Struggling with NFP

[Catholicmom97]

Hello! I'll try make this as short as I can without going into too much detail, but my husband and I are practicing Catholics, been married a little over 4 years. We have 3 babies, a 3y/o, a 2y/o and an 8 month old. Our 8 month old had some complications and without going into detail he was in the hospital from birth for 5 months, is currently on a feeding tube and has a lot of drs appointments monthly. So as you probably guessed were definitely not ready for another. All of our kids were unplanned, after my first, we got serious about NFP, charting, tracking, all that stuff. And as you probably guessed, it hasn't worked. We've been super careful, constantly struggling with it and as hard as we try to stick to NFP, some days we would "contracept", go to confession, and start over again. But it seems that every time I stay true to NFP, it fails. And we end up pregnant. Ive spoken to our priests about it, and basically his only advice is abstain until were ready for kids again.... Okay... but how do you abstain from your spouce who you love with all your being till your ready for more kids?? (Which will be Probably years for us...) 

I guess I'm just venting here, but its caused a lot of depression for me having 3 babies on top of each other, I'm very young and I honestly am not good at this. not good at handling the stress of being a mom, and taking care of my babies especially a child who needs a lot of special care, giving attention to my husband and just trying to enjoy life at the same time. 

The reason im venting is because i think I may be pregnant again. Its too early to test for now, and I'm so upset with everything. I don't know how NFP is supposed to " bring couples closer together" I honestly feel like its punishment. Ive tried so hard to track and figure it out, and ive tried to do the right thing by not contracepting, avoiding fertile days, rejecting my husband, only to end up pregnant again.

Im literally 23 years old, hanging on by a thread taking care of three other BABIES. Adding another one I don't know what I'd do. I'm so depressed I don't know what God wants from me. I try to pray when I get a minute of peace. We go to mass every Sunday, every holy day, I try to just do Gods will, and I feel like nothing I do matters or even makes a difference. 

I'm really just looking for some type of advice or encouragement I dont know what to do anymore.

[HumilityAndPatience]

Sorry to hear of your pain Sister. It is difficult, but in circumstances like these, where you are struggling, abstinence is the only remaining option. You must offer your suffering to Christ. Of course- consummation of marriage is perfection of the created order/procreation. But as we know, abstinence too is beautiful.

In your circumstance, you would benefit from abstinence both practically and perhaps spiritually- your spouse and you might be moved to a deeper spousal bond, indeed.

[Lilllabettt]

9 hours ago, Catholicmom97 said:

Hello! I'll try make this as short as I can without going into too much detail, but my husband and I are practicing Catholics, been married a little over 4 years. We have 3 babies, a 3y/o, a 2y/o and an 8 month old. Our 8 month old had some complications and without going into detail he was in the hospital from birth for 5 months, is currently on a feeding tube and has a lot of drs appointments monthly. So as you probably guessed were definitely not ready for another. All of our kids were unplanned, after my first, we got serious about NFP, charting, tracking, all that stuff. And as you probably guessed, it hasn't worked. We've been super careful, constantly struggling with it and as hard as we try to stick to NFP, some days we would "contracept", go to confession, and start over again. But it seems that every time I stay true to NFP, it fails. And we end up pregnant. Ive spoken to our priests about it, and basically his only advice is abstain until were ready for kids again.... Okay... but how do you abstain from your spouce who you love with all your being till your ready for more kids?? (Which will be Probably years for us...) 

I guess I'm just venting here, but its caused a lot of depression for me having 3 babies on top of each other, I'm very young and I honestly am not good at this. not good at handling the stress of being a mom, and taking care of my babies especially a child who needs a lot of special care, giving attention to my husband and just trying to enjoy life at the same time. 

The reason im venting is because i think I may be pregnant again. Its too early to test for now, and I'm so upset with everything. I don't know how NFP is supposed to " bring couples closer together" I honestly feel like its punishment. Ive tried so hard to track and figure it out, and ive tried to do the right thing by not contracepting, avoiding fertile days, rejecting my husband, only to end up pregnant again.

Im literally 23 years old, hanging on by a thread taking care of three other BABIES. Adding another one I don't know what I'd do. I'm so depressed I don't know what God wants from me. I try to pray when I get a minute of peace. We go to mass every Sunday, every holy day, I try to just do Gods will, and I feel like nothing I do matters or even makes a difference. 

