Help with possible Spiritual Director?

[PaxCordisJesu]

Hello all,

I am a senior in high school, and have been discerning religious life (from my computer!) for a few years, without being very conversational about it with family and friends. I had pretty much accepted that I had to go to college before being able to enter religious life and have already applied to several colleges. However, I recently asked my parents if they would let me enter religious life straight out of high school. They said yes, but my mom said ONLY if I would talk to a certain priest, and if he would be my spiritual director. So I said that, yes, I would talk to him, but now am having second thoughts. First of all, she still wants me to apply to more colleges, and acts like she wouldn't actually let me enter out of high school. Secondly, I heard her say that she thinks I am just wanting to enter the convent to avoid dating and to get away from the family (to make matters worse, the convent I am interested in is overseas). Neither of which is true. The reason I don't want to date is because I want to discern religious life first. So, I have an appointment scheduled with this priest, but now I am afraid to actually go talk to him because: 1) My parents know him, and they probably have told him all about me, which includes their false concerns and biased opinions; and 2) he said he would talk to me about another community in the same order. Plus, my parents (or at least one) will be present for the entire conversation because I am a minor still. So, my question is, how much should I open up and tell him? I'm afraid he will just listen to my parents, and tell me that I don't have a vocation, or to at least wait till after college. And if he does encourage me to visit orders, I'm afraid he will try to steer me towards the community he knows, which I'm not at all interested in. If you made it through this entire post, thank you! I appreciate any and all answers and prayers!

[Anastasia]

16 minutes ago, PaxCordisJesu said:

They said yes, but my mom said ONLY if I would talk to a certain priest, and if he would be my spiritual director.

 

16 minutes ago, PaxCordisJesu said:

I heard her say that she thinks I am just wanting to enter the convent to avoid dating and to get away from the family

 

16 minutes ago, PaxCordisJesu said:

Plus, my parents (or at least one) will be present for the entire conversation because I am a minor still.

I am not sure what is your age, is it 17-18 y.o.? If so, the above quotes are the red flags for me which indicate an attempt to control you emotionally.

I am especially alarmed by the fact that your parent(s) state as a matter of a fact that they will be present during your conversation with a priest. How can you be frank and natural in such a situation? What spiritual benefit could you get out of that highly disrespectful to your (spiritual) privacy situation? 

16 minutes ago, PaxCordisJesu said:

Plus, my parents (or at least one) will be present for the entire conversation because I am a minor still.

I do not understand this reasoning, are young people now prohibited from, lets say, going to confession without witnesses?

I read your message carefully but I have to literally run and this is my initial reaction. The situation your describe is contrary to the idea of "opening up". 

Edited October 20, 2020 by Anastasia

[PaxCordisJesu]

Thanks, Anastasia! I am 17, and I for sure don't want to talk to him in front of my parents. I think the reason for that is that my family went through some very harsh spiritual abuse with a different priest who did a lot of stuff that was absolutely not allowed (like with altar boys being unsupervised at the church) and they now are afraid of letting something happen to me after that. But still, it's not like we'll be meeting at the church, it would be in a very public place. I do feel like they are trying to control me, though. Thanks for your input!

[JHFamily]

As a mom, I would never subject my daughters to this. Who ever heard of spiritual direction with other people present? I wouldn't have done it as a teenager, no way. My daughters have had spiritual directors they have privately met with since the age of 16 with our permission, sometimes sitting in lawn chairs in the front yard in full view. We chose the director for them, even, based on the priest's holiness. But I'd never sit in and listen, and to be frankly honest, I wouldn't want to.

But also as a mom, they do have the right to call the shots for a little longer. Often, young women will use their confessors and the confession time for some direction. That's a possibility.

Ultimately, it is your life, and once you are 18, your parents have a moral obligation to allow you to make your choices.

[Sponsa-Christi]

@PaxCordisJesu As much as I think spiritual direction is important for discerners, it's not totally surprising that you wouldn't be able to have one-on-one SD with a priest under age 18. I agree that you can't have real SD with your parents present. But often diocesan "Safe Environment" standards are pretty strict in this regard. 

Also, I don't know your parents, and it is true that discernment is YOUR job, not your parents'. As in, you discern your vocation and tell your parents afterwards, they themselves don't get a "vote." Yet at the same time, your parents almost certainly have your best interest at heart (even if they perhaps don't always express this perfectly), and it would be prudent to at least listen to their thoughts and concerns, even if you wind up disagreeing with what they have to say in the end.

Being politely willing to listen to concerns and suggestions would probably also go a long way in showing your parents that you are mature and are discerning for the right reasons.

Even when you are a legal adult a year from now, your entering religious life won't just affect you, it will also affect the ones you love. To a certain extent, it will be a sacrifice for your parents, too. Doing whatever you reasonably can to put their minds more at ease is an act of humility, filial reverence, and charity. 

And re. applying to colleges...honestly, would this really hurt anything? Just applying to some colleges doesn't mean you actually have to go, and if it makes your parents feel significantly better then it may not be "a hill to die on." 

Honestly, for someone your age even going to college probably wouldn't be a bad thing (presuming that you weren't taking on debt). I think it's great to be discerning a vocation as a teenager, but at the same time there are no prizes in the spiritual life for simply entering at the youngest possible age. 

3 hours ago, PaxCordisJesu said:

So, my question is, how much should I open up and tell him?

Ok, so answering your actual question...I'd look at the conversation as sort of an educational fact-finding mission. As in: Father knows some communities I'm going to at least be willing to hear about; Father might have some insights on discernment in general that may be useful to me; etc.

