Why I now reject climate politics nearly entirely

[hakutaku]

13 hours ago, fides' Jack said:

I've never known a climate change denier.  I've never heard of anyone actually denying climate change.  

It was more common 10-15 years ago, people would in fact deny that the climate was changing.  If you take my words to mean "deny that the climate has ever changed" you actually can find such people over in young-earth-creation land (although they might say the flood was a climactic change.)

[ArciMoto]

On 8/10/2021 at 7:43 AM, fides' Jack said:

I've never known a climate change denier.  I've never heard of anyone actually denying climate change.  

By their fruits you will know them.

Climate change [pseudo-]science is currently driven by the same people who promote abortion, BLM, and a number of other demonic organizations.  

 

pretty bold statements,... so you think you are smarter than the devil AND can spot the evilness and sin???

 

On 4/7/2021 at 4:21 PM, fides' Jack said:

A general thing can indeed be demonic or influenced by demons.  An idea, for example.

 

On 4/8/2021 at 7:38 AM, fides' Jack said:

There is a distinct, categorical different between all three forms of diabolic manipulation, which are oppression, obsession, and possession (we've been calling both of the former "influence", but there are multiple types of influence).  

But you win: I concede that I was wrong.  I do believe that the movement itself is demonic, but the reason why I haven't done anything about it is because I'm a bad Catholic.  I don't mean that sarcastically or anything like that, I mean it truly.  I'm a huge sinner, and I have a lot of my own sins and issues that I'm trying to overcome, and maybe it would behoove me to work that out before I start casting stones online.

 

hate to be the one to burst your delusional reality bubble,... BUT learned long ago people are not as smart as then think they are AND WRT to the topic of climate change science,... people in general are more akin to the idiot "Homer Simpson" rather than the an "Einstein" genius

 

On 11/28/2020 at 1:41 PM, ArciMoto said:

(too often people over estimate their abilities, which as I learned going to a catholic high school, should be considered a sin of pride)

https://www.catholic.com/encyclopedia/pride

 

 

since this is forum that looks at issues from a catholic POV, could not help but notice the title of this thread,... Why I now reject climate politics nearly entirely

seems to me you are being the hypocrite (i.e. a person who indulges in hypocrisy) because time and time you keep on focusing on the politics AND ignoring the hard science!!!

 

On 8/6/2021 at 4:52 PM, ArciMoto said:

 

 

as I've tried to point out w/ the homer/einstein graphic,... PRIDE is a "deadly" sin!

given the devil isn't going to be able to destroy creation directly,... he will enlist the assistance of political "useful idiots"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Useful_idiot

to do his evil dirty work for him

bottom line seems like what I'm seeing is a form of demonic possession,... because of wide spread oppression the simple scientific findings (which I've outlined) and having "useful idiots" obsessing on topics like politics

 

 

On 8/9/2021 at 8:59 AM, ArciMoto said:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[fides' Jack]

On 8/11/2021 at 1:39 PM, ArciMoto said:

pretty bold statements,... so you think you are smarter than the devil AND can spot the evilness and sin???

Absolutely not.  That's why I'm losing these arguments on phatmass - the devil is many thousands of times smarter than I am.

I sometimes recognize evil when I see it.  But I'm also aware that I fall into the error of modernism.  I've been working on that...

On 8/11/2021 at 1:39 PM, ArciMoto said:

hate to be the one to burst your delusional reality bubble,... BUT learned long ago people are not as smart as then think they are AND WRT to the topic of climate change science,... people in general are more akin to the idiot "Homer Simpson" rather than the an "Einstein" genius

I think that's generally the case, on every issue.

On 8/11/2021 at 1:39 PM, ArciMoto said:

seems to me you are being the hypocrite (i.e. a person who indulges in hypocrisy) because time and time you keep on focusing on the politics AND ignoring the hard science!!!

I'm often a hypocrite.  

However, that title made more sense in a forum than, "Why I now reject what all the climate politicians say about most climate-related issues nearly entirely".

I figured people were smart enough to know what I meant.  For the most part, I think they did...  Not an Einstein moment for you then, either...

On 8/11/2021 at 1:39 PM, ArciMoto said:

as I've tried to point out w/ the homer/einstein graphic,... PRIDE is a "deadly" sin!

