nikita92 Posted February 24, 2019 Share Posted February 24, 2019 http://canonlawmadeeasy.com/2018/08/30/do-sisters-have-to-wear-their-habits/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 24, 2019 Share Posted February 24, 2019 (edited) 12 hours ago, nikita92 said: http://canonlawmadeeasy.com/2018/08/30/do-sisters-have-to-wear-their-habits/ With religious, there is their approved Rule of Life, their particular Constitution and whatever their legitimate superior should mandate. These are the legitimate authorities in a religious order. "Sisters have to wear their habits" in a website "Canon Law Made Easy" can be a bit misleading as a title of an article. One needs to read the whole article ........ e.g. Quote "the key issue is not that religious have to wear a habit, it is that religious have to obey their institute" ...."the proper law of an institute mandates that all its members must wear X, then all members are expected to obey that law and wear X, whatever it might be" ......."what really matters is that members of religious institutes are wearing whatever their rule requires them to wear" http://canonlawmadeeasy.com/2018/08/30/do-sisters-have-to-wear-their-habits/ The above testifies that it is not what is worn that is key and prime i.e. appearances, it is the why of what one is wearing and obedience is key and prime - and obedience will always in all things transcend. It is not only religious that are called to obedience by God, we all are so called - we each have different authorities over us which we are called to obey. Edited February 24, 2019 by BarbaraTherese Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 25, 2019 Share Posted February 25, 2019 "There is only one “Rule” applicable to the Carmelite order, (St. Albert’s), though each branch of the tree of Carmel will have its own set of constitutions, by-laws and statutes. That is to say, if an organization claims to be Carmelite, yet adheres to any rule other than the original, unadulterated Rule of St. Albert, then by definition, it is not Carmelite." http://www.ewtn.com/vexperts/showmessage_print.asp?number=439871&language=en Today still, there are only five approved Rules of Life - The Carmelite Rule of St Albert is the shortest. It has 24 very short paragraphs. The Rule of Life of St Albert is the Rule of Life of Carmel and for the Carmelite Religious Order. It does not refer anywhere to some form of common dress other than the following: THE HABIT OF CARMEL Quote Rule of Life of St Albert for Carmel http://docs.wixstatic.com/ugd/8ca143_beac25660b724e4aa0fc33f478a52cd0.pdf "[18] Since man’s life on earth is a time of trial, and all who would live devotedly in Christ must undergo persecution, and the devil your foe is on the prowl like a roaring lion looking for prey to devour, you must use every care to clothe yourselves in God’s armour so that you may be ready to with- stand the enemy’s ambush. [19] Your loins are to be girt with chastity, your breast fortified by holy meditations, for as Scripture has it, holy meditation will save you. Put on holiness as your breastplate, and it will enable you to love the Lord your God with all your heart and soul and strength, and your neighbour as yourself. Faith must be your shield on all occasions, and with it you will be able to quench all the flaming missiles of the wicked one: there can be no pleasing God without faith; and the victory lies in this - your faith. On your head set the helmet of salvation, and so be sure of deliverance by our only Saviour, who sets his own free from their sins. The sword of the spirit, the word of God, must abound in your mouths and hearts. Let all you do have the Lord’s word for accompaniment" A HISTORY OF CARMEL THE RULE OF CARMEL, THE SONG OF CARMEL ____________ Revised Rule of St Albert by Pope Innocent IV in 1247 http://www.citoc.info/timeline/content/mitigation-rule-pope-innocent-iv In 1593 there was resistance to the reforms of St Teresa of Avila and St John of The Cross. This led to a split in the Carmelite Order. The OCD's follow the Ancient Observance and the O.Carm's the revised Rule by Pope Innocent IV. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 25, 2019 Share Posted February 25, 2019 (edited) On 2/19/2019 at 10:03 AM, Sister Leticia said: . Life is about change. The only exception to that, of course, is God, who is changeless. Well said! Thank you. No growth without change. The appearance of growth (positive or negative) is that the subject has or is changing. Edited February 25, 2019 by BarbaraTherese Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beatitude Posted February 28, 2019 Share Posted February 28, 2019 I was reminded today that there are religious who visit Phatmass without registering and posting...including habit-wearing religious from communities that people here might like the look of. (Hello, sisters!) This thread has actually been discussed among nuns of a monastery that is pretty traditional. Their prioress saw it and she wasn't impressed by the tone of some posts, especially the idea that the sisters in Baltimore are not proper Carmelites. One day someone here might be contacting her in the hope of discerning with that community. Consider the impression you could be giving to a monastery before your emails even arrive. We're not invisible on here. Two of my friends were easily recognised by the superiors of their future communities through their Phatmass posts. Happily their posts reflected well on them. It's better to be charitable just for the sake of being charitable, but it might help to keep Phatmass a kinder and less contentious place if people ask themselves if they would want a VD of a community they're interested in to get the impression that they're just obsessed with nun fashion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GraceUk Posted February 28, 2019 Share Posted February 28, 2019 Sorry a previous post went on again. Don't know how that happened. You can have my posts deleted if it's upsetting people. I didn't mean to cause this controversy. People discerning will make up their own minds. But I think the habit is a lot more than a fashion accessory. That's what I was taught. Seems like all the things we we 're taught have now gone out the window. