Consecrated virginity question

[ToJesusMyHeart]

 Is Catholicism the only institution that has the vocation of consecrated virginity? Does the Orthodox church have consecrated virgins? I know they have nuns, but do they have CVs? 

 

Thanks.

[Sponsa-Christi]

1 hour ago, ToJesusMyHeart said:

 Is Catholicism the only institution that has the vocation of consecrated virginity? Does the Orthodox church have consecrated virgins? I know they have nuns, but do they have CVs? 

 

Thanks.

I'm not an expert in Orthodoxy (or even on Eastern Catholicism for that matter), but as far as I know Catholicism is the only branch of Christianity that has CVs.

I haven't researched this particular topic that extensively, but my impression is that the consecration of virgins might be a primarily a Latin Catholic thing. As in, I think the Rite of Consecration to a Life of Virginity mainly developed out of the Latin liturgical tradition. I know the Code of Canons of the Eastern Churches (the counterpart of our Code of Canon Law for Eastern Catholics) mentions that individual Eastern Churches can decide in their own specific sets of laws whether they want consecrated virgins and/or consecrated widows.

However, I personally have never seen a specifically Eastern liturgy for the consecration of virgins. My impression--which may very well be wrong, because again, I haven't taken the time to look too deeply into this--is that Eastern Catholic CVs are often consecrated with the Latin Rite of Consecration. 

[God's Beloved]

The Anglican Church does have the Order of virgins. In UK they encourage ecumenical communication between Catholic and Anglican consecrated virgins, although Anglican theology has a liberal approach.

Ancient history shows varying theologies for the dedication or consecration of virgins, in different local churches. Vatican II also developed the ecclesiology of Local church which is more decentralized.  Hence the Order of virgins is understood and lived in many many ways according to what the bishop and consecrated virgins/s decide in each diocese. Even the consecrated virgins within the same diocese can be called to live the vocation in different ways according to God's will.  The essence of the vocation however, remains non negotiable.  

The Syrian tradition of virgins is very beautiful. There are several books on their theology of the vocation. In ancient history, the Order of virgins was a socioliturgical category, not necessarily tied to a common rite of consecration.

Edited July 17, 2017 by God's Beloved

[Laurie]

Throwing this out there in case anyone has thoughts on it. The Vatican conference in Rome occurring in these present days (“Consecration & Consecration by Means of the Evangelical Counsels”) got me to thinking about the purpose of the evangelical counsels.

It seems to me that two things are true. One is the primacy of the counsels, whether in the form of vows in religious life, or the spirit of the counsels as embraced by all the baptized faithful, in the life & history of the Church, and in the salvation of her members. The second is a (not infrequent)tendency, I think, to emphasize the formally vowed counsels over & above what they signify.

By that, I mean that often the vowed evangelical counsels are seen as an equivalent to sequela Christi. Of course, following Christ as poor, chaste & obedient is beautiful, fitting, and necessary for each of our salvations (whether we are vowed religious or not). But to distill Christ Himself down to His being poor, chaste & obedient – and likewise to boil our walking with Him, and our conformity to Him & His will, down to our being poor, chaste, and obedient "like He was" – can be *harmful.

These thoughts have occurred to me because there are some who like to “rank” the vocations. E.g., They see publically vowing the counsels as “best,” privately promising the counsels as “second best,” and “merely” living the spirit of the counsels as not up to snuff, at least for someone who has made a serious commitment to being holy. I think most of us here would agree that such ideas are false, and immature, but in trying to drill down to the assumptions underpinning such attitudes, I realized there is at times a larger (and often undiagnosed) error of raising the counsels up as if they themselves are equivalent to sequela Christi (and this, I think, occurs not infrequently, by well-educated & well-intentioned & not immature people).

My point is, the counsels are meant to elucidate, not exhaust, primary ways in which we can follow, and be conformed to, Christ. (Related to this is the fact that the evangelical counsels serve the virtue of charity. They don’t, in and of themselves, equal charity -- just as they don’t guarantee holiness or salvation -- but rather they exist to help bring charity about in our souls -- i.e., a radical love of and devotion to Christ).

*This distinction, regarding the counsels existing to serve & bring about charity in our lives & souls, gets to the heart of what I mean by “harmful” above. It’s harmful to a person’s human & spiritual progress if he or she gets the erroneous idea that practicing poverty, or chastity, or obedience in itself brings about holiness or conformity to Christ. (E.g., Fasting due to a vow or spirit of poverty may or may not bring one in conformity with Christ. It depends on many things: What is Christ’s will for that person? Is the person doing the fasting out of pure intentions, or vanity, or a mix of both? Etc.)