I'm certain that I'm guilty of all 7 deadly sins.  I'm working on it.  

On 8/11/2021 at 1:39 PM, ArciMoto said:

given the devil isn't going to be able to destroy creation directly,... he will enlist the assistance of political "useful idiots"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Useful_idiot

to do his evil dirty work for him

bottom line seems like what I'm seeing is a form of demonic possession,... because of wide spread oppression the simple scientific findings (which I've outlined) and having "useful idiots" obsessing on topics like politics

The devil and "science" are the on the same side.  If they weren't, you'd be saying to trust in God, and not in the false god of science.

On 8/10/2021 at 10:18 PM, hakutaku said:

It was more common 10-15 years ago, people would in fact deny that the climate was changing.  If you take my words to mean "deny that the climate has ever changed" you actually can find such people over in young-earth-creation land (although they might say the flood was a climactic change.)

False statement.  There is nobody anywhere who claims that the climate never changes - UNLESS maybe you mean that some people claimed 10-15 years ago that the climate was not changing, then.  That's possible, but it would have to be taken into context.  They would almost certainly mean that it was not changing in any way out of the ordinary.

I myself now subscribe to the young-earth creation belief, and I can assure you that none of us thinks the climate never changes.  

You just want to group everyone together in easy-to-dispel categories.  Please don't do that.

Edited August 12, 2021 by fides' Jack
clarification

[ArciMoto]

4 hours ago, fides' Jack said:

The devil and "science" are the on the same side.  If they weren't, you'd be saying to trust in God, and not in the false god of science.

huh,... so into blind faith, as long as its the name of god?

question I have to ask again is,... are you worshiping a false god unknowingly??

 

 

FWIW there is a quote by einstein

“science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind”

...what this means is one w/ out the other is recipe for disaster

to illustrate why why one w/ out the other is recipe for disaster, lets first consider the unscientific test(s) used in salem witch trials of colonial massachusetts

http://listverse.com/2012/07/27/10-tests-for-guilt-used-at-the-salem-witch-trials/

as I see things, if the people of faith (back in colonial massachusetts) had a good basic understanding of science, then forced confession by dunking, pressing AND bound submersion (i.e. tests-for-guilt) would be viewed as idiocracy

now lets consider the various nazi medical experiments

http://www.ushmm.org/collections/bibliography/medical-experiments

as I see things, if the nazi “scientists” had a solid faith based moral compass such as the 10 commandments,... then the various subjects used in concentration camp medical experiments would be viewed as human beings (AND I would hope god fearing nazi “scientists” would realize “thou shalt not kill”)

just a wild educated guess,... science/math is an area where you lack "talent" (as in "the parable of the talents")

actually its pretty apparent looking at the OP (where you stated)
 

On 8/20/2019 at 2:16 PM, fides' Jack said:

Well, we know plant life would be WAY better off if the global temperature were a number of degrees warmer and the CO2 level in the atmosphere was many times higher than it is - that's just basic understanding of plants.  They breathe, and eat, carbon dioxide.  The more there is, the better for them.  Farmers actually sometimes increase CO2 in enclosed spaces when growing plants for this very reason.

 

WRT climate change,... what humanity faces is a self inflicted (perhaps fatal) wound, caused by burning fossil fuels which creates ever increasing concentrations of CO2 in atmosphere which has knock on effects

said another way basically if you had any scientific talent, you might have researched the topic and discovered when plants are exposed to elevated levels of CO2 among other detrimental things one should expect is,...

Higher concentrations of carbon dioxide are associated with reductions in protein and multiple key nutrients in rice, according to a new field study by an international team of scientists.

https://newsroom.uw.edu/news/increasing-co2-levels-reduce-rices-nutritional-value

another thing an individual w/ scientific "talents" might consider is,... during the PETM when CO2 concentrations were higher,... plants grew lazy,... IOW w/ elevated CO2 levels plants needed fewer stomata (when this happens there isn't as much photosynthesis)

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/259086701_Paleo-CO2_variation_trends_and_the_Cretaceous_greenhouse_climate

simply stated fewer stomata = less oxygen is created by plants

point being,... even though you might not have any scientific talents, does not mean others don't have lots of scientific talent

since you wrote,...

