Stuff Josh finds on the internet: Now all in one thread!

[Guest]

Everyone supports gay marriage. I read a poll of Catholics under 30 and it was a ridiculous high amount. Like 80 percent or something. Sad.

Edited January 18, 2017 by Guest

[Guest]

Just found the numbers. 57 percent of all Catholics support gay marriage. 75 percent support it between the ages 18 to 29. And 60 percent support it who go to Mass every week.

Edited January 18, 2017 by Guest

[Guest]

20 minutes ago, Nihil Obstat said:

I have heard that the Church in Australia is horrendously liberal, particularly in the cities.

Spot on in my book and to my experience in other Catholic matters!  I don't know why for sure I do not know any real life practising Catholics who condone anything related to homosexual sexual activity matters.  I can only guess at perhaps/possible/potential reasons. 

[Guest]

Comment:

I have finally been able to post this without the 403 Error Message - some editing, not much, from the original.......

 

I am certainly very much against gay 'marriage'.

I find the first image in Josh's Opening Post disturbing on a Catholic Discussion site  -  and quite concerning because of children surfing the net.  My post in response was not impulsive nor a knee jerk type of reaction, I carefully chose how to word and present the post hopefully for maximum impact - and then hit submit.  Yeah I was disturbed to see that first image in this thread on Phatmass and in my book expressed my disturbed disposition appropriately with calm and logic seeking maximum impact. 

Other opinions might differ -c'est la vie.  God is our only sole and only Judge always.

___________

When I posted last night, the image of Sr Lucia including "The final battle" quotation did not appear on the opening post when I first saw it last night - might have been softwear or something else technology related. I first saw the Sr Lucia etc. image in Josh's opening post this morning (now 4.54pm Sth Aust). Our Lady of Fatima and her appearance to the children - and her messages with special urgent appeal to the Universal Church for prayer and penance - is a special devotion of mine.  Not that Sr Lucia image etc. would have changed my post in essence - I would have merely added a positive comment on the image and quote.

The Rosary is a special devotion of mine.  My very very private private vows (alone in our parish Church) were made for life on the Feast of Our Lady of The Rosary deliberately chosen for very good reasons.

1 hour ago, BarbaraTherese said:

Spot on in my book and to my experience in other Catholic matters!  I don't know why for sure I do not know any real life practising Catholics who condone anything related to homosexual sexual activity matters.  I can only guess at perhaps/possible/potential reasons. 

I have wondered if people feel more free to state their true opinions online or in statistic type gathering especially if they are anonymous. 

[bardegaulois]

5 hours ago, Josh said:

@bardegaulois You Phatmass how you Phatmass I'll Phatmass how I Phatmass. You or anyone else that doesn't like it block me...

Well, if that's your attitude, then you shouldn't be surprised if others don't respond to you any longer. And if you're just posting so others will respond, it rather defeats the purpose, doesn't it?

[Guest]

Finally able to post into the "Hmm" thread.  I think it might be my computer.  I called up TASK MANAGER and noticed something different to the norm.  Wont go into it as I have no idea how to explain it in computer lingo. I closed off IE completely and then opened it again.  Had a try at posting into "Hmm" thread again and was able to post ok.

 Next time I get a 403 message, I will call up TASK MANAGER and see if the same difference is there and then close off IE and re-open and see if 403 disappears and I can post ok.

My computer might need some tweaking I think and apologies to dUSt etc. for my suspicion.

Edited January 18, 2017 by BarbaraTherese

[Guest]

8 minutes ago, bardegaulois said:

Well, if that's your attitude, then you shouldn't be surprised if others don't respond to you any longer. And if you're just posting so others will respond, it rather defeats the purpose, doesn't it?

I don't care if you respond or not. Or other people. I don't post topics to troll. I post stuff I find interesting. My style is my style. If people want to reply good. If not that's fine too. I'm not going to post the way you think is "the way to post" or whatever you're getting at. The block feature is here for a reason on Phatmass. Just block me and you won't be able to see anything I post or comment on.Take care.

