P3chrmd Posted June 24, 2004 Share Posted June 24, 2004 Hi guys, I was just thinking about the end times! I was wondering where and how are Our Lady will play in the whole thing! Any ideas.... Will she be at the right hand of Jesus on the throne (like I believe she is now)...or what do you guys think? (Non-catholics...sorry...this is just a question for my catholic friends! Feel free to answer your way...but just needing fellow catholic imput ) GOD BLESS! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archbishop 10-K Posted June 24, 2004 Share Posted June 24, 2004 Haven't really thought about the BVM in the whole course of things there. I don't think she could be on the right hand of Jesus since Jesus is on the right hand of the Father, and doing that again would just look kinda corny. My mental image of the Judgement Day is like this: a massive courtroom with the Father as the Judge. Satan is the prosecutor. Jesus is the defense attorney, but only if you accepted Him in life. If you didn't, then you'll have to speak for yourself. The angels and the saints are where the jury sits, I guess. I'm not really sure, though. I'll need this checked for orthodoxy, cause it might be the Son instead of the Father as judge, or them sitting side by side, or whatever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StColette Posted June 24, 2004 Share Posted June 24, 2004 hmmm I've thought about this a little and my thought is that Our Lady will be there to comfort as she always has. Being motherly and loving even at the end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P3chrmd Posted June 24, 2004 Author Share Posted June 24, 2004 Good points both of you! As far as the heavenly kigdom goes...I have always pictured Mary at the right of Jesus on the throne...because that is always where the Queen was in OT times...and since the Messianic kingdom mirrors the davidic kingdom, I just figured..... Oh well! Would love to hear more peoples ideas of the heavenly kingdom/judgement day! Its interesting to discuss...cause one day we will see how right we are? LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mary's Knight, La Posted June 24, 2004 Share Posted June 24, 2004 really if you want to apply visual imagery you would have the 3 co-equal persons of God highest on the dais though i'm not quite sure where the Spirit would be... mary would be to the right and lower on the dais at least that's how i understand a throneroom image to be... the problem i run into in trying construct a visual image is that God and mary would both be running to embrace us unless our sins are before us and thus blocking our way to them. Jesus is the way to heaven therefore if we cannot reach His loving embrace we cannot enter heaven interesting (maybe) off topic point... the best demonstration of sin i saw was in a skit in which when a person sinned the sin (represented by a person) stood between them and Jesus forcing the person further away from Jesus... for a less visual bent her role in salvation *is* that of a mother constantly encourage us (her children) to do the right thing but respecting our freedom of choice however if we say "mom please help" she'll do what she can to help us get to Jesus it's not that she stands between us and Jesus in the way but that she stands off to the side between us and Jesus ready to rush in should we need the help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmotherofpirl Posted June 25, 2004 Share Posted June 25, 2004 I hope she is there holding my hand like any good mother would do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P3chrmd Posted June 25, 2004 Author Share Posted June 25, 2004 Me too! When Im standing at the gates...and St. Peter says "Hmmm....I don't know about this one!?!" then Our Lady will come up behind him and say "Shhhhh....he is with me!!!" OH WOW... This is why I said consicration to Our Lady...I want her to be their holding my hand when I get through the gates of heaven...taking me to her son!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StColette Posted June 25, 2004 Share Posted June 25, 2004 This has to be one of my favorite threads on the whole board since at the moment I'm writing a tract on the History of the Devotion to the Virgin Mary. Good to see so many feel so close to and comforted by her. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MorphRC Posted June 25, 2004 Share Posted June 25, 2004 Why dont you read Revelation. "the problem i run into in trying construct a visual image is that God and mary would both be running to embrace us unless our sins are before us and thus blocking our way to them." Huh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MorphRC Posted June 25, 2004 Share Posted June 25, 2004 [b]Judgment Verses in Revelation:[/b] [b]Revelation 14:7[/b] He said in a loud voice, "Fear God and give him glory, because the hour of his judgment has come. Worship him who made the heavens, the earth, the sea and the springs of water." [b]Revelation 16[/b] 4The third angel poured out his bowl on the rivers and springs of water, and they became blood. 