I Think Its Cool

[the lumberjack]

i maybe a living saint, but I don't expect anyone to call me saint Carlos or anything...

and I wouldn't go around calling myself that.

its just part of my sig...since the Bible calls us that...you TOO are a saint, if you live for Christ.

and whether or not the Apostle Paul put Corinth or any one of the local churches back then...he was writing to the body of believers in Christ...you know, the WHOLE church, not just the local church.

if he wasn't writing to them and any believer who read that letter, then why do you read the bible? is it a nice story book? or do you learn from it and apply it to your life?

God bless.

[the lumberjack]

please DON'T CLOSE THIS TOPIC.

[Justified Saint]

Well, I stand corrected.

[Justified Saint]

Lumber,

Maybe it should be closed.

We have lost a poster over this thread - a non-Catholic too! But of course you have gained another one.

[the lumberjack]

hardly.

I think he decided that before this...and even if he hadn't, he had been contemplating it sometime before...

and it would've come sooner or later if he was thinking about it.

[Justified Saint]

True - this forum isn't necessarily about combatting dark spirtual forces. Is it?

[the lumberjack]

it should be if its not.

but we are (at least I am) just questioning things in the Catholic Church, like I question things that I am taught by my pastors.

not to prove myself a theologian or to say that I have biblical authority to preach or teach...but to make people think about why they believe what they believe, and if its really biblically true or not.

God bless.

[Aloysius]

Everyone stop complicating things and take a step back. stop getting offended and all that jazz, it's not good for your health.

accept that people have opinions. accept that some Catholics beleive all protestants are going to hell, but this is not the Official Church Teaching, nor has it ever been, nor will it ever be, for the Church says only God can judge souls. ALL the Church proclaims is that the cannonized saints are in heaven, everyone else is unknown to us mere mortals. But there's gonna be Catholics who think all protestants are going to hell, and there's gonna be protestants who think all Catholics are going to hell. Recognize that the majority of PhatMass Catholics DO NOT believe protestants are going to hell. Traditionalist websites commission people to run around the internet and try to spread such ideas. Don't let them kill ecumenical dialogue. That's why the guidelines are here. That's the MAIN reason for the rule Catholics can't show disobedience, to target those who claim to KNOW even though the Magisterium says we CANT KNOW, that Protestants are going to hell.

All mankind was thrown into darkness in the fall, and ever since then ALL mankind has sought the light. Then the Light came and saught us. The Church is where that Light resides, those outside of her are still seeking the light. But you recognize the Light HAS come, you have found the light you just simply keep sunglasses on because it's more comfortable, while we let the light shine directly into our eyes. That's my position, and i'm sure most PhatMassers agree. WE CANNOT JUDGE YOUR SOUL. If you ask me if your going to heaven or hell, i'll answer "why don't you ask God that?"

[phatcatholic]

aloy...........amen brother

[jasJis]

lumberjack,
You can discuss anything you want with me here, no need to go anywhere else. PM me if you want. I have a crystal clear idea of what dUSt allows and doesn't allow. I used to be a mod. I would tend to edit much more stuff than dUSt would.

My biggest pet peeve is asking questions with intellectual dishonesty. Asking questions to learn is one thing, asking questions to look for something to attack and/or foster a pre-concieved conclusion is another thing. You would find lot's of Catholics and non-Catholics here just aching to share with you what they know and love about Christ and how the Catholic Church deepens and develops our relationship with Jesus.

For Catholics, it's all about God's grace. We are graced in so many ways, continually, and eternally. Sacraments are physical signs of grace, the Bible is Grace in Word, the Holy Spirit is the power of Grace, etc. We won't deny God and His Grace anywhere we know or suspect it is, no more than you would deny the Grace that is in Scripture.

I want to believe in your openess and share our understanding as Christians, but your sig says you have arrived at a conclusion you aren't willing to question or examine.

[dUSt]

I thought the spiritual warning this was funny. haha... Still do.

But... I can see how it could easily be taken wrong, so I'll get rid of it. I'm leaving the red letter "non-catholic" there though, because I'm concerned about some members (not Lumberjack) representing the Church in a bad way. I think it's important to clearly distinguish who is Catholic, and who isn't. It's certainly not meant to be any type of condemnation, but rather, a simple declaration of a fact.

[Quietfire]

[quote]One of the things God had forbidden the Jews to eat was the fat and blood of eatable animals.[/quote]

Yes, true. BUT, the intention for this was to head off any idea that they could or should aquire their life from any creature. (as some tribal cultures still observe this.)

God did not want the Jews to seek the majesty of the animals that they consumed. As often the fact they did.(the golden calf) And for that same reason, Isreal is forbidden to worship any man.