I'm really just looking for some type of advice or encouragement I dont know what to do anymore.

Do you have professional help with your practice of NFP? If you don't, that is key for dealing with hyperfertility and/or irregularity. I'm sure we can help you find someone if you don't have this yet.

one red flag I noticed in what you wrote. Your husband should be the one doing your chart, not you. There should be no question in his mind whether it is appropriate to approach you for sex on a given day; it should never be a situation where you are rejecting him. Does he acknowledge that your wellbeing is at stake? Is he on board with nfp being his responsibility as a husband as part of his charge to provide for his wife and kids? 

With 3 small children one ill, you could perhaps write a book advising other busy people how to find time for sex! Seriously though, it is great that even in your overwhelm you make time for intimacy with your spouse. Many people with young families struggle with this aspect and you are succeeding. 

Nfp can bring couples together mostly because of sacrificial love. A husband realizes having another baby at the moment is not good for his wife, a wife realizes another baby would not be best for her children; the two deny their eros love (sexual appetites) out of agape love for the family.

At your age (and assuming your husband is around the same) this is a VERY hard sacrifice to make. There's nothing wrong with you that you find it difficult! Think back to when you were dating and engaged, and how you avoided sex, though you loved each other so. What did you do to enjoy intimacy without slipping over the line?  Perhaps you did not lie down together? Perhaps you did not french kiss? Another thing you and your husband can try, is fasting together. ( Not if you are nursing or pregnant, of course. )

There are also  things that can be done, medically, to help turn down libido. An understanding doctor can prescribe certain medications off-label for this purpose. There are homeopathic remedies as well, but make sure you have a doctors help with them if you are nursing. These things can help if all types of intimacy, eg cuddling, for example, always seems to lead to sex. They can make making the sacrifice a bit easier. 

Please know you are by no means alone in this struggle... I think probably most marriages, Catholic or not, have at least one stretch where abstinence is required for the health of one partner or the entire family. 

BUT if you are pregnant right now--- know that it will be ok! You never know how you can do something like this until you are doing it - and at some point you realize you don't have to do it, just go through it. 

Prayers for you!!!!

[elizabeth09]

Do you have any family/friends that could help you out with anything?  

[Noes Toes]

Lady comp was a big help for charting for us, I am no good with other NFP methods. https://lady-comp.com We invested in one years ago, and have active, thriving children.

[chrysostom]

Prayers for you!!

On 1/2/2021 at 3:02 PM, HumilityAndPatience said:

Sorry to hear of your pain Sister. It is difficult, but in circumstances like these, where you are struggling, abstinence is the only remaining option. You must offer your suffering to Christ. Of course- consummation of marriage is perfection of the created order/procreation. But as we know, abstinence too is beautiful.

In your circumstance, you would benefit from abstinence both practically and perhaps spiritually- your spouse and you might be moved to a deeper spousal bond, indeed.

I know this is well-intentioned, but your advice is worded in absolute terms and I don't think that's the best to phrase this advice - especially how little familiarity we actually have with the person and the circumstances.

Edited January 5, 2021 by chrysostom

[HumilityAndPatience]

20 hours ago, chrysostom said:

Prayers for you!!

I know this is well-intentioned, but your advice is worded in absolute terms and I don't think that's the best to phrase this advice - especially how little familiarity we actually have with the person and the circumstances.

Thanks @chrysostom  I appreciate the heads up. I am conscious of derailing the thread. In my message I am assuming OP has exhausted all obvious practical solutions (getting help with the children etc.) therefore if NFP is not working and the struggle is too much, with three children close in age, abstinence is logical.

Fr Ripperger, not that I know what your thoughts might be on him, has endorsed such an approach (as did the priest in OP). Of course, those of us who are married must be open to life. But sometimes abstinence remains the last resort if we are truly struggling with our cross. And indeed, it can be a beautiful calling, enabling true growth in one's own faith but also in the spousal bond.

