Michael Moore Hates America

[crusader1234]

Well I mean, he obviously thinks he is exposing some evil stuff, and doing whtas best for America. That seems like love to me. Even if you dont agree with him, and think hes misguided, you cant just say oh hes not right he hates america.

[MorphRC]

[quote name='crusader1234' date='Jun 29 2004, 06:45 PM'] Well I mean, he obviously thinks he is exposing some evil stuff, and doing whtas best for America. That seems like love to me. Even if you dont agree with him, and think hes misguided, you cant just say oh hes not right he hates america. [/quote]
Ive only seen trailers, and it looks like a lot of vid footage, but in certain places then no conclusion and its like 'Here you go, you work it out' sort of thing. Not very good film making. Maybe he should have done something on Islam instead...oh wait he would have been killed for that, guess America is a cheap target.

[MorphRC]

Btw: Example. Salman Rushdie.

[Sojourner]

[quote name='MorphRC' date='Jun 29 2004, 02:49 AM'] I cant find it. Some author made a book in 1963 under Fahrenheit 9/11, and claims Moore stole the title and some themes. It was on Yahoo! News the other week. [/quote]
The author is Ray Bradbury, the book was "Fahrenheit 451", and here's the [url="http://www.cnn.com/2004/SHOWBIZ/Movies/06/21/bradbury.fahrenheit.ap/"]story on CNN about it.[/url]

[MorphRC]

Bradbury thats right..thx

[Jake Huether]

[quote name='crusader1234' date='Jun 29 2004, 02:15 AM'] Well I mean, he obviously thinks he is exposing some evil stuff, and doing whtas best for America. That seems like love to me. Even if you dont agree with him, and think hes misguided, you cant just say oh hes not right he hates america. [/quote]
But it is very obvious that he is stooping to desceptive means in order to "expose" these "evils".

Did you go to that website which debunks Bowling??

If you ask me, he doesn't think that he is exposing some evil stuff. He simply wants to make us think that he is exposing some evil stuff. Most of the "stuff" he exposed were half truthes. Especially how he defamed Charleton Heston. Makes me ill that I actually fell for his cut and past craftwork. I was angry at Mr. Heston at the end of the movie. And for what? For what? Nothing. Moore totally abused Heston, cuting and editing his speaches and interviews to make him look like an assss. I forgive Moore for manipulating me into the sin of anger, but I will never support Moore, or his liberal lies.

[Lounge Daddy]

[url="http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,124079,00.html"]blam[/url]

[font="Courier"]this is a good article...[/font]
"in one often-showed clip, Moore claims that President Bush was on vacation 42 percent of the time during his first several months in office — but that estimation included weekends at Camp David, a common practice for presidents. Without those days figured in, Bush actually spent 13 percent of his time on vacation."

"Moore shows prominent members of the Taliban visiting Texas, implying that they were invited by then-Governor Bush. The Taliban delegation, however, was invited to Houston by UNOCAL, a California energy company.
Moore also doesn't mention that the visit was made with the permission of the Clinton administration, which twice met with Taliban members — in 1997 and 1998."

[font="Courier"]hell ya! Moore doesn't give a carp about the truth - let alone America
he seems to be very biased and driven by hate ...he hates America and what America is
he (and others like him) want to send this country in a different direction[/font]

[MorphRC]

I agree..but I dont think the direction ur going in now is exactly moralistic either

[Paladin D]

Michael Moore is a [b]Liberal Propagandist[/b]. No more, no less.

[Lounge Daddy]

[quote name='Paladin D' date='Jun 29 2004, 12:53 PM'] Michael Moore is a [b]Liberal Propagandist[/b]. No more, no less. [/quote]
[font="Courier"]i agree

also, i do think your helmet is nice[/font]

[Paladin D]

[quote name='Lounge Daddy' date='Jun 29 2004, 12:58 PM'] [font="Courier"]i agree

also, i do think your helmet is nice[/font] [/quote]
Thank you, I just got it polished too.

[Mickey's_Girl]

Re: Michael Moore.