Unless you are willing to understand Scripture in the sense that the first century Christians did, you make the same mistake as so many Protestant denomination in thinking that what is then, mean now. WRONG!!!!!!

Also, when God became flesh and blood himself Jesus Christ, everything is different and a second meaning appears. What was forbidden [i]before[/i] is now commanded in one unique situation [i]after[/i] it. Before , no man could be worshipped; afer it, the man Christ Jesus must be worshipped because he is God. Likewise, before the incarnation, no blood of no mere creature may be eaten; after it, the blood of the Word made flesh and blood MUST be eaten.

Why? Because the blood is the life and Jesus-the Way, the Truth, and the [i]Life[/i].

Also.Every book in the New Testament is a recounting of the events surrounding that unthinkable awesome event, as in the Gospels and Acts,. What that event means for us who live in its illumination, as in the Epistles. Or where that event will ultimatley lead us if we let it, as in Revelation. But the Bible does not stand alone. It lives in the context of the community created by Christ: the Body of Christ in union with the bishops and Pope in succession from the apostles.

Peace.

Edited June 21, 2004 by Quietfire

[the lumberjack]

[quote name='dUSt' date='Jun 21 2004, 02:47 PM'] I thought the spiritual warning this was funny. haha... Still do. [/quote]
no no no...don't

I like it.

I kind of feel like some big, bad Protestant monster...hey, I might use that in a song...sounds kinda dope.

------------

and jas...

Christ founded the Catholic Church, I believe that...but Christ did not found the Roman Catholic Church...no amount of paperwork, doctrines, tradition or decrees could ever convince me of that.

so...yeah, I love you guys and want to grow...but the Catholic Church (in the eyes of just about every Prot I know) is not the church that Christ founded 2 millenia ago...

how do I know?

read the Bible.
look at history.
think.
pray...it seems as if the men that have been in charge of the Catholic Church for some time now have chosen to take it down this path, which is not the original path that it may have started out on.

this is not an attack, just what the Lord has PRESSED very heavily on my heart.

I'm NOT saying that you guys (and girlies) here don't love Christ...really, I'm not. I just can't see eye to eye with the Catholic Church on some of the things it has chosen to impress upon its people to believe.

I don't and won't pray in front of a statue. why? because TO ME, it is a sin...and what does the bible say?

if it is a sin to your brother, then let it be a sin to him. if it causes him to stumble, don't do it in front of him.

thats just the quickest example I can come up with right now...I know I bring it up frequently, and I know why YOU do it, but I just can't get down with it.

if you guys don't believe that I TRULY want to grow and help you and be helped by you, then so be it...

I'll just stick to being a Protestant Monster!!!!

Christ family and hip hop...das real. :dj:

peace

[jasJis]

lumberjack,
I was adrift spiritually. I didn't really have a spiritual focus or home that I recognized. I was extremely open to the Christianity of non-Catholics, since that was where I thought I saw the most sincere practice of the philosophy of Christianity. I could not reject the Catholic Church based on what they said about it, because I was in it and knew better. I cannot reject the Christianity of non-Catholics because I know them and we have shared about our relationship with God so I know better.

In debating with people on-line, one of the tactics most commonly used is misrepresenting another's motives. In other words, it's claiming to know what's in their heart. That's an oft repeated hypocracy. It's wicked, evil, and destructive. I know that not many non-Catholics reject the Catholic Church based on knowledge. It's based on opinion, just as you've experienced here. Not that many Catholics really know the theology of non-Catholics.

Striping down everything to basic fundamentals sounds nice, but it denys the magnifigance of God. Jesus pointed out that many thought John the Baptist was a looney-toon because he ate bugs and lived in the desert. He pointed out that many thought Jesus was nuts to hang out with sinners, eat well, dress nice, and worry he was a drunkard. The reality is not superficial, so breaking things down to fundamental understanding of the Bible denys how much Grace Jesus has given us through the ages.

[Archbishop 10-K]

[quote]I kind of feel like some big, bad Protestant monster...hey, I might use that in a song...sounds kinda dope.[/quote]

Sometimes I feel the exact same way whenever I'm at my mom's church's youth group, except me being the big, bad, Catholic monster you won't let your daughter date. The "Romanist." Of course, since back in the old days, you were either a Roman or a barbarian, I gladly accept the name. The title "Romanist" actually has a nice ring to it.

Although, really, I try to be nice there and I can argue the case for Christ much better than any of them can do (I can be a better Protestant than them if I wanted to.)

Edited June 21, 2004 by Archbishop 10-K