Discerning but afraid of unhealthy orders

[JHFamily]

11 hours ago, Agatha said:

There are a few Communities that are good and where the Sisters have the vocation but very few.

Oh, wow, I can't believe all the negative experiences that you have been privy to hear.  This sentence makes me assume that you believe that this is the norm and not the exception. I like to think it's the other way around.

I was in four communities (which included a transfer because of my health), and I did not find any of the four to be abusive in any shape or form. As a matter of fact, I would say that they were a little too careful because they didn't want to enter or appear to enter into this category. My daughter is in religious life, and I don't see any signs there, either. The sisters all seem quite natural, happy, and at ease, and they seem to feel free to speak to us at will.

That being said, I have heard a handful of horror (some of which don't really rise to horrible) stories. One, I'm not so sure of because the teller of the story always plays the victim, and I know that she takes things out of context or blows them out of proportion. Therefore, I don't lend credence to her story.  But on the whole, the stories are hear that are positive are far greater in number than the negative ones. 

I think a healthy person can identify unhealthy communities pretty quickly and high tail it out of there. Someone who has a history of mental health problems may need to be quite a bit more careful.

 

[Agatha]

Well, it is sad, but true!!  One of my friends told  me that she heard the Sister in charge say I am going to make Sister...... life miserable because she is happy.

When she told the superior the superior says that she was not going to kick out the sister because she has a disease. My friend said I don't want you to kick her out just talk to her and the superior did not do that.

I have also talk to young women that say that when the Community does not want you anymore, they do not tell you in a nice way. 

Even my brother has told me that he has met women that have a vocation and go to a religious Community and they have to leave because the situation is so bad and they are unable to handle it.  He told me that he has met many that after they leave that community they do not even want to search for another one.

There are good Communities out there I just have not ran across many.

The devil is working hard especially in religious life. Also, in the families and in my opinion all vocations.  So, sometimes people are not able to see the situation right away. But some leave and others just stay there. 

I have found out that most of the times it also has to do if the Sister had a good childhood and a stable family. Some people have some people have not, but that has to do with what is happening. Especially, if the mother superior did not have a good childhood or youth and she is the foundress of the Community sometimes women that have had a dysfunctional family seem to go to that type of Community, so when a woman that had a good childhood and a good stable family doesn't feel comfortable with what is  going on. Sometimes in religious life you don't get to know some of the important things that are going on so like my friend told me it is hard to figure out what is going on. 

But when you do and you figure that there is nothing you can do to change the situation you want out! Well, some do others don't and stay.

We should pray for vocations to the religious life, but also for the Communities to really be living in Faith, Hope, and Charity and in mutual respect.

Maybe you should recommend your daughter's Community for the women that are discerning and want a healthy and loving Community. This actually gives me hope!!

 

I hope that your daughter continues to be happy in her community. It must be one of the good Communities so what a blessing for you and her.

I believe the stories that my friend has told me because I know her since she we were both 13 so we have know each other for most of our lives and I know her very well. She is like my Sister! so I know her well and I did meet another woman that was in her Community and told me the same thing that my friend did.

Prayers for you and your daughter! what a blessing that she found a good order!!

Prayer for you, your daughter and the Community

Agatha

 

 

[Agatha]

I would also like to add that not too long ago my mom told me about a radio show where they talked about religious Communities and what is going on.

They talked about how the Communities are being abusive and authoritative.

And also a psychologist that used to come out in the radio once said you don't know how many religious Communities come to me because they are having so many issues and the abuse of power that is going on. He did not go much into it because of confidentiality but he said  that he had also had women who are not in a religious Community anymore come to him and tell him the exact same things that the Sisters that he is helping out tell him.

[Agatha]

I would also like to add that I am glad that you did not have abuse in any of your Communities. I am also glad that your daughter is not going through abuse either. That is the way it should be!!

Praise God for that!!

Do recommend your Communities for the ones that are discerning or would want to go back to religious life.