Edited January 18, 2017 by Guest

[Guest]

One thing I have observed in my various Catholic parishes over latter years is confusion.  Families out here especially are stressed by many factors.  Those in the workforce are stressed.  Just living alone as I have for years is stress due to our culture and my 71years of age.  Some of those stresses are more than others.

Catholics (in this instance) are getting their information on most all matters from talk back radio, television current affairs and documentaries and in a special way through social media on the internet.  This is only an example, but if I say to them "Have you read Lumen Gentium, the Constitution on The Church?"  Invariably the reply is "What's that?".  Now I would rarely mix with educated in The Church and related matters type lay person.  My primary focus if you like, is the ordinary everyday Catholic and non Catholic.

Even in Catholic groups I belong to, there is an abundance of confusion.  The Church/Catholicism has become complex in my book.  So complex for the ordinary everyday person, they give up on understanding.  They do what they feel is right and what they are not insighting nor understanding is that "what is right" is being formed in the main by secular media of the various types I have already mentioned.  Another problem is that if a family or person, persons, living in the laity (generally speaking) and in our ordinary everyday culture does not acquire sufficient finances, they simply will not eat nor put a roof over their heads, let alone give their children if they have them what they need.  Everything costs.  Job security is not what it was and Australia in all likelihood unless the government pulls a rabbit out the hat soon is in dire straits re unemployment.

The financial stress on the poor is so dire that even our charities here are alarmed as their costs are rising as never before.  Their income (donations) dropping because people just do not have the available funds as before.  Any government support is very often being reduced as our federal government struggles to balance the budget, already in strife.

I am of course living in South Australia and I am retired, given up the ironing income, live alone and since I live in poverty under that private vow - I survive on the age pension ok.  My priorities vastly different to many I think.  I am probably in a real minority.  Nor are ordinary people at times actually reflecting upon and choosing their priorities.  Many simply have to put necessities of survival first.   Time availability too is under stress, even for simple relaxation.

I do wonder at times if our Catholic Church is in touch with all the above.

Edited January 18, 2017 by BarbaraTherese

[Guest]

http://www.christianpost.com/news/catholics-support-gay-marriage-as-much-as-general-population-and-believe-pope-francis-has-backed-it-prri-study-finds-143871/

@Nihil Obstat if a Catholic supports gay marriage and takes Communion is that sacrilegious? A mortal sin?

[Guest]

The link pretty much backs up what I said, Josh.  Catholics here (and of course as one individual only my Catholic environment is limited) are confused.  Pope Francis has not come out in favour of homosexual sexual practises nor gay marriage at all.  Confused Catholics are getting their information from the various kinds of secular media - sometimes even media claiming Catholicism.  Sometimes from those within The Church opposed to Pope Francis making public statements.

People read or hear something and very often it is the negative opinion tinged with sensationalism they will hold as truth, which is not true at all.

In the main, the Catholics with whom I come in contact are not all that well educated, certainly not in Catholic matters and interpret what they read without understanding what is really there in print or wherever.  They do not understand the nuances or even at times what exactly a word used means.

My next door neighbour, a non Catholic, and a talk back radio almost obsessed person, makes statements to me about Catholics and our beliefs she has heard on talk back as if it is unchallengeable truth.  Most of all she likes it when there is something scandalous about Catholics etc. she has heard on the radio.  Now her conversation do not exist only between her and I but they form her understandings and as truth she shares with others.  And so those others do the same with their friends, who do the same with other friends and so on it goes.

Pebble in the pool effect.  Throw a small pebble into a lake and watch how the ripples widen and widen.

It is quite in vogue and politically acceptable to be anti Catholic and Catholicism.

[Guest]

All I'm saying 60 percent of Catholics who go to Mass every week are presenting themselves unworthily to the Blessed Sacrament because of their support of gay marriage. 75 percent of Catholics 18 to 29 are presenting themselves unworthily assuming they take Communion. I'm curious what Nihil's answer is to my question. This is a huge crisis and I don't even hear it brought up. I wonder how many people here at Phatmass support gay marriage? I can think of a few who probably do off the top of my head. I bet it's way more then you expect. I wonder what the number is with priests,bishops and cardinals. I'm the biggest sinner in the world but I will NEVER support this satanic lie from the depths of hell called gay marriage. I'm ashamed and embarrassed so many "Catholics" do. How pitiful.