The gathering in Rome includes religious and other consecrated, including consecrated virgins in the world & members of secular institutes. The latter two are frequently misunderstood, since as consecrated persons, they often don’t exhibit, for others to observe easily as is the case with religious, a life informed by the counsels. From there it’s sometimes assumed that a consecrated person’s sequela Christi is reducible to the ways the evangelical counsels are readily discernible in his or her life, with the conclusion that less “visible” living of the counsels = a less than ideal sequela Christi.

It’s an error that arises in prioritizing the counsels in and above Christ Himself and each of our conformity to Him. (A related point is that Christ was, Himself, hidden for most of His life. We could make the case that imitating Him in a hidden way, as the secular institutes do, is no less noble an imitation of Him than the religious who manifest His public witness.)

[Laurie]

Life is fascinating.

I have a few friends in Rome, clergy & consecrated, attending the Vatican conference (“Consecration & Consecration by Means of the Evangelical Counsels”) that I mentioned in my earlier post. No sooner did I create that post than I received several updates on today’s discussions and proceedings. Turns out, much of the topic of my post was discussed today at the Vatican!

One attendee asked whether a virgin who is consecrated by her bishop also somehow implicitly vows the three evangelical counsels during the liturgy of consecration. (Note that there’s not a spot in the liturgy where the virgin makes a profession. The question was asking, more or less: During a virgin’s consecration by the bishop, isn’t she at least implicitly making vows?)

The answer was: No, in being consecrated by her bishop, the virgin does not implicitly vow the counsels. The respondent then went on to say that the consecration of a virgin by her bishop predates the existence of the profession of vows; that the evangelical counsels apply to everyone, including the laity, not just consecrated persons; and that there were many other counsels in the Life of Christ that a disciple embraces, and sequela Christi can’t be reduced to the three vows of poverty, chastity, and obedience.

[Guest]

  Some good comments in the above posts - thank you.  Really looking forward to this thread unfolding further.

[Laurie]

You're welcome, Barbara!

If anyone is interested, in the near future (when I find the time) I can create a transcript of the sessions from the conference recordings, plus a translation of the transcript, so anyone whose interested can read what was actually said (versus someone else's summary, which is also good, but not as useful as a verbatim account). I'll create a Google Drive link that anyone in the world can view & post the link here.

[Guest]

Thank you - I am interested but I don't know what a Google Drive is.   I had a look at a YouTube instruction video, but it looks too complex for me (I am not at all computer literate per se).

I will have to be content to follow the posts here on Phatmass.

Must admit, "higher" "better" "more noble" and the like don't mean much to me personally - not to state that there is no such theological determinations that are quite valid..........."important" might be another matter dependant on the context.  It is that age old problem that if I desire to give my whole self to Christ, then I have to enter consecrated life.

Quote

Laurie posted: "that the evangelical counsels apply to everyone, including the laity, not just consecrated persons; and that there were many other counsels in the Life of Christ that a disciple embraces, and sequela Christi can’t be reduced to the three vows of poverty, chastity, and obedience."

The above, I think, is important but not generally understood - certainly not understood often by laity but not only laity.    I do think it is very important that it is understood across all vocations in The Church.  I do think too that if one is sincerely striving to live a Gospel orientated life with Christ, one will be living out a form of poverty, chastity and obedience and perhaps without realising it.

_______________________

We seem to have lost the "Quote This" facility.

[Laurie]

Don't worry! a "Google Drive link" sounds intimidating & fancy, but it isn't. It would simply be a link that I'd post here, and you'd click on, like you do for any website. It'd take you straight to the items I mention so you can read them if you want. It's a way to share the information without creating dozens of posts here at once on Phatmass. Those who wanted could also download the documents from the link if they wanted to.

Take a look: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1DPRKnNpFNdL-Yatb4bjjcAIzaUzd1mDv_GDWAj42Sw4/edit?usp=sharing

 

Edited May 11, 2018 by Laurie

[Guest]

Thank you very much, Laurie     ..............pheww............ I really would be interested.

Just clicked on to the link..............Greetings to you also and another thank you...........you are quite correct, easy as!

[Laurie]

To follow up on my post here. The videos of the conference are now available & I have an English translation for the Q&A I mention above.