[Catholicmom97]

On 1/2/2021 at 4:36 PM, Lilllabettt said:

Do you have professional help with your practice of NFP? If you don't, that is key for dealing with hyperfertility and/or irregularity. I'm sure we can help you find someone if you don't have this yet.

one red flag I noticed in what you wrote. Your husband should be the one doing your chart, not you. There should be no question in his mind whether it is appropriate to approach you for sex on a given day; it should never be a situation where you are rejecting him. Does he acknowledge that your wellbeing is at stake? Is he on board with nfp being his responsibility as a husband as part of his charge to provide for his wife and kids? 

With 3 small children one ill, you could perhaps write a book advising other busy people how to find time for sex! Seriously though, it is great that even in your overwhelm you make time for intimacy with your spouse. Many people with young families struggle with this aspect and you are succeeding. 

Nfp can bring couples together mostly because of sacrificial love. A husband realizes having another baby at the moment is not good for his wife, a wife realizes another baby would not be best for her children; the two deny their eros love (sexual appetites) out of agape love for the family.

At your age (and assuming your husband is around the same) this is a VERY hard sacrifice to make. There's nothing wrong with you that you find it difficult! Think back to when you were dating and engaged, and how you avoided sex, though you loved each other so. What did you do to enjoy intimacy without slipping over the line?  Perhaps you did not lie down together? Perhaps you did not french kiss? Another thing you and your husband can try, is fasting together. ( Not if you are nursing or pregnant, of course. )

There are also  things that can be done, medically, to help turn down libido. An understanding doctor can prescribe certain medications off-label for this purpose. There are homeopathic remedies as well, but make sure you have a doctors help with them if you are nursing. These things can help if all types of intimacy, eg cuddling, for example, always seems to lead to sex. They can make making the sacrifice a bit easier. 

Please know you are by no means alone in this struggle... I think probably most marriages, Catholic or not, have at least one stretch where abstinence is required for the health of one partner or the entire family. 

BUT if you are pregnant right now--- know that it will be ok! You never know how you can do something like this until you are doing it - and at some point you realize you don't have to do it, just go through it. 

Prayers for you!!!!

Sorry for the delayed response! 

No we don't have "professional" help, only apps, temp checks, mucous checks, forums and some doctors advice who aren't necessarily prolife, so they only advise birth control of course.

My husband is very on board, very supportive with the subject, he doesn't force sex or anything but he can sometimes be annoying about it if its been a while. Even though I try to teach him about charting, he's still just a guy and doesn't understand my body the way I do of course, He'll ask about it, but it doesn't really *click* so pretends to understand and we move on haha

I don't feel comfortable with doing anything "medical" to turn down libido, for either of us, I definitely don't think my husband would be either.

Prayers are very much appreciated!

1 hour ago, HumilityAndPatience said:

Thanks @chrysostom  I appreciate the heads up. I am conscious of derailing the thread. In my message I am assuming OP has exhausted all obvious practical solutions (getting help with the children etc.) therefore if NFP is not working and the struggle is too much, with three children close in age, abstinence is logical.

Fr Ripperger, not that I know what your thoughts might be on him, has endorsed such an approach (as did the priest in OP). Of course, those of us who are married must be open to life. But sometimes abstinence remains the last resort if we are truly struggling with our cross. And indeed, it can be a beautiful calling, enabling true growth in one's own faith but also in the spousal bond.

I understand of course abstinence is the only sure way to avoid pregnancy, but it sure is stressful. Easier said than done I guess. Even tho I completely agree, I'm not saying the church is wrong or anything (unpopular opinion here) but it feels like priest's don't understand what its like to avoid your spouse, avoiding physical contact, any thing that might lead to sex, when your physically living with them, sleeping in the same bed

Prayers are appreciated!

[Ash Wednesday]

I agree with Lilllabettt about getting in touch with a professional, such as an NFP teacher or teaching couple that can offer guidance and address very specific situations and needs. Which organization to contact would depend on which method of NFP is being used. This website has a list of cross comparisons and links to various organizations.

https://naturalwomanhood.org/find-a-fam-instructor/

Do you have an offline support system in place, like family and friends that might be able to help with emotional and practical support as well? 

I will definitely be keeping you and your family in my prayers. 