Edited January 18, 2017 by Guest

[Guest]

All mortal sin could be said to "be a lie that comes from the depths of hell".  It is not particular mortal sins that will condemn the soul, will make it unworthy to receive Holy Communion.  It is any mortal sin at all.

I not only hold homosexual sexual relationships as grave matter and potentially mortal sin.  I simply do not believe that two people of the same sex can be married.  I also do not support children adopted into situations that are in a same sex relationships.  I am not saying "married" because it is an impossibility, no matter what secular law states or people, Catholic or non Catholic might think. Just because secular states something, or the majority of people think something cannot make it a truth that points towards and leads to Ultimate Truth.  It is truth that points towards and leads towards Ultimate Truth, God.  It is untruth (not true or a lie from the father of liars) that points and leads away from God, Ultimate Truth.

You may not be able to fool all of the people all of the time.  It is possible for an awful lot of the people to be fooled an awful lot of the time.

There is no need for despair nor even desperation, what Pope Benedict states in his book below is a message of shock perhaps and of loss -  but finally it is a message of Hope and of Joy.  Where we are now, however, is in the "hard going" stage, not even yet the "very hard going" stage, we are not yet in to "the real crisis" - it is only just beginning. It will worsen .  Pope Benedict's predictions are supported by Scripture and the CCC.

Pope Benedict "Faith and The Future" "The Church will become small"

Quote

"She will no longer be able to inhabit many of the edifices she built in prosperity. As the number of her adherents diminishes . . . she will lose many of her social privileges. . . As a small society, [the Church] will make much bigger demands on the initiative of her individual members....

It will be hard-going for the Church, for the process of crystallization and clarification will cost her much valuable energy. It will make her poor and cause her to become the Church of the meek . . . The process will be long and wearisome as was the road from the false progressivism on the eve of the French Revolution — when a bishop might be thought smart if he made fun of dogmas and even insinuated that the existence of God was by no means certain . . . But when the trial of this sifting is past, a great power will flow from a more spiritualized and simplified Church. Men in a totally planned world will find themselves unspeakably lonely. If they have completely lost sight of God, they will feel the whole horror of their poverty. Then they will discover the little flock of believers as something wholly new. They will discover it as a hope that is meant for them, an answer for which they have always been searching in secret.

And so it seems certain to me that the Church is facing very hard times. The real crisis has scarcely begun. We will have to count on terrific upheavals. But I am equally certain about what will remain at the end: not the Church of the political cult, which is dead already, but the Church of faith. She may well no longer be the dominant social power to the extent that she was until recently; but she will enjoy a fresh blossoming and be seen as man's home, where he will find life and hope beyond death.

Edited January 18, 2017 by BarbaraTherese

[Guest]

29 minutes ago, BarbaraTherese said:

All mortal sin could be said to "be a lie that comes from the depths of hell".  

 

Yeah all mortal sins are. But this is the one that is deceiving everyone. You have 60 percent of Catholics who attend Mass every week saying they support gay marriage. 75 percent of Catholics from the age 18 to 29. Perhaps you should listen to the prophecy more carefully. No wonder Revelations warns that even the elect will be deceived. 

Between May and October 1917, Lúcia and her cousins Jacinta and Francisco Marto reported visions of a luminous lady, who they believed to be the Virgin Mary, in the Cova da Iria fields outside the hamlet of Aljustrel, near Fátima, Portugal.The children said the visitations took place on the 13th day of each month at approximately noon, for six straight months. The only exception was August, when the children were detained by the local administrator. That month they did not report a vision of the Lady until after they were released from jail, two days later.