I wouldn't suggest really "spilling your guts"/making a manifestation of conscience like you would in normal SD. But, talking about your vocation story in a more objective way wouldn't hurt. 

And it could even work to your advantage to have your parents there! Like, maybe Father will help them see that some of your concerns make real sense (e.g., not wanting to date if your heart is set on religious life). 

[Swami Mommy]

Personally, I would gently tell them that I would feel uncomfortable being totally open with a spiritual director with them being present for what will be a very personal unburdening of my heart, and would ask them if they would consider allowing me to speak with a female vocational director that the priest could recommend.  That way, they wouldn’t have to be worried that you will be placed in a compromising situation.  

[M. Therese]

Find a spiritual director priest who you are comfortable with, not someone your parents know.

You could contact the Sisters of Mary, Mother of the Eucharist for some advice. Their vocations director is an amazing woman. I'm sure she will be able to assist you. Check them out online! I will keep your intentions in my daily prayers.

M. Therese

[Lilllabettt]

Ok so... don't go into the conversation thinking of it as spiritual direction. Honestly the term "direction" gets thrown around a lot by people ... some of whom are just ignorant and some of whom should know better. Your parents would be in the first category; the priest, if he refers to this conversation as "spiritual direction", would be in the 2nd ... 

the world being what it is, you are too young to have an actual spiritual director (other than what you can get from a regular confessor in the setting of confession.) Even letters or phone calls would be frowned upon... the reason being real spiritual direction requires privacy, and adults connected with the Church just cannot have regular ongoing private contact with minors.

So, the conversation you are going to have is not spiritual direction... it's more like an informational interview.  In case you're not familiar, that's when you set up a chat with someone to learn more about their work. It's one step down in formality from a job interview.  You wouldn't expect to get very personal during a job or informational interview... it's more or less a business setting. You should share about your goals and interests...  but the deepest secrets of your heart... nah. 

[Lea]

With a lot of points already made, I'd frankly recommend to wait until you turn 18 before starting spiritual direction and until this point, stay with a regular confessor.

Is there something like a diocesan vocations office in the youth ministries in your region? Maybe they can help you, too. 

[gloriana35]

13 hours ago, Sponsa-Christi said:

As much as I think spiritual direction is important for discerners, it's not totally surprising that you wouldn't be able to have one-on-one SD with a priest under age 18. I agree that you can't have real SD with your parents present. But often diocesan "Safe Environment" standards are pretty strict in this regard. 

I had heard of cases (all very sad, not usually related to religious life) where a fear of liability has ruined chances for guidance. It is unthinkable to me that anyone, at any age, would have anyone there when they speak with their spiritual directors. Yet it truly saddens me that a fear of liability exposure would make dioceses demand that parents be present if anyone talks to a priest! 

The cliches your mother is repeating (trying to get away from home, trying to avoid dating) existed long before you were born - perhaps for centuries. I guarantee you'd hear some variation, even if you were 35. However, if she heard them from a priest or religious (or read them somewhere), she might think they are insights rather than cliches.

If you'll be an adult within the year, I'd recommend you let the months pass. You not only could have some privacy, but could make decisions without anyone's permission. 

[Feankie]

As a certified Spiritual Director, I see lots of red flags here.

No I don't believe you are too young to see a SD.  Personally I would suggest a female SD due to your age.  And there are ways to do this that make it safe.  Suggestions given above are very creative and certainly can be utilized.....not ideal, but doable!  I've had directees your age....many were mature, others were not.  And my "job" was to help them on their path to spiritual maturity, clarity, and holiness. 

Many people have a misguided belief of what a SD is and is not.  They equate a priest with a confessor with a spiritual director.  Not so.   They are  different "animals" and each serves a different purpose and their roles should not be conflated.

First of all, not all priests are or should be spiritual directors.  I have several priest friends who reply, if asked to be a SD, say there are more qualified people out there than they!  Just because one is a priest, it does not necessarily make him a good SD.

I never, and I mean never, would let parents be present with a directee.  It's manipulative, it's unproductive as the directee often is not open and honest with me (or themselves) with parents or others in the same room for fear of any number of things.  

A SD keeps what they hear private and sacrosanct unless it is something that must be reported to the authorities - and that is very rare.  It has never happened to me, but it does happen.  

I always have an initial conversation, in person, with a potential directee to see if we "mesh."  It's like a job interview for both parties.  There have been times when I've had to say I didn't think it would be a good "match", and there have been other times a potential directee has decided I was not "the one" :)) And there is nothing wrong with this.  It actually makes for a better relationship between the two parties.

Hope this helps a bit.

[JHFamily]

3 hours ago, Francis Clare said:

A SD keeps what they hear private and sacrosanct

I once asked my daughter's spiritual director for a book suggestion that I could get her for Christmas, and he would not even do that lest his suggestion give any indications of the direction he was giving her.  I was so impressed...

[Feankie]

And that indicates a devotion to one’s promise of confidentiality! Bravo....

[gloriana35]

I've read some excellent books by Sr Mary Margaret Funk OSB, who is a spiritual director. (Her books are an excellent 'capsule course' in ascetic theology.) In one, she mentioned that she also taught at a university, and that some uni students were people she directed. Even if she heard happy news, such as someone announcing an engagement, at the university, she'd never join in, because, even if it were publicly known now, she didn't always recall when she first heard the news, and would not want to take a chance of repeating what she heard as an SD.

[Nunsuch]

Margaret Mary Funk is amazing.