Catcalling?

[LittleWaySoul]

Since living in a city for about two weeks now, I've had my first experience being "catcalled." I never expected it to make me feel so crummy. You'd think a random "compliment" would make you feel good, but when it's said in a certain tone of voice and the guy is with a couple of other guys and you're alone, it feels a lot more like some sort of veiled threat.

Anyways, I just wanted to know: does anyone know how is best to respond to stuff like this? Ignore it completely? Say thank you and move on? Tell them off? I was sort of taken aback when it happened; I was walking past these guys close by on the sidewalk, so I sort of just mumbled "thank you" and kept walking briskly. I imagine a lot of this depends on the situation, but I thought it'd be interesting to hear people's thoughts on it regardless.

[CountrySteve21]

Best to probably ignore it.  Such comments are often made by shallow men who would not be worth ones time or dignity. 

 

 

 

[beatitude]

How I react to this behaviour depends on the situation. If a group of men do it to me in an isolated street, my priority is my safety. I ignore them and I get myself out of there ASAP. But in my experience it can happen more publicly as well, and in these situations (people around to call for help if necessary) I challenge it. The other week I was sitting in the sunshine on a bench, eating an ice lolly (Popsicle to Americans) and happily minding my own business, when three men walked by and one of them asked loudly if I would give them a blow job. I was going to ignore him, but then he repeated it and said, "We'll pay!" I knew then that he wanted a reaction out of me and he was trying to embarrass me publicly. So I stood up with a beaming smile and called out equally loudly, "Do you want it bitten off? I'll do that for free!" It worked. His facial expression was priceless. A woman on the other side of the street started laughing and applauding me. The three of them carried on walking without another word to me. I was tempted to embarrass them further and run after them hollering, "Don't be shy, drop your pantaloons!" but I had my ice lolly to eat and it was far too hot to take vengeance that far, so I let them go, thinking I'd turned the tables effectively enough already. But I have been known to chase men in the street before now, once when one groped me, and once when a friend got groped. In the second instance I was also yelling for the police, and passers-by basically rugby tackled the guy and frog-marched him back to me. Again, I wish I'd had a camera to capture the look on his face. They never expect women to stand up to them like this. If you're in a safe place - and only if you know it's safe - it's worth trying to give them a lesson. It's also pretty good for your own self-confidence when you realise that you have the power to do so. Lots of women spend their lives feeling intimidated by this, and challenging it can be quite freeing. Another option is to take a photo of the guy. (Again, only if you don't feel physically threatened.) You are within your rights to report street harassment to the police, and I think harassers are also frightened of their faces ending up on social media. If you don't feel able to challenge them, just ignore, but try not to show discomfort - just act as though they are invisible to you.

Catcalling seems to happen more in cities because there is a greater sense of anonymity there (people are more likely to face unpleasant consequences if they catcall women in a small village where everyone knows everyone else, after all), and these men play on that. Remember that the reason you aren't feeling good about this is because these 'compliments' aren't compliments. They're appraisals of your body from random men who don't know you or the first thing about you, and that's degrading. Once or twice when I've ignored a catcalling man he has turned hostile and starting swearing at me, asking who I think I am, and why I can't take a compliment. Perhaps some of them really do believe they're being complimentary, but I think most of them know very well that this isn't OK. This is why I wouldn't thank them unless it was sardonic - "Why, thank you, your opinion of my backside is so significant to me and I don't know how I coped without knowing it." Don't make them think you appreciate the behaviour. It is better not to give them a reaction at all if you don't feel able to challenge it.

If it happens in a mall or a train station or somewhere like that, always alert the staff.

[Gabriela]

25 minutes ago, beatitude said:

How I react to this behaviour depends on the situation. If a group of men do it to me in an isolated street, my priority is my physical safety. I ignore them and I get myself out of there ASAP. But in my experience it can happen more publicly as well, and in these situations (people around to call for help if necessary) I challenge it. The other week I was sitting in the sunshine on a bench, eating an ice lolly (Popsicle to Americans) and happily minding my own business, when three men walked by and one of them asked loudly if I would give them a blow job. I was going to ignore him, but then he repeated it and said, "We'll pay!" I knew then that he wanted a reaction out of me and he was trying to embarrass me publicly. So I stood up with a beaming smile and called out equally loudly, "Do you want it bitten off? I'll do that for free!" It worked. His facial expression was priceless. A woman on the other side of the street started laughing and applauding me. The three of them carried on walking without another word to me. I was tempted to embarrass them further and run after them hollering, "Don't be shy, drop your pantaloons!" but I had my ice lolly to eat and it was far too hot to take vengeance that far, so I let them go, thinking I'd turned the tables effectively enough already. But I have been known to chase men in the street before now, once when one groped me, and once when a friend got groped. In the second instance I was also yelling for the police, and passers-by basically rugby tackled the guy and frog-marched him back to me. Again, I wish I'd had a camera to capture the look on his face. They never expect women to stand up to them like this. If you're in a safe place - and only if you know it's safe - it's worth trying to give them a lesson. It's also pretty good for your own self-confidence when you realise that you have the power to do so. Lots of women spend their lives feeling intimidated by this, and challenging it can be quite freeing. Another option is to take a photo of the guy. (Again, only if you don't feel physically threatened.) You are within your rights to report street harassment to the police, and I think harassers are also frightened of their faces ending up on social media. If you don't feel able to challenge them, just ignore, but try not to show discomfort - just act as though they are invisible to you.