According to Lúcia's accounts, the lady told the children to do penance and to make sacrifices to save sinners. Lúcia said that the lady stressed the importance of saying theRosary every day, to bring peace to the world.Many young Portuguese men, including relatives of the visionaries, were then fighting in World War I.Lúcia heard Mary ask her to learn to read and write because Jesus wanted to employ her to convey messages to the world about Mary, particularly the Immaculate Heart of Mary.

Lúcia's mother did not take kindly to the news that her youngest daughter was having visitations, believing that Lúcia was simply making up lies for attention.Lúcia suffered beatings and ridicule from her mother. She was especially incredulous of the idea that Lúcia had been asked to learn to read and write.

The Three Secrets

On July 13, 1917, around noon, the lady is said to have entrusted the children with three secrets. Two of the secrets were revealed in 1941 in a document written by Lúcia, at the request of the Bishop of Leiria, José Alves Correia da Silva, partly to assist with the publication of a new edition of a book on Jacinta.

On January 25, 1938, a massive aurora borealis, described variously as "a curtain of fire" and a "huge blood-red beam of light," appeared in the skies over Europe and was visible as far away as Gibraltar and even parts of the United States.Lúcia believed this event was the "night illuminated by a strange light in the sky" which she had heard Mary speak about as part of the Second Secret, predicting the events which would lead to the Second World War and requesting Acts of Reparation including theFirst Saturday Devotions, along with theConsecration of Russia.

When asked by José Alves Correia da Silva,Bishop of Leiria in 1943 to reveal the third secret, Lúcia struggled for a short period, being "not yet convinced that God had clearly authorized her to act."She was under strict obedience in accordance with her Carmelite life, and conflicted as to whether she should obey her superiors, or the personal orders she had heard from Mary. However, in October 1943 she fell ill with influenza and pleurisy, the same illness which had killed her cousins, and for a time believed she was about to die. Bishop Da Silva then ordered her to put the third secret in writing.Lúcia then wrote down the secret and sealed it in an envelope not to be opened until 1960. She designated 1960 because she thought that "by then it will appear clearer."The text of the third secret was officially released byPope John Paul II in 2000. The Vatican described the secret as a vision of the 1981 assassination attempt on Pope John Paul II.

Miracle of the Sun

The visions increasingly received wide publicity, and an estimated fifty thousand witnesses were reportedly present for the sixth and final apparition.Lúcia had promised for several months that the lady would perform a miracle on that day "so that all may believe." Witnesses present in the Cova da Iria that day, as well as some up to 25 miles (40 km) away,reported that the sun appeared to change colors and rotate, like a fire wheel, casting off multicolored light across the landscape. The sun appeared to plunge towards the earth, frightening many into believing that it was the end of the world.Others suggested they had merely witnessed an eclipse.The popular expression, according to the O Séculoreporter Avelino de Almeida, was that the sun "danced."The event became known as theMiracle of the Sun. The episode was widely reported by the Portuguese secular media. Some coverage appeared in a small article in the New York Times on October 17, 1917.Lúcia reported that day that the Lady identified herself as "Our Lady of the Rosary." She thereafter also became known as Our Lady of Fátima.

On behalf of the Catholic Church, Bishop Da Silva, approved the visions as "worthy of belief" on October 13, 1930.

Edited January 18, 2017 by Guest

[little2add]

https://www.ewtn.com/fatima/children.asp 

i believe 

May 13, 2017 will be 100 years since the vision.   it's a Saturday 

[Nihil Obstat]

7 hours ago, Josh said:

http://www.christianpost.com/news/catholics-support-gay-marriage-as-much-as-general-population-and-believe-pope-francis-has-backed-it-prri-study-finds-143871/

@Nihil Obstat if a Catholic supports gay marriage and takes Communion is that sacrilegious? A mortal sin?

If the support for gay marriage falls under canon 915, then that Catholic must be denied communion. To take it would be against canon law. If the support for gay marriage fell under canon 916 only then that Catholic should know not to approach for communion. In either case the reception, if it occurred, would be sacrilegious, and if knowledge and consent are present then I believe it would be mortally sinful.