5Then I heard the angel in charge of the waters say: "You are just in these judgments, you who are and who were, the Holy One, because you have so judged; 6for they have shed the blood of your saints and prophets, and you have given them blood to drink as they deserve." [b]Revelation 16:7[/b] And I heard the altar respond: "Yes, Lord God Almighty, true and just are your judgments." [b]Revelation 19:2[/b] for true and just are his judgments. He has condemned the great prostitute who corrupted the earth by her adulteries. He has avenged on her the blood of his servants." The Only remote mention of Mary in the Revelation book is in Rev 12:1. But thats thought to be more the Church and not mary, since the verses after, state 'labour pangs' and if Mary was without sin there were no labour pangs, because they are a punishment for original Sin, adam and all that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ICTHUS Posted June 25, 2004 Share Posted June 25, 2004 [quote]since the verses after, state 'labour pangs' and if Mary was without sin there were no labour pangs, because they are a punishment for original Sin, adam and all that. [/quote] Not necessarily. If she labors in prayer to bring forth the full number of the Elect, that could be 'labour pains', metaphorically. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Huether Posted June 25, 2004 Share Posted June 25, 2004 (edited) [quote name='ICTHUS' date='Jun 25 2004, 08:14 AM'] Not necessarily. If she labors in prayer to bring forth the full number of the Elect, that could be 'labour pains', metaphorically. [/quote] Also, doesn't Genesis state that God INCREASED labor pains. Not necessarily ADDED. So there still was pain before, but not as bad... But I think that Revelations isn't refering to Mary's physical pain. Her labor pain, when giving birth to God incarnate, was the pain in realizing that He would die for Her. Edited June 25, 2004 by Jake Huether Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ICTHUS Posted June 25, 2004 Share Posted June 25, 2004 [quote name='Archbishop 10-K' date='Jun 24 2004, 12:00 PM']Haven't really thought about the BVM in the whole course of things there. I don't think she could be on the right hand of Jesus since Jesus is on the right hand of the Father, and doing that again would just look kinda corny. My mental image of the Judgement Day is like this: a massive courtroom with the Father as the Judge. Satan is the prosecutor. Jesus is the defense attorney, but only if you accepted Him in life. If you didn't, then you'll have to speak for yourself. The angels and the saints are where the jury sits, I guess. I'm not really sure, though. I'll need this checked for orthodoxy, cause it might be the Son instead of the Father as judge, or them sitting side by side, or whatever.[/quote] 1 Cor 15:24-28 24Then the end will come, when he hands over the kingdom to God the Father after he has destroyed all dominion, authority and power. 25For he must reign until he has put all his enemies under his feet. 26The last enemy to be destroyed is death. 27For he "has put everything under his feet."[3] Now when it says that "everything" has been put under him, it is clear that this does not include God himself, who put everything under Christ. 28When he has done this, [b]then [u]the Son himself will be made subject to him[/u] who put everything under him[/b], so that God may be all in all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P3chrmd Posted June 26, 2004 Author Share Posted June 26, 2004 The Labor Pains are metophoric!!! They represent "And a sword will pierce your own soul too" when Jesus died...the pain she went through! Because right after she has those pains and gives birth to the child...he is "caught up to heaven" (Christs' assending into heaven) so its ALL metophoric The labor pains are the pains that Mary (the woman) suffered because of her sons death!!! The woman from Rev. also symbolizes Isreal AND the Church! Because Mary is the PERFECT daughter of Zion...and represents ALL God's people (Mother of the Living!) and it is the Church...because Mary is the mother of the Church and a symbol!!!! See...by saying the woman is Mary...you are saying that it is Isreal and the Church! But to JUST say it is one or the other does not work!k Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MorphRC Posted June 26, 2004 Share Posted June 26, 2004 Either way. I dont think Mary will have a role as many people are making it to be. To be honest of all the Mariam tracts and Church father statements in the 1st->4th century, I cant remember anything so out-of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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