On 10/14/2020 at 9:13 AM, fides' Jack said:

I'm perfectly willing to follow actual science, if you can show me some.

and since I've tried to make the actual climate science accessible and hopefully easy to understand (that mankind is creating an unmistakable scientific marker)

 

just wondering if you'll ever admit that mankind is indeed the primary cause of elevated CO2 (which is a greenhouse gas that traps infrared energy,... which is why there is "global warming")

BTW did a quick search of phatmass,... and see there is a long history of a basic lack of scientific talent

for example another thread that stated global warming is a hoax (started off w/ a sensational statement)

On 1/30/2006 at 6:43 PM, ironmonk said:

one volcano puts out more pollutants than we do in 10,000 years... more CFC's and more "green house gases" than we could ever do. 30 volcanoes erupt every year. So, for humans to do as much "damage" as one year of "damage" that volcanoes do it will take us 300,000 years... Now, what we do is a drop in the bucket when looking at the big picture.

the actual truth is,...

and FWIW science can tell the difference between CO2 emissions from natural volcanic activity vs man made emission due to "chemical combustion" by looking at the isotopes

https://gml.noaa.gov/outreach/isotopes/mixing.html

 

 

 

 

 
 

 

 

[ZeroM]

The scientific method is a natural revelation of the divine.  To mock science is to mock the Lord.  

[fides' Jack]

15 hours ago, ArciMoto said:

question I have to ask again is,... are you worshiping a false god unknowingly??

No, at least not regarding climate change nonsense, but you certainly seem to be.

1 hour ago, ZeroM said:

The scientific method is a natural revelation of the divine.  To mock science is to mock the Lord.  

If the science were true, I would agree with you, to a limit.  Funny, you know, all you people go on and on about trusting in the government to tell you what the science is.  Fauci was the one who said, "I am science".  In light of this comment here, he might seem to be claiming a level of divinity.

15 hours ago, ArciMoto said:

just wondering if you'll ever admit that mankind is indeed the primary cause of elevated CO2 (which is a greenhouse gas that traps infrared energy,... which is why there is "global warming")

No, because you can't prove it.  It's physically impossible for you to prove it, because the number of variables is almost infinite.  

CO2 is also what gives plant life.  Give plants more CO2 and we'll have a warmer, healthier planet, with more food, more oxygen, and just more life in general.

And that's what this boils down to.  Proponents of the man-made-climate-change hypothesis (which assures us that mankind is the primary cause of climate change), is advocating for the culture of death, albeit in ignorance.

15 hours ago, ArciMoto said:

BTW did a quick search of phatmass,... and see there is a long history of a basic lack of scientific talent

Thank God!!

That means there is a long history of people who question the satanic "science".

[ArciMoto]

2 hours ago, ZeroM said:

The scientific method is a natural revelation of the divine.  To mock science is to mock the Lord.  

sigh,... in the case of man made climate change deniers (who believe they know more than what the scientific method has revealed),... seems its a case of the road to hell is paved with good intentions
 

[ZeroM]

Quote

all you people go on and on about trusting in the government to tell you what the science is

Who trusts the government?  I trust science.  Science is not a false god unless a person makes it one.  We are made little less than gods.  We have a natural propensity and ability to figure things out.  A rigorous scientific approach to world problems, using evidence based practice and studies to understand and interpret the divinely ordered universe is the reason we have brains.  

We can reject tree ring data and hockey stick graphs because it is garbage science, not because of Al Gore and abortion.  But to reject climate science for non scientific reasons or because we don't like the government or you don't want to pay some nonsense carbon tax is foolhardy in the extreme.  

[fides' Jack]

19 minutes ago, ZeroM said:

We can reject tree ring data and hockey stick graphs because it is garbage science, not because of Al Gore and abortion.  But to reject climate science for non scientific reasons or because we don't like the government or you don't want to pay some nonsense carbon tax is foolhardy in the extreme.  

So, what you're saying is, "thou fool"?

The importance of just one soul is greater than the worth of the entire planet.

We have made science a false god, and have led billions of souls to their ruin.

[ZeroM]

Quote

We have made science a false god, and have led billions of souls to their ruin.

yes that's very profound sounding but I'm not sure it means anything or is in anyway true

[fides' Jack]

On 8/13/2021 at 7:22 PM, ZeroM said:

yes that's very profound sounding but I'm not sure it means anything or is in anyway true

I am sure.