I think the guy has talent. I saw his first film, Roger & Me, and was quite intrigued. I think there's definitely a place for filmmakers who "mix it up" with the status quo (whatever political stripe it may be). Controversy is usually good for democracy (not always, of course).

I may be inadvertently inviting tomatoes and flames (please don't; I'm too tired to resist! Google-bot-peeps, save me!), but it seems to me that Rush Limbaugh and Michael Moore are rather similar in what they do, and even in their styles. Both are over-the-top. Both have a political axe to grind. Both have varying levels of truth to speak (and both do speak truth!). Both are important in a democracy. Both drive me crazy more often than not.

Here's the thing, though: as I've watched Moore over the years, it seems like he's *as much* about Michael Moore as he is about whatever topic he's choosing to film. Not that there aren't tons of narcissists in Hollywood. But one must take his attitudes into consideration when viewing his films. People call his work "documentaries", but I'd say they're at least as close to "propaganda" as they are to documentaries.

This isn't necessarily bad. People think of propaganda as always bad, but it can be useful for people of any political or social stripe. The danger comes when people viewing it take it as gospel truth.

Many people are not able to distinguish between works that ignore/whitewash/gloss over/prettify pertinent facts to make a point and those that strive for as much fairness as possible.

Total objectivity is not possible, because we are human, and even if we try to get all sides, we will still be somewhat limited by our own perceptions. But there *is* a level of objectivity that is preferable when making serious arguments.

I don't know that Fahrenheit 9/11 is a serious argument. By that I mean, I don't think MM is trying to fully and fairly *argue* his point. I think that he has a point to make, and he uses whatever means necessary to drive it home at the intensity he wants.

It's important for us to know that neither the Bush administration's position nor F 9/11 is the whole story. Think about it: Saddam was a bad guy for a long time. War smells of elderberries. The US has interests (economic AND political: it's not *only* about oil) in the Middle East. The Iraqis get the short end of the stick whether Saddam is in power or they're getting bombed. The US is rebuilding infrastructure in Iraq--not just what we destroyed, but stuff that wasn't there before. The Iraqi people don't have to live in fear of Saddam any more; however, their gov't. still has problems. American soldiers are good; some American soldiers commit war crimes.

People are human: complicated and messy. Capable of evil and glory. Propaganda on either side is not the full picture. Remember that.

MG

[Iacobus]

LD... look up UNOCAL. Bush was on its borad. And so was Bush's daddy.

I say again, Moore loves America. Al Franken loves America. That is why they are making what they make. They see America as being abused and mislead, rightly so in my mind. They think America is being mislead by this fool in the White House from coperate big America who doesn't concern himself with policy and diploamcay. I want to see Bush gone. I don't want to see Kerry there, but I want Bush gone and someone better in office. Like I have said before, if Bush loses, it is the GOPs falut for putting Mr. Kerry into office by failing to nom a better canaditne.

[Lounge Daddy]

[quote name='Iacobus' date='Jun 29 2004, 02:47 PM'] LD... look up UNOCAL. Bush was on its borad. And so was Bush's daddy.

I say again, Moore loves America. Al Franken loves America. That is why they are making what they make. They see America as being abused and mislead, rightly so in my mind. They think America is being mislead by this fool in the White House from coperate big America who doesn't concern himself with policy and diploamcay. I want to see Bush gone. I don't want to see Kerry there, but I want Bush gone and someone better in office. Like I have said before, if Bush loses, it is the GOPs falut for putting Mr. Kerry into office by failing to nom a better canaditne. [/quote]
[font="Courier"]Ok – I looked it up briefly and only got a bunch of conspiracy sites trying to tie Halliburton in with the Illuminate.

I’ll spend more time on this tomorrow – but if you have a good link to share right now, send it.
But it is a good point that Moore left out a heavy detail – Clinton was very involved with that meeting.
I guess that would have been more worthy of mention if Clinton were a Republican.[/font]

[Iacobus]

I shall dig up a link if I can find it. Right now I have to go to work.