Catcalling seems to happen more in cities because there is a greater sense of anonymity there (people are more likely to face unpleasant consequences if they catcall women in a small village where everyone knows everyone else, after all), and these men play on that. Remember that the reason you aren't feeling good about this is because these 'compliments' aren't compliments. They're appraisals of your body from random men who don't know you or the first thing about you, and that's degrading. Once or twice when I've ignored a catcalling man he has turned hostile and starting swearing at me, asking who I think I am, and why I can't take a compliment. Perhaps some of them really do believe they're being complimentary, but I think most of them know very well that this isn't OK. This is why I wouldn't thank them unless it was sardonic - "Why, thank you, your opinion of my backside is so significant to me and I don't know how I coped without knowing it." Don't make them think you appreciate the behaviour. It is better not to give them a reaction at all if you don't feel able to challenge it.

If it happens in a mall or a train station or somewhere like that, always alert the staff.

This is why I love you, beatitude!

[EmilyAnn]

I agree with beatitude - always put your safety first. If it's isoltated or late at night, say nothing and keep walking.

I'm not a confrontational person so I tend to say nothing and just walk away.  

Sadly this is a problem most of us (if not all of us) will face.

 

[Peace]

I saw this all the time when I lived in NYC. Almost all women seem to ignore. Don't even acknowledge that the person exists.

[Anomaly]

As a man, brother to four sisters, father of two daughters, I would say something to the POS's.   I think it is every moral man's responsibility to confront these jerks. 

LWS, be careful about confronting these barbarians.  They've already demonstrated they lack any social aptitude.   But in a safe environment, with others around, a comment like "Clearly you're desperate scum without manners or any appeal to males or females." seems suitable. 

[Archaeology cat]

Thank you, @Anomaly

I tend to ignore. Completely caught me off-guard when I was cat-called whilst 8 months pregnant one time

[Peace]

I dunno how I feel about this.  There was this one time I was walking though West Oakland with 2 women friends, and as we were walking by some guys said "Da@n! You got two b***ches".  Now, at this time, I felt like responding with a good old "What the F did you just say?!" followed by a few good swear words. And then someone would have had to die.

Luckily, I have enough common sense to not have done such a thing. Getting shot in the middle of the ghetto would not have been very productive. But besides the practicality of it all, I don't think that responding with "What the F did you say scumbag?" or "I will bite it off, a@@hole!" is the way that one ought to respond as a good Catholic boy or girl. It kind of seems that doing so would be dropping  oneself down to the other person's level.  It would be like when Rubio decided to go into the gutter with Trump. You saw how that worked out.

If the situation is safe and one is to confront the other person, I would guess that something along the lines of "Excuse me, why would you say something rude like that to me?" or "Why would you disrespect me like that?" might be a better way of going about it. I dunno if getting angry and calling the person a scumbag will really do the trick of getting the person to stop and think about what he is doing, and reflecting on the fact that it hurts other people. . . Not that it is an excuse, but I think that most of the guys who do this sort of thing just do not know any better. They probably never had a good father or other male role model around to show them the proper way to interact with women, so maybe some approach that might get them to stop and seriously think about what they have done might be the way to go. . .

The auto-changing of swear words on this site is excellent, by the way.

Edited September 7, 2016 by Peace

[beatitude]

Peace, I have to disagree with you here. As a woman who has been harassed more times than I care to count, I have tried the polite "Excuse me?" tactic, and it provokes laughter, derision, and further awful comments from the men involved. Some men honestly may not understand that their behaviour is bad, but the vast majority know very well that women don't like it and it isn't good (they wouldn't want it happening to any women in their lives, that's a fact), but they feel entitled to do it anyway. There aren't many men who don't realise that asking a woman to perform a sex act on them in the public street isn't OK. They just don't care. And sometimes it's done with no other intention than to make you squirm. Then it's a form of bullying, and bullies like to feel powerful.

