Rome wakes up to find city full of anti-Pope Francis posters

[Ash Wednesday]

On one hand, yes, people need to show charity and respect towards the Pontiff and his office when voicing criticism or concern -- on the other hand, there is nothing gained from being condescending towards those who are concerned. 

[truthfinder]

I have to wonder to what degree that fact that this is apparently a longstanding Roman tradition and that the posters are in the Roman dialect. Francis is pope, but he is also the bishop of Rome - and these posters seem to be coming from his direct parishioners. 

[CountrySteve21]

20 hours ago, bardegaulois said:

Would you care to enlighten us as to what these are?

For starters, there is the more civilized approach, which is writing a letter. Secondly, we need to remember when all is said and done, we do owe obedience to the Pope as are spiritual father; even if we don't get our way about something. 

[bardegaulois]

1 minute ago, CountrySteve21 said:

For starters, there is the more civilized approach, which is writing a letter. Secondly, we need to remember when all is said and done, we do owe obedience to the Pope as are spiritual father; even if we don't get our way about something. 

As Nihil Obstat noted, certain cardinals did. They have received no response. So what next?

[Peace]

1 minute ago, CountrySteve21 said:

Secondly, we need to remember when all is said and done, we do owe obedience to the Pope as are spiritual father; even if we don't get our way about something. 

Nope! I will have you know that we here at Phatmass are obedient to the Pope only to the extent that he agrees with our own private interpretations of what the Church really teaches.

11 minutes ago, bardegaulois said:

As Nihil Obstat noted, certain cardinals did. They have received no response. So what next?

Prayer.

[Nihil Obstat]

20 minutes ago, Peace said:

Prayer.

Well that and, apparently, a formal correction to be written by those same cardinals. Deo volente.

[bardegaulois]

9 hours ago, truthfinder said:

I have to wonder to what degree that fact that this is apparently a longstanding Roman tradition and that the posters are in the Roman dialect. Francis is pope, but he is also the bishop of Rome - and these posters seem to be coming from his direct parishioners. 

They could be. Or certain curialists, for obvious reasons unwilling to speak on record, could be alarmed by what they see as Francis's abuse of power and see no recourse except direct public appeal. Romans about their daily errands are far more likely to see these posters than Francis or anyone within his close circle is. Moreover, the posters are written in the local idiom. We can, of course, not tell for sure, but the possibility that this could be an appeal by curialists (or other clergy or Knights of Malta or such) with little other recourse merits some examination.

[truthfinder]

50 minutes ago, bardegaulois said:

They could be. Or certain curialists, for obvious reasons unwilling to speak on record, could be alarmed by what they see as Francis's abuse of power and see no recourse except direct public appeal. Romans about their daily errands are far more likely to see these posters than Francis or anyone within his close circle is. Moreover, the posters are written in the local idiom. We can, of course, not tell for sure, but the possibility that this could be an appeal by curialists (or other clergy or Knights of Malta or such) with little other recourse merits some examination.

Sorry - could you explain what you mean by 'curialists' - I'm not sure if something's being lost in translation, but I'm not sure who you're referring to.

[Peace]

1 hour ago, Nihil Obstat said:

Well that and, apparently, a formal correction to be written by those same cardinals. Deo volente.

Lo, but if only the cardinals were correct!

[Amppax]

22 minutes ago, Peace said:

Lo, but if only the cardinals were correct!

You've been extra snarky lately. Phatmass got you down? 

[bardegaulois]

45 minutes ago, truthfinder said:

Sorry - could you explain what you mean by 'curialists' - I'm not sure if something's being lost in translation, but I'm not sure who you're referring to.

Sorry to be vague. I mean priests and prelates working in the Roman Curia. In this context, it might be expanded to include those teaching in Pontifical Universities and priests regular on duty in the generalates of their orders.

[Spem in alium]

Hmm. I have my own feelings about the whole situation with the Order of Malta. I'm intimately connected with the Order and so have been quite involved in what's been going on. In some ways, I think the Pope was right to intervene and that Fra' Festing showed great humility and obedience in resigning. I don't feel it's Cardinal Burke's role to be involved so much in those matters -- so in my view he's not been sidelined or stripped of a job. It is certainly a frustrating situation, though, and putting up posters is certainly a less harmful way of getting a message across. It's clear that the Church needs prayer.

 

Edited February 7, 2017 by Spem in alium

[truthfinder]

49 minutes ago, bardegaulois said:

Sorry to be vague. I mean priests and prelates working in the Roman Curia. In this context, it might be expanded to include those teaching in Pontifical Universities and priests regular on duty in the generalates of their orders.

Thanks. I'm just wondering to the extent that those in the curia would do this. I mean it's not impossible but it would be easy to track this sort of thing back to them if they did, and it certainly wouldn't do them any favours. 

[Nihil Obstat]

2 hours ago, Spem in alium said:

Hmm. I have my own feelings about the whole situation with the Order of Malta. I'm intimately connected with the Order and so have been quite involved in what's been going on. In some ways, I think the Pope was right to intervene and that Fra' Festing showed great humility and obedience in resigning. I don't feel it's Cardinal Burke's role to be involved so much in those matters -- so in my view he's not been sidelined or stripped of a job. It is certainly a frustrating situation, though, and putting up posters is certainly a less harmful way of getting a message across. It's clear that the Church needs prayer.

 

Legally speaking Pope Francis had no right to do what he did. Am I misinformed?

[Guest]

 

On Roman Posters, Papal Blowback and parallels with Trump