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deusluxmea Posted March 1, 2019 Share Posted March 1, 2019 one day, the good Lord may be able to answer how beatitude came to be so wise! always love your posts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GraceUk Posted March 1, 2019 Share Posted March 1, 2019 I was looking round and found a long but quite old thread on Catholic answers on this very topic. Habits v no habits. It was good to see that people didn't agree but were not made to feel guilty just because they had different opinions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonkira Posted March 1, 2019 Share Posted March 1, 2019 No one is making anyone feel anything. As a very wise spiritual director once said, if God moves your heart to feel a certain way, it is a reflection of what you have created in yourself. There is also a marked difference between sharing an opinion and being grossly judgemental and lacking in charity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GraceUk Posted March 1, 2019 Share Posted March 1, 2019 Its a pity you need to be so personal in all your replies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrysostom Posted March 1, 2019 Share Posted March 1, 2019 (edited) If I'm not mistaken, even if one is entirely right about something, initiating debate about it is simply not permitted on Vocation Station. VS is intended to be a supportive community for those inquiring about religious life, as well as for anyone else who wants to stop by, and to that end, criticism and argumentation, interesting as that might be elsewhere, just have no place here. It seems the phorum redesign has taken away "sticky" posts which referred to that, but it seems relevant to bring that up here. Nunsuch, it's a beautiful video! 1790-1990! Some wonderful comments throughout. "The Monastery is a house of God . . . it's a place where your heart can feel at home . . . I think everybody has, somewhere in their heart, a place that's monastic. A place where God is sought and found . . . A monastery is also a sign. A sign that peace and living together are possible . . . A monastery isn't just a place, it's coming home to your own heart." How lovely. I also liked the bit about it being a paradise of infinite possibilities for a gardener! And the connections to gardening in the soul. And the comment that there's a "deep heartbeat of prayer resonating throughout the Church and we've been entrusted with that in a very special way as Carmelites." Thanks for posting it. I hope it resonates with some young women who...what else? want to find their heart. Edited March 1, 2019 by chrysostom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beatitude Posted March 1, 2019 Share Posted March 1, 2019 Grace, I hesitated to say anything more in this thread, as I don't want you to feel as if lots of people are piling on you and criticising you. I know it can feel that way when most people don't agree with something you've done. I also don't think you meant to be unkind. Most of us have probably put our foot in it on the Internet at sometime or other without really getting where we went wrong. I know I have. But I think it's important to try and understand what has happened here. Look at how Bonkira's reply to you made you feel. It hurts to be told that you've been uncharitable and unkind. I would flinch if anyone told me that, even if I thought they were correct. It's hard not to feel wounded because it's such a very personal thing. But think how much more hurt you would have felt if Bonkira had said to you, "You don't sound like a proper Catholic to me. I was quite frankly shocked and appalled when I read your comments. I don't think this should be allowed." Substitute 'Carmelite' for 'Catholic', and that's exactly what you've said about these nuns. Do you not see that you have been very personal in your comments about them? I don't think you meant to be unkind. I think you just lost sight of the fact that you were talking about real people. This is the big danger of focusing too heavily on the habit - we only see the clothes, and forget about the people. To draw another parallel, how would you feel if others here wanted to have a debate on whether you are a proper Catholic or not, and when you objected, they complained about being made to feel guilty just for having an opinion? Some things just aren't up for debate. Phatmass is first and foremost a discernment forum. People who aren't considering religious life and are just here out of friendly interest are welcome too, but our mission is to encourage discerners. They need a supportive climate, and habit debates don't help with that. With that in mind, I am going to close the thread, as I don't think this can be salvaged. If people would like to discuss the theological content of the sisters' video in a different thread (without referencing their clothes!), please feel free. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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