[Didacus]

Just saw this article...

Seems pretry sensible and IT MUST BE TRUE SINCE IT IS AFFILIATED TO OBAMA, and we all know Obama never lied!

https://nationalpost.com/sponsored/news-sponsored/new-book-says-the-climate-is-changing-but-we-may-be-very-wrong-about-how-that-change-affects-us?fbclid=IwAR244IkopUYFISVh4NZBeuSYHk4qcE8WKjzLlDR1Dp8t8oZMOFHqaEI8rQ8

 

 

Ill just go back to the sidelines now amd continue eating popcorn.

 

[Winchester]

The same people who fly to tourist destinations in what amount to private jets when they could just meet over the internet have something to tell you about your carbon footprint from driving to work.

The same people who covered much of Iraq in depleted Uranium, and who are stomping the Earth with their war machine's carbon footprint truly care about the environment.

When they ground Air Force 1 and 2 permanently and use Skype, let me know.

[ArciMoto]

On 9/8/2021 at 8:39 AM, Didacus said:

Just saw this article...

Seems pretry sensible and IT MUST BE TRUE SINCE IT IS AFFILIATED TO OBAMA, and we all know Obama never lied!

https://nationalpost.com/sponsored/news-sponsored/new-book-says-the-climate-is-changing-but-we-may-be-very-wrong-about-how-that-change-affects-us?fbclid=IwAR244IkopUYFISVh4NZBeuSYHk4qcE8WKjzLlDR1Dp8t8oZMOFHqaEI8rQ8

 

 

Ill just go back to the sidelines now amd continue eating popcorn.

 

 

The author of Unsettled: What climate science tells us, what it doesn’t and why it matters was President Obama’s under-secretary of science at the department of energy. His book cuts a wide swath through cataclysmically rising temperatures, unprecedented heat waves, and overflowing seas. Instead, he describes a world where the temperature is rising and human activity is probably responsible for an increasing portion of it — but notes that the climate isn’t “broken”, the incidence of heat waves are par for the course, and the seas are staying put for the foreseeable future. In short, humans aren’t anywhere close to the verge of irreversible, climate-induced extinction.

what all non-scientist and even many scientist don't fully grasp is climate change is the worst possible combination of issues because it's not only uncertain (since its a really big and complicated issue) BUT it's also in the future AND involves various economic costs that no one want to pay

point being looking at the big over all picture along w/ looking at the trends, the most likely scenario is a disaster for humanity of-biblical-proportions

yet in the mean time,... events that are akin to "a snowball's chance in hell" like rain fall on top of a mountain of ice in the arctic region just keep on happening

because climate change is the worst possible combination of issues which are not only uncertain (since its a really big and complicated issue) BUT it's also in the future, involves various economic costs that no one want to pay AND too few recognize the reason events like rain fall on top of a mountain of ice in the arctic region is simply because humanity is recklessly burning various hydrocarbon fuels like: coal, methane, gas, etc. which creates greenhouse gases which trap infrared energy

 

 

 

[ArciMoto]

Quote

 

COP26 climate summit made progress but came up short, Catholic agencies say

The United Nations climate summit known as COP26 took some steps forward in the global effort to rapidly limit dangerous levels of warming, but not nearly enough or fast enough, say Catholic groups who were present in Glasgow throughout the two-week conference

...The summit in Glasgow had been billed as the most important U.N. meeting on climate since COP21, where in 2015 nearly 200 countries adopted the Paris Agreement.

The U.N. conference was seen as a vital checkpoint for nations to demonstrate progress in achieving the key goal set out six years earlier: holding average temperature rise to no more than 1.5 degrees Celsius to avert the most catastrophic consequences of global warming.

https://international.la-croix.com/news/environment/cop26-climate-summit-made-progress-but-came-up-short-catholic-agencies-say/15219

 

 

looking at the basic science of "man made" climate change,... given the present trends seems,... it is not a matter of "if" but "when" humanity reached a fatal tipping point (that only will be recognized in hind sight)

since not many have the benefit of having a formal university level education in math, physics and chemistry,... nor have any idea of what a Monte Carlo simulation is

https://www.ibm.com/cloud/learn/monte-carlo-simulation

perhaps an annotated graph of ever rising CO2 levels might get the point across why catholics should be concerned,...