Where is the evidence . . .

[Ice_nine]

that birth control and emergency contraception prevent implantation of a fertilized egg? All of the info I'm finding, on a quick search, seems to suggest there is no evidence that they do. I'd prefer scientific evidence rather than from those with an agenda (however righteous that agenda may be).

Which begs the question about how we should view contraception in terms of public policy. I know what the church teaches about contraception and I assent to that. I understand it is a moral evil. However, if access to contraception does not prevent implantation and is correlated with a decline in the abortion rate would a Catholic have to necessarily oppose legislation that seeks to make it more available? In a similar vein, whenever I've asked "if comprehensive sex education decreases the abortion rate, could we tolerate that lesser evil in the face of a greater one?"

The response I seem to get from internet Catholics is "well sex ed/birth control does NOT decrease abortions" followed by some seemingly valid philosophical arguments about the "contraceptive mentality" with zero data to back up these assertions.

Just curious. I found a decent article written by a Catholic on whether the abortion rates/ratios differ under republican vs democratic presidents (spoiler alert: they do not). But it's conclusion (voting democrat is still harmful) is partially predicated on the alleged fact that emergency contraception can reject a fertilized egg and I'm just not sure there is evidence for that.

And if there is not evidence, I don't understand our obsession over making it less accessible.

 

[truthfinder]

For question about implantation see http://planb.ca/how-it-works.html

HOW DOES THE PLAN B^® MORNING-AFTER PILL WORK?

plan B^® comes in a one-pill dose. If taken within 72 hours (3 days) and preferably within 12 hours after a contraceptive accident or unprotected sex, it can prevent pregnancy by doing one of three things:

• Temporarily stops the release of an egg from the ovary
• Prevents fertilization
• Prevents a fertilized egg from attaching to the uterus

Last point is exactly that - it prevents implantation. 

[Ice_nine]

yeah that's pretty damning. From the plan b site itself. But where is the scientific evidence that it does?

That's not evidence it's just a claim.

[Peace]

30 minutes ago, Ice_nine said:

yeah that's pretty damning. From the plan b site itself. But where is the scientific evidence that it does?

That's not evidence it's just a claim.

Come on now.

I'm not convinced that the Church forbids contraception outside of marriage, though (beyond Her general prohibition on fornication). There is a thread somewhere on the site, in which were discussing the Q after Pope Francis made his comments about using contraception to prevent the spread of the Zika virus.

But woe to anyone who wants to get into that debate again.

[dUSt]

The church doesn't condemn contraception because it helps control population, it condemns contraception because it is a moral evil. You might as well argue against legislation that prohibits theft or drug trafficking. Laws should be based on principles that protect society. Contraception does the opposite. It harms society.

[Quasar]

As a sidenote, the pill is used to treat medical conditions, not just to contracept.   I don't think the pill should be banned when it has morally licit therapeutic uses.  Plan B is different though.

[Ice_nine]

23 hours ago, dUSt said:

The church doesn't condemn contraception because it helps control population, it condemns contraception because it is a moral evil. You might as well argue against legislation that prohibits theft or drug trafficking. Laws should be based on principles that protect society. Contraception does the opposite. It harms society.

I argue against laws that prohibit drug trafficking all the time. And I refer to Aquinas while doing so.

But thanks to no one for answering the first question

If I was ever raped, unpleasant to think about, but possible, I'd like to know whether or not there is any real scientific evidence that emergency contraception can actually do anything harmful to a fertilized egg. 

Also is our primary concern about abortion the aspect of murder, or are we more concerned with the sexual immorality aspect? The responses have me wondering

 

[Quasar]

30 minutes ago, Ice_nine said:

But thanks to no one for answering the first question

If I was ever raped, unpleasant to think about, but possible, I'd like to know whether or not there is any real scientific evidence that emergency contraception can actually do anything harmful to a fertilized egg. 

 

You might have to do some work on your own to get an answer, since no one volunteered.  I'm very interested in the answer, but like you, haven't put in the time to research it.  

 

[truthfinder]

The best you're going to guess, without the scientific journals (which may or not be there) is the medical monographs saying that Plan B and others thin the endometrium.  But at the same time, life does not being at implantation, but at fertilization.  If it has occurred, there is a new life.  The reality is, that while drugs work, they are often described in terms which are not certain. In the end, we cannot do any evil to bring about a good. At this point, I think it would be prudent to assume any contraceptive is abortive, until it can be proven conclusively that it does not (and not vice versa). 

[Archaeology cat]

First, you have to understand that the scientific definition of the start of pregnancy is implantation. So if it says x does not disrupt pregnancy, that just means it won't do anything after implantation, but says nothing of whether it may prevent implantation. As far as I remember, most pill packs say that they may thin the endometrium, thus making it less likely for there to be implantation if the woman still ovulates. They do not know how often that happens, though. Breakthrough ovulation is more common with the progestin-only pill and the IUD, as evidenced by the fact that those have a higher incidence of tubal pregnancies. 

Anyway, I would think that any scientific proof would be whether the endometrium is thinned, and therefore not as hospitable for implantation. I would think it less possible to determine that it has disrupted implantation, as that would require better tests than we now have (we can determine that ovulation has happened through u/s and hormone tests, but we cannot determine that fertilisation has occurred, to my knowledge, until after implantation when hcg can be detected).

[CatherineM]

We discussed this in moral theology class. A rape places something inside you against your wishes. Going to the ER removes that. 

[Anomaly]

12 minutes ago, CatherineM said:

We discussed this in moral theology class. A rape places something inside you against your wishes. Going to the ER removes that. 

@CatherineM 

So you're saying if PlanB was only a spermicide, it is morally permissible for a Catholic.   However, if it was a spermicide and intended to harm a fertilized egg, it is not permissible for a Catholic?

[truthfinder]

1 hour ago, Anomaly said:

@CatherineM 

So you're saying if PlanB was only a spermicide, it is morally permissible for a Catholic.   However, if it was a spermicide and intended to harm a fertilized egg, it is not permissible for a Catholic?

I've seen elsewhere, that in cases of rape a true contraceptive is also permitted. It's just that we don't have any contraceptives that for certain (at least that I've seen) do not allow destroy the fertilized egg. @CatherineM - do you know anything to the contrary?

[Quasar]

1 hour ago, truthfinder said:

It's just that we don't have any contraceptives that for certain (at least that I've seen) do not allow destroy the fertilized egg. @CatherineM - do you know anything to the contrary?

Barrier methods

[truthfinder]

27 minutes ago, Quasar said:

Barrier methods

well yes, but considering I'm speaking only in terms of rape and not consensual encounters, asking one's rapist to use a condom seems a bit