Self-defence can be verbal as well as physical, and if a woman is able to get some men to walk off and leave her alone through a verbal riposte (which is usually possible in those cases where they're seeking to publicly humiliate you), then she is not 'descending to their level'. You should not try and suggest there is an equality between harassers and harassment victims here. I experienced this behaviour for the first time at the age of ten (a man exposed himself to me and touched my crotch), and from the age of fifteen onwards catcalls and groping started to get more common, especially in big cities. Ignoring it doesn't always help. Sometimes you have to assert your dignity in a more forceful way. And there is a difference between two powerful male politicians having a gutter argument, and a woman reacting with anger to a man who has just degraded her in the street - one of a number of men who make the street an unpleasant and difficult place to be, but where she has just as much right to be as they have. Personally I would never call someone an a**hole - I make sure my attention remains on their speech and behaviour rather than labelling them as a person - but if a man's behaviour to me in the street is disgusting, then I have no qualms about letting him learn that this sort of behaviour can backfire.

[Peace]

That's cool. I did not mean to suggest that there is an equivalence, FWIW. But still, I dunno if I can see M. Teresa or any of our other saints responding in that manner. Seems like there should be a better way, although I can't say exactly what it would be.

I respect your opinion though. I haven't been in your shoes.

[LittleWaySoul]

This is all good advice, everyone! Thanks! I'm not sure if I'm at the confidence level to say anything in response at this point (hell, I get nervous enough talking to nice people), but maybe one day. 

The reason I mumbled a "thank you" in this particular instance was because what he said wasn't explicitly sexual, but rather a comment on my outfit with a somewhat suggestive tone of voice. I didn't think much- it just sort of happened.

Another question, somewhat related. I've noticed that I've instinctually been avoiding eye contact with passers-by and looking down as I pass someone. I know it's good to keep your head up in general and look alert so as to avoid appearing distracted, but when someone speaks like that to me, or when I pass someone on the street, should I be keeping my head up and/or making eye contact? In the former situation I'm thinking it could be interpreted as confrontational, so it could depend on the situation (is it nighttime? Isolated? Etc). 

[PhuturePriest]

14 minutes ago, LittleWaySoul said:

This is all good advice, everyone! Thanks! I'm not sure if I'm at the confidence level to say anything in response at this point (hell, I get nervous enough talking to nice people), but maybe one day. 

The reason I mumbled a "thank you" in this particular instance was because what he said wasn't explicitly sexual, but rather a comment on my outfit with a somewhat suggestive tone of voice. I didn't think much- it just sort of happened.

Another question, somewhat related. I've noticed that I've instinctually been avoiding eye contact with passers-by and looking down as I pass someone. I know it's good to keep your head up in general and look alert so as to avoid appearing distracted, but when someone speaks like that to me, or when I pass someone on the street, should I be keeping my head up and/or making eye contact? In the former situation I'm thinking it could be interpreted as confrontational, so it could depend on the situation (is it nighttime? Isolated? Etc). 

The primitive caveman in me says in these situations where you're catcalled it helps to keep your head up and make eye contact if you feel able. Dropping one's head under someone else's gaze establishes the latter's dominance in the situation, which is why in things like karate and even business classes you're taught to make good assertive eye contact. But again, if you're not comfortable with that there's nothing wrong with not doing it.

[Spem in alium]

I used to walk with my head down all the time because of serious self-confidence issues. Even now it's hard for me to keep my head up when I'm in a crowd of people, but I generally think it's good to maintain eye contact. I was catcalled one time  (some guy called out twice that I was "fun size" because of my stature) and I just walked away, but I'm frequently stared at (long stares, double-takes, etc) and I find the best thing to is to lock eyes with them. Most often they become very embarrassed and stop what they're doing. 

[LittleWaySoul]

2 minutes ago, Spem in alium said:

I used to walk with my head down all the time because of serious self-confidence issues. Even now it's hard for me to keep my head up when I'm in a crowd of people, but I generally think it's good to maintain eye contact. I was catcalled one time  (some guy called out twice that I was "fun size" because of my stature) and I just walked away, but I'm frequently stared at (long stares, double-takes, etc) and I find the best thing to is to lock eyes with them. Most often they become very embarrassed and stop what they're doing. 

If you don't mind my asking, are you a habited religious? Do people still catcall you if you're in habit?

That's good advice; I'll try to do that more often