be careful when reading Revelation, it is easily the most difficult book of the bible, and I find that many go into it with a preconceived notion of what they want it to tell them, and, as a result, twist its words towards that end. Please pray hard, meditate on the book, speak with a spiritual director or another faith advisor, and remain open to the Spirit.


- Your Brother in Christ, Jeff

[cmotherofpirl]

I thought it referred to the specific guardian angel of each of the seven churches.

I just ordered the Scripture study of revelations I will let you know if it says anything different.

[Quietfire]

Rev 1:v20 The mystery of the seven stars, which thou sawest in my right hand and the seven golden candlesticks. The seven stars are the angels of the seven churches. And the seven candlesticks are the seven churches


The seven stars are the seven guardian angels.
But I am curious what your study says.
Thanks.

Peace.

[Jake Huether]

Could it be the Seven Sacraments? Or am I missing the mark? It is the Seven Sacraments that give us Grace. And St. John writes, "Grace be unto you... from the seven spirits which are before his throne:"

[Quietfire]

Ok, now that I have a moment. This wasnt a test or anything. I just wanted to know what everyone thought of that particular line.

It is my understanding after listening to my sister, that she is incorrect in her assumption that, "there are seven spirits of God, not three people." (her words exactly)

I immediately saw her error, but did not correct her. (will not get into the 'why not' right now)

Yes there are seven spirits, but not 'seven spirits of God' in that particular verse.
First it states "seven spirits [B]before the throne" not seven spirits of God.

Second, it isnt three people, it is three persons in one devine nature.

Third, "And the spirit of the Lord shall rest upon him: the spirit of wisdom and of understanding, the spirit of counsel and of fortitude, the spirit of knowledge and of piety. And the spirit of fear of the Lord." (Isaias 11:v2)

I understand these as gifts of the Holy Spirit.

Peace.

Edited July 9, 2004 by Quietfire

[phatcatholic]

Quietfire,

i bought another copy of the Navarre Commentary on Revelations b/c i couldn't find my other one and i was tired of not having it. i haven't forgotten about ur questions concerning chapter 1, and i'm glad i can now finally respond.


[b]Rev 1:4[/b] [i]John to the seven churches that are in Asia: Grace to you and peace from him whi is and who was and who is to come, and from the seven spirits who are before his throne,[/i][list]
[*][b]4. [/b]Even though there were other churches in Asia Minor, John addresses only seven, a number which stands for "totality," as an early ecclesiastical writer, Primasius, explains. "He writes to the seven churches, that is, to the one and only Church symbolized by these seven" (Commentariorum super apoc., 1,1).

Grace and peace are the outstanding gifts of the messianic era (cf. Rom 1:7). This form of salutation embodies the normal forms of greeting used by Greeks (jaire, grace) and Jews (shalom, peace); but here the words mean the grace, forgiveness and peace extended to men by th4e redemptive action of Jesus Christ. Thus, St John is wishing these gifts on behalf of GOd, the seven spirits and Jesus Christ.

The description of God as he "who is and who was and who is to come" is an elaboration of the name of "Yahweh" ("I AM WHO I AM") which was revealed to Moses (cf. Ex 3:14), and underlines the fact that God is the Lord of history, of the past, the present and the future, and that he is at all times acting to effect salvation.

The "seven spirits" stand for God's power and omniscience and intervention in the events of history. In Zechariah 4:10 divine power is symbolized by the seven "eyes of the Lord, which range the whole earth." Further on in the Apocalypse (5:6), St John tells us that the seven spirits of God sent out into all the earth are the seven eyes of the Lamb, that is, Christ. This symbolism (also found in the Old Testament: cf. Is 11:2ff) is used to show that God the Father acts through his Spirit and that this Spirit has been communicated to Christ and by him to mankind. So, when St John wishes grace and peace from the seven spirits of God it is the same as saying, "from the Holy Spirit", who is sent to the Church after the death and resurrection of Christ. Patristic tradition has in fact interpreted the seven spirits as meaning the septiform Spirit with his seven gifts as described in Isaiah 11:1-2 in St. Jerome's translation, the Vulgate.
[/list]
[b]Rev 1:12-16 [/b][i]Then I turned to see the voice that was speaking to me, and on turning I saw seven golden lampstands, and in the midst of the lampstands one like a son of man, clothed with a long robe and with a golden girdle round his breast; his head and hi hair were white as white wool, white as snow, his eyes were like a flame of fire, his feet were like burnished bronze, refined as in a furnace, and his voice was like the sound of many waters; in his right hand he held seven stars, from his mouth issued a sharp two-edged sword, and his face was like the sun shining in full strength[/i][list]
[*][b]12-16.[/b] The lampstands in this first visionsymbolize the churches at prayer; they remind us of the seven-branched candlestick (the menorah) which used to burn in the temple of Jerusalem and which is described in detail in Exodus 25:31-40. In the midst of the candlestick, as if guarding and governing the churches, a mysterious figure appears, in the form of a man. The expression "son of man" originates in Daniel 7:14 where, as here, it refers to someone depicgted as Judge at the end of time. The various symbols used indicatte his importance. His "long robe" shows his priesthood (cf. Ex 28:4; Zech 3:4); the golden girdle, his kingship (cf. 1 Mac 10:89); his white hair, his eternity (cf. Dan 7:9); his eyes "like flam of fire" symbolize hi divine wisdom (cf. Rev. 2:23), and his bronze feet his strength and stability.

The seven stars stand for the angels of the seven churches (cf. v. 20), and our Lord's holding them in his hand is a sign of his power and providence. Finally, the splendour of his face recalls the Old Testament theophanies or apparitions, and the sword coming from his mouth shows the power of his word (cf. Heb 4:12).

It is interesting to note that our Lord used the title "son of man" to refer to himself (cf., e.g., Mt 9:6; Mk 10:45; Lk 6:22); it is always used in St John's Gospel to indicate Christ's divinity and transcendence (cf., e.g., Jn 1:51; 3:14; 9:35; 12:23).

"Burnished bronze": Latin versions transliterate the original as "orichalc", a shining alloy of bronze and gold.
[/list]
i apologize for any spelling mistakes. i typed it all out myself. i hope it helps.

pax christi,
phatcatholic

[MorphRC]

Cool. Thx Phat. You saved me a task

[StColette]

hehe I saved this, i've wondered about this as well

[MorphRC]

Navarre and NJBC are the best.