[Catholicmom97]

On 1/4/2021 at 4:11 PM, elizabeth09 said:

Do you have any family/friends that could help you out with anything

My MIL is a big help with the kids but she is a very nervous person and gets overwhelmed easily so I don't feel comfortable asking her for too much help unless she asks to take them (even then she bites off more than she can chew at times, my two older ones are a handful)

3 hours ago, Ash Wednesday said:

I agree with Lilllabettt about getting in touch with a professional, such as an NFP teacher or teaching couple that can offer guidance and address very specific situations and needs. Which organization to contact would depend on which method of NFP is being used. This website has a list of cross comparisons and links to various organizations.

https://naturalwomanhood.org/find-a-fam-instructor/

Do you have an offline support system in place, like family and friends that might be able to help with emotional and practical support as well? 

I will definitely be keeping you and your family in my prayers. 

It would be great but with my hectic life right now its not something I can necessarily sit down and talk with people about, I dont even have time to see a Dr for myself right now. messaging? Sure! Emailing? Fine! Phone calls? Eh Can never talk on the phone for more than a few mins at a time. Also meeting with a couple we dont know and talking about sex and stuff like that is definitely not our thing. We dont even talk about that stuff with our own friends.

I went to the link and took the test, it said the method I was already doing is basically the "best option for me" especially since we dont have extra cash the spend on ovulation strips, an actual digital fertility tracker w

[Guest]

4 hours ago, Catholicmom97 said:

Prayers are very much appreciated!

 

[Catholicmom97]

1 hour ago, Catholicmom97 said:

My MIL is a big help with the kids but she is a very nervous person and gets overwhelmed easily so I don't feel comfortable asking her for too much help unless she asks to take them (even then she bites off more than she can chew at times, my two older ones are a handful)

It would be great but with my hectic life right now its not something I can necessarily sit down and talk with people about, I dont even have time to see a Dr for myself right now. messaging? Sure! Emailing? Fine! Phone calls? Eh Can never talk on the phone for more than a few mins at a time. Also meeting with a couple we dont know and talking about sex and stuff like that is definitely not our thing. We dont even talk about that stuff with our own friends.

I went to the link and took the test, it said the method I was already doing is basically the "best option for me" especially since we dont have extra cash the spend on ovulation strips, an actual digital fertility tracker w

..Sorry my phone turned off before finishing...

We don't have extra cash for a digital fertility tracker which cost a couple hundred for a good one. My cousin actually had a top rated one which  she used religiously and it failed her twice.

Wouldnt it be nice if doctors actually cared to get into detail about your cycle with you and helped you out to track your fertility? My doctors have never really cared about it, and just want to prescribe "the pill" to fix any issues there might be. Maybe it would be easier if NFP was promoted more, insurance covered ovulation strips, fertility thermometers, and trackers rather than contraception

 

4 hours ago, Ash Wednesday said:

Do you have an offline support system in place, like family and friends that might be able to help with emotional and practical support as well? 

I will definitely be keeping you and your family in my prayers. 

I do have family and friends for emotional support, there's just a lot going on in everyone's lives at the moment, so were all pretty far away. My sil is my best friend and were neighbors, so thats a big plus. Again, my MIL does help a lot with the kids, but when it comes to NFP there's not much advice on the topic, plus its not really something I talk about with anyone other than my spouse, sometimes my sister or my SIL, but they know as much about it as I do. My sister also got pregnant doing NFP, my sil is very very irregular so she doesn't bother practicing it

[HumilityAndPatience]

Apologies in advance for being direct- I'm trying my best with limited time- so sorry if this is not delicate. I think the below quote points to a large challenge to overcome here. You are not alone as a couple in this regard- men and women have different physiologies. They are complimentary but markedly different. One large difference is sex drive. This cross than men and women have to carry is a complimentary one- men often wish to procreate often (perform the marital act), and the natural urge of women (which is often less so) tempers this. Your husband must pray for the strength he will need in order to abstain for a relatively short while (in comparison to eternity), whilst you overcome the crippling practicalities- which I too have experienced, for the record! 

On 1/6/2021 at 2:08 AM, Catholicmom97 said:

My husband is very on board, very supportive with the subject, he doesn't force sex or anything but he can sometimes be annoying about it if its been a while.