The priest answering the question is Fr. Sebastiano Paciolla, O. Cist. He is the Undersecretary for the Congregation for Institutes of Consecrated Life and for Societies of Apostolic Life. He is also a canon lawyer who serves as a Promotor of Justice on the Tribunal of the Roman Rota. He is also the rector of his Cistercian monastery in Rome.

 He gives a longish & roundabout answer (as many Italian scholars do in speaking!).

[The bolded parts are where Fr. Paciolla was emphatic in his responses.]

-------------------------------

Question from a conference attendee. “I'd like to ask my question in English. I'm a consecrated virgin from the United States; I'm also a canon lawyer, and I would like to ask Father whether in the Order of Virgins -- consecrated virgins don’t literally profess the vows of poverty, chastity, and obedience – [but] the propositum of virginity [intention of virginity] is a gift with respect to one's own life and oneself, and so I ask whether it is possible to conceive of it [the propositum] as implicitly including all the [evangelical] counsels -- this is my question."

Response from Fr. Sebastiano Paciolla. "Regarding the Order of Virgins, we have said [earlier in the conference] that this form of consecration of virgins is a very ancient, pre-Christian form - those who best sung its praises were Ambrose, and some of both the Western and Eastern Fathers [of the Church] - it is a dedication, a holy intention, a service to the Church, [at a time] when the matter of the three evangelical counsels had not yet been raised. My own [religious] rule [of life] does not make me profess poverty, chastity and obedience because it was written much earlier than that Medieval synthesis -- to which we are all debtors -- and which understood, among the many evangelical counsels which are offered by the person and example of our teacher and Lord, some as more characteristic [of religious life], because the patience of Christ, the humility of Christ and so on, are likewise evangelical counsels that take their inspiration from the person and life of the Lord, from the word of the Lord.

Then, [regarding] this thing here too, let's not forget that the evangelical counsels are given for the entire Church; religious embrace them with a public vow, other forms [of consecrated life] [embrace them] according to the way in which the statutes or their own law foresee the assumption of the evangelical counsels, but the "evangelical counsel" as such is a gift God has given to the Church.

Then, the three evangelical counsels that have been understood as more characteristic of the life of Christ – today we no longer speak of the imitation of Christ, we speak of following Christ [Sequela Christi], but you should know that in the Medieval world, and above all in the monastic Medieval world, it was not scandalous to speak of the "imitation of Christ" - in any case, we speak of this following – a warning here! Because sometimes, also in [theological] manuals, in certain things, this following seems to be something romantic, while we find the objective contents of this following through the contents of the evangelical counsels, which are for the whole Church, but which for us religious are described in three canons, in which in four lines you have the theological foundation and the juridical consequence of the evangelical counsel, which the religious embrace through a public vow, and the vow, canon 1191 reminds us, is a promise made to God regarding a possible and better good.

And since a promise made to God must be fulfilled in virtue of [the virtue of] religion. The ancient notion, and there are some who claim the source of this is St. Thomas Aquinas, is taken up by the Code [of Canon Law], because many times we [religious] make our profession and we no longer know how to distinguish between the virtue of poverty, the evangelical counsel of poverty, and the vow of poverty; here I'm not interested in posing questions, but many times it's embarrassing to pose these questions to persons who are said to be consecrated in a specific form, and they don't know how to describe the content of their consecration.”

---------------------------

In a nutshell, Fr. Paciolla’s response is that the consecration of virgins arose long before professing the counsels even existed [Conclusion: No, CVs don’t profess vows because CVs were consecrated by the Church long before anyone professed any vows.] Even Fr. Paciolla, in his own order, didn’t profess these vows, because his order [Cistercians] existed before the profession of these three particular counsels even came into existence. The evangelical counsels consist of following Our Lord. There are many more counsels than just poverty, chastity & obedience (Fr. Paciolla mentions patience and humility). The evangelical counsels are a gift to the entire Church. Religious profess them publicly & other consecrated embrace them in various ways. There is a [not good] tendency to romanticize the evangelical counsels. Religious vow them publicly, but they are for the entire Church, not just religious. [Note well, they are not just for consecrated persons.] It is troublesome that there are consecrated persons in the Church who do not understand the nature of their own consecrations.

 

The theologian who did the English translation above had a piercing insight. His observation is: Father’s answer is that we should not consider these three specific evangelical virtues as ‘implicitly vowed’ in the consecration of virgins, but instead as implicit in one's being Christian (implicit in one's very baptism).