Agatha

[Nunsuch]

I think learning about religious life primarily from those who left under unhappy circumstances is a little bit like learning about marriage primarily from those who went through unhappy divorces. Most communities *are* healthy. I think there may be a higher proportion of unfortunate situations in relatively new congregations *IF* they were started without sufficient care or preparation, particularly among those in leadership. I also think there may be some who may (incorrectly!) equate "tradition" with rigidity or excessive authority from those in charge.  Of course, this is NOT meant to describe all more traditional communities.

Most of the congregations I know do not have "mothers" in charge, but instead have leadership teams who work WITH their members in more collaborative and consensual ways. This is particularly effective in dealing with groups where most of the members are themselves highly educated and spiritually mature. 

 

[Agatha]

Yes, I agree that many mother superiors do not have good religious preparation, especially if they are the foundresses sometimes they do not go through postulancy and the other stages of formation.

Then, when, the new Sisters move up in the Community, they do not have good preparation either.  That might be part of the cause of  why some Communities are unhealthy. 

I also agree that the people in charge need to be spiritually mature. That is also very important in the Community being healthy.  Because if they put people in charge that are not spiritually mature that is probably where the problems start and that is probably why they do not get  solved.  They also need to be psychologically heathy. And act in a mature and charitable way.

[FutOSBSis]

On 1/25/2021 at 1:21 PM, Agatha said:

I would also like to add that not too long ago my mom told me about a radio show where they talked about religious Communities and what is going on.

They talked about how the Communities are being abusive and authoritative.

And also a psychologist that used to come out in the radio once said you don't know how many religious Communities come to me because they are having so many issues and the abuse of power that is going on. He did not go much into it because of confidentiality but he said  that he had also had women who are not in a religious Community anymore come to him and tell him the exact same things that the Sisters that he is helping out tell him.

Here is a website that shares some of the testimonies of women who have experienced such when they were in the convent. It's a blog started by a young woman who endured what you mentioned above and wanted to create awareness.

https://conventreform.wordpress.com/

[Agatha]

Thank you so much!!

God bless

[gloriana35]

I hope this does not sound condescending, but I'd be extremely careful about assuming a condition is common because of a radio programme. Not that those who participated are lying - there indeed are occasions where there are abuses in religious life - but 'mis list' about church organisations is a big draw in publications, media, and so forth today. 

 

[Agatha]

yes! I know it's sad isn't it? but it is the truth!!

 

[Agatha]

Unfortunately that type of abuse is going on in many Communities. 

Many women that enter religious life do not have the vocation and are not spiritually mature and they  act like high school girls when they are grown women. Some Communities take women that have had criminal records and are excepted into the Community. So that also has to do with what is going on,  That is why when women that have the vocation enter, they are not expecting this situation at all. Many of them come from loving and stable families that is why when they realize what is going on and they leave, some of them are traumatized. (some of them before they leave, like the girl I was telling you about)

There is not supposed to be any type of abuse in religious Communities. It is suppose to be a place where you pray together and for one another. The superior is to be a mother figure. A loving and supporting figure in your life, and so are the Sisters in charge. The mother superior is suppose to bring you closer to God not further from Him. A religious Community should be a place where you help each other become holy. It is supposed to be a loving family,

where you are safe and happy.

My friend is doing better, but she is still has some anxiety when she thinks about things that happened in that Community. ( but she is doing much better)

You should have seen her when she came back.

Please pray for her!

Pax

 

[Agatha]

Well, some women have gone through abuse in religious communities. In the radio show it was not the women talking about abuse in religious life.  It was about information that they have because of investigations.  It is sad that women have to go through abuse like in my friend's case. I have seen her suffer about this and I have seen other women suffer about the abuse they suffered as well, so, I do not think that they are lying. 

The psychologist, I'm sure was not lying either! 

I have seen a young women go back home all traumatized because of all the abuse she went through! It is sad!! 

P

When women have told me about the abuse they have suffered, I can see that they are being honest and a lot of hurt in their eyes. I can't imagine someone living in a healthy religious Community and lying about it. If they live in a religious Community where they are treated with kindness, dignity and respect, then I'm sure that they are enjoying that and thanking God for that blessing.

Please pray for women that want to be a religious Sister to answer God's call,

to find a good and healthy religious Community, So she and the Community can help one another become Saints!!

Pax