 

Regarding the below quote, with respect- I completely understand where you are coming from here. However, there is another way of looking at this. At least married couples who must abstain for a while can enjoy the comfort of a chaste spousal bond- deep spiritual love, physical connection without consummation etc. Whereas a priest who has taken vows must abstain from ANY form of intimacy with the opposite sex, which might veer towards him breaking his vows. That includes the loving glances, hugs, holding hands etc. which we married people take for granted.

Indeed, a period of abstinence can fortify a marriage. Imagine (God forbid) one of you were in an accident which renders you disabled, impotent etc. the marital act must then make way/evolve for other greater truths (and a stronger bond) to form... 

Having said all this, this are just my two cents. Prayers for you/me, sister!

On 1/6/2021 at 2:08 AM, Catholicmom97 said:

it feels like priest's don't understand what its like to avoid your spouse, avoiding physical contact, any thing that might lead to sex, when your physically living with them, sleeping in the same bed

 

[ReasonableFaith]

On 1/2/2021 at 4:51 AM, Catholicmom97 said:

Hello! I'll try make this as short as I can without going into too much detail, but my husband and I are practicing Catholics, been married a little over 4 years. We have 3 babies, a 3y/o, a 2y/o and an 8 month old. Our 8 month old had some complications and without going into detail he was in the hospital from birth for 5 months, is currently on a feeding tube and has a lot of drs appointments monthly. So as you probably guessed were definitely not ready for another. All of our kids were unplanned, after my first, we got serious about NFP, charting, tracking, all that stuff. And as you probably guessed, it hasn't worked. We've been super careful, constantly struggling with it and as hard as we try to stick to NFP, some days we would "contracept", go to confession, and start over again. But it seems that every time I stay true to NFP, it fails. And we end up pregnant. Ive spoken to our priests about it, and basically his only advice is abstain until were ready for kids again.... Okay... but how do you abstain from your spouce who you love with all your being till your ready for more kids?? (Which will be Probably years for us...) 

I guess I'm just venting here, but its caused a lot of depression for me having 3 babies on top of each other, I'm very young and I honestly am not good at this. not good at handling the stress of being a mom, and taking care of my babies especially a child who needs a lot of special care, giving attention to my husband and just trying to enjoy life at the same time. 

The reason im venting is because i think I may be pregnant again. Its too early to test for now, and I'm so upset with everything. I don't know how NFP is supposed to " bring couples closer together" I honestly feel like its punishment. Ive tried so hard to track and figure it out, and ive tried to do the right thing by not contracepting, avoiding fertile days, rejecting my husband, only to end up pregnant again.

Im literally 23 years old, hanging on by a thread taking care of three other BABIES. Adding another one I don't know what I'd do. I'm so depressed I don't know what God wants from me. I try to pray when I get a minute of peace. We go to mass every Sunday, every holy day, I try to just do Gods will, and I feel like nothing I do matters or even makes a difference. 

I'm really just looking for some type of advice or encouragement I dont know what to do anymore.

Be assured of prayers for you during your struggles. I hope you find a resource to help you get a better handle on NFP. 
 

You say you are experiencing depression. Depression is not a spiritual issue to be alleviated by sacramental confession or by any advice of a priest. If you are indeed experiencing depressive episodes I highly encourage you to see a medical doctor and/or licensed therapist. 
 

As to priests not understanding the issue surrounding sexual needs between spouses/partners: this is largely true. However, a small minority of priests are married, have been married in the past, or have had significant relationships (including sexual relationships) in their past.  So there are some who may have similar experiences and greater understanding. 

[Catholicmom97]

Still too early to test, but ive has signs of early pregnancy. I'm so angry with God right now. Ive tried so hard to do his will. He knows how much I try to be a good mother and take care of my children. I try to do the right thing and this happens. NFP doesn't work. Its constantly wrong. I don't understand why I'm being punished for having sex with MY HUSBAND one time. Does God really not want me to go near my spouse???? What does he want???? How can God look at my situation and say here you need another child. There's nothing to talk about with a therapist, theres nothing they can do to help me except probably advise an abortion/ adoption and contraception for next time. I don't have the money to vent to someone who literally doesn't care and can't do anything about it except say here have some pills. 

I actually would consider adoption, giving my baby to my SIL because she can't have kids, but my husband would never.