Chastity

[Franciscan]

Hi, 

Just wondering if anyone has any experience with those in Religious formation who, because of their history, still struggle with chastity, even if they have not explicitly done anything physically unchaste for years? What I am referring to is struggling with things like impure thoughts or sexual urges etc?

Just looking for some advice to help someone I know who struggles with these things but has a deep desire to commit themself to God in the Religious Life.

Thanks. 

[gloriana35]

Whether one has no experience of having sex, or much, those struggles do not die completely until the doctor says to hold the CPR and asks for the time!

First, bear in mind that this is a universal, natural, hormonal response. The more we fear, or try to fight this, the more intense it can become. If someone intended to rob a bank, and was planning this, there would be sin even in the pre-meditation - but, if someone just liked detective stories, and was thinking through what planning would be necessary if someone were a bank robber, the latter is just telling a story. Don't be afraid that you have sinned by thinking about sex.

I don't know if this helps everyone, but I've found it useful. Humour helps! It's easier to think "Oh, I have it bad today...", then to fear one is doing wrong. (Francis of Assisi, and Catherine of Siena, were very frank about their strong sex drives.) Gratitude does, as well. Give thanks for the blessings of intimacy, creative power, and so forth which people have in marriage. 

Don't be afraid if you slip into masturbation. (Of course, though I can't speak for the male, where I would imagine there could be a release that is relief, for women it can give a 'this is just getting started...' sense.) The more one become tense, the more the thoughts cling.

I have very little sex drive in my older years (...though Francis of Assisi, who died in his 40s, underestimated sex drive amongst those who are over 60.) But I do struggle with anxiety. I sometimes find little 'games' to be a distraction - think of song titles beginning with different letters, or of the names of countries in alphabetical order. It can be enough of a harmless distraction to ease some of the tension.

[John Paul]

http://www.reginaprophetarum.org/mission_materials/Maxims of St Philip against LUST.pdf

 

[Ice_nine]

On 8/14/2020 at 5:26 PM, gloriana35 said:

Don't be afraid if you slip into masturbation. (Of course, though I can't speak for the male, where I would imagine there could be a release that is relief, for women it can give a 'this is just getting started...' sense.) The more one become tense, the more the thoughts cling.

Could you clarify. Are you saying masturbation is not to be feared because it is not a mortal sin?

[gloriana35]

I believe mortal sin requires reflection, plus full consent of the will. If it is a consequence of extreme tension or depression, I do not think those conditions exist. BTW - I am not encouraging masturbation. I was addressing a post which seemed to show excessive worry and fear about chastity - and that can get one into a knot, and make things worse. (I have no experience of being sexually active, but I would imagine that those who have, perhaps to excess, can become unduly fearful of not being up to chastity.)

[adoro.te.devote]

On 8/24/2020 at 12:05 PM, gloriana35 said:

I believe mortal sin requires reflection, plus full consent of the will. If it is a consequence of extreme tension or depression, I do not think those conditions exist. BTW - I am not encouraging masturbation. I was addressing a post which seemed to show excessive worry and fear about chastity - and that can get one into a knot, and make things worse. (I have no experience of being sexually active, but I would imagine that those who have, perhaps to excess, can become unduly fearful of not being up to chastity.)

my understanding is that actions inherently have more of a consent to them, rather than thoughts... I mean if someone chooses to do an action like this, they are choosing it, no? (for any reason..). The exception is perhaps if you say something without thinking. 

On 8/14/2020 at 2:12 PM, Franciscan said:

Hi, 

Just wondering if anyone has any experience with those in Religious formation who, because of their history, still struggle with chastity, even if they have not explicitly done anything physically unchaste for years? What I am referring to is struggling with things like impure thoughts or sexual urges etc?

Just looking for some advice to help someone I know who struggles with these things but has a deep desire to commit themself to God in the Religious Life.

Thanks. 

I don't have experience with religious formation in a community, but I'm living a life of vowed chastity.. I think those temptations never truly go away during this life, whatever our past, although they can certainly be lesser or stronger at different times. Even the Saints had horrible intrusive thoughts, though perhaps there was a demonic element to them as well, because of how violent they were. But we still have our concupiscence. I read somewhere that even if we struggle with chastity, God can always give us the grace to be pure, so we shouldn't despair. This is definitely something a person should speak about to their director or confessor or religious superior for guidance... but I know it's wrong to say that it's impossible to live chastely. Whatever our past, God's grace is stronger, though it might mean more purification fasting seems to help with chastity too, from what I understand. 

Also, it's so important to keep in mind, that being tempted strongly doesn't make someone "less pure". Even great Saints had strong temptations. It's the will that counts. And if our will seems weak, it could always be strengthened through grace and continual effort.