Has anyone heard of this Secular Institute?

[Sponsa-Christi]

I was having a friendly debate recently with a fellow canonist about whether or not the secular clergy (i.e., primarily diocesan priests) are able to engage in secular business ventures or work in purely secular jobs. I'm really quite sure the answer to that is "no," based on canons 281 - 289. I also mentioned the Worker Priest movement (where priests opted to work in factories in secular clothes and with nothing to set them apart as priests), which I had thought was suppressed. 

However, my debating partner mentioned that there is still a secular institute of priests which is supposedly very much like the Worker Priest movement.They're called the "Diocesan Laborer Priests," and this is the only real web mention we were able to find for them: http://www.secularinstitutes.org/dlp.htm From the very minimal description given there, I'm really doubting that these are modern-day Worker Priests, but I don't really have much more information.

Does anyone here know anything? Thanks!

[Gabriela]

I recall reading a couple articles on priests who held secular (i.e., regular) jobs. But I believe that was in the 70s. Apparently, back then, it was a really common thing.

These days, I don't know. I've never run across one, or any more recent article on the subject. I did just read a few articles about priests who do "specialized" jobs being a lot more satisfied with their work than the typical "all-purpose" parish priest, but the "specialized" work wasn't detailed so I assumed it was just some sort of diocesan work (like marriage tribunal or vocation stuff).

[NadaTeTurbe]

There's still Worker Priest ! They were allowed again after Vatican II, in1965. They were 800 in 1976. Currently, there's around 500 priest working in factory, at least in France. I know a priest who works in a factory, I love him very much because he's more down-to-earth than other priest. I don't know about the USA, but in France, they are still here. 

[Sponsa-Christi]

1 minute ago, NadaTeTurbe said:

There's still Worker Priest ! They were allowed again after Vatican II, in1965. They were 800 in 1976. Currently, there's around 500 priest working in factory, at least in France. I know a priest who works in a factory, I love him very much because he's more down-to-earth than other priest. I don't know about the USA, but in France, they are still here. 

Thanks! Good to know. Would you happen to have any links to any articles that mention them? 

This might be asking too many questions, but do you know if there are any restrictions placed on the Worker Priests today? E.g., are they totally excused from normal priestly ministry, or are they expected to do something like say Mass in a parish occasionally? Do they dress as laypeople, or as priests? Do they often tell people they are priests, or do they keep this mostly hidden?

[NadaTeTurbe]

I can only find things in French : 

http://cybercure.fr/je-professe-la-foi/article/les-pretres-ouvriers

http://www.pretres-ouvriers.fr/

http://missiondefrance.fr/ (Worker Priest organization 

There's restriction about political things : they can't be a member of a party or a trade union. Officially, because a lot of the old one don't hide how much they love communist and socialist... The youngs one (not a lot) tend to be less in politics. 

They depend of a parish, they say mass, marriage, burrial, hear confession, etc... But they do "less" work than a normal parish priest. The priest that I know say mass on sunday, one mass by month at a school, and he's the chaplain of two groups. He also works for Lourde's pilgrimage. 

They dress as laypeople, but honestly, in France, a lot of priest dress as laypeople (even youngs priests...)

Yes, to explain why they work half-time (very often), but also to show to other workers that Jesus love them so much, that even His priest are ready to work with them. Their way of life look a little like the little sisters of Jesus, you see ? 

Of course, it can change according to the priest, the bishop, etc... 

Do you know the Prado secular institute, founded by Antoine Chevrier in Lyon ? Their priests can be Worker Priest. Their mission is to live like the poors and evangelize them. I think most of the Worker Priest today belongs to the Prado. 

 

[enitharmon]

I used to know a (retired) worker priest, a friend of my grandparents. Lovely man, deeply spiritual. I remember he told me once that there was a renewed interest in worker priests after VII, and then lessened a bit, but that there were still a few of them around (about 15-20 years ago).

But to answer your question: I don't think they are really "Labour Priests", at least not any longer. The Diocesan Laborer Priests' activities, according to this page, involve "Special school for the blind, handicapped, etc, Hospital, Publishing activities". Several places online claim the Washington DC branch/office was established in 2000.

As the page you linked to states, they were founded in Spain (and have several several blessed among them, beatified by Pope Francis in 2013). Several places online claim the Washington DC branch/office was established in 2000, and they seem to be primarily involved with Hispanic communities in the US. Father Ovidio Pecharromán is their director, but is also the Director of the Hispanic Apostolate and of the Spanish Apostolate in the Archdiocese of Washington and until until 2005 the Hispanic Apostolate Director and Director of the Spanish Apostolate in the Diocese of Arlington , Va. (see here). According to that page, the DLP are "an international Catholic institute that encourages priestly vocations".

Auxiliary Bishop of San Bernardino Rutilio del Riego is a member, but seems to have been primarily involved in education.

 

[Nunsuch]

I know some priests who teach at secular (public) universities, although some of them also minister part-time in pastoral capacities. And there is one priest in our diocese who is also a civil lawyer.

[Gabriela]

5 hours ago, enitharmon said:

(and have several several blessed among them, beatified by Pope Francis in 2013).

Wow. It's a lot of blesseds, actually. All martyred by communists in the Spanish Civil War...  

[Sponsa-Christi]

8 hours ago, NadaTeTurbe said:

I can only find things in French : 

http://cybercure.fr/je-professe-la-foi/article/les-pretres-ouvriers

http://www.pretres-ouvriers.fr/

http://missiondefrance.fr/ (Worker Priest organization 

There's restriction about political things : they can't be a member of a party or a trade union. Officially, because a lot of the old one don't hide how much they love communist and socialist... The youngs one (not a lot) tend to be less in politics. 

They depend of a parish, they say mass, marriage, burrial, hear confession, etc... But they do "less" work than a normal parish priest. The priest that I know say mass on sunday, one mass by month at a school, and he's the chaplain of two groups. He also works for Lourde's pilgrimage. 

They dress as laypeople, but honestly, in France, a lot of priest dress as laypeople (even youngs priests...)

Yes, to explain why they work half-time (very often), but also to show to other workers that Jesus love them so much, that even His priest are ready to work with them. Their way of life look a little like the little sisters of Jesus, you see ? 

Of course, it can change according to the priest, the bishop, etc... 

Do you know the Prado secular institute, founded by Antoine Chevrier in Lyon ? Their priests can be Worker Priest. Their mission is to live like the poors and evangelize them. I think most of the Worker Priest today belongs to the Prado. 

 

This is really helpful and interesting. Thank you! So I guess it would be right to say that Worker Priests still very much function as priests?

8 hours ago, NadaTeTurbe said:

 

They dress as laypeople, but honestly, in France, a lot of priest dress as laypeople (even youngs priests...)

 

I have a funny story about this...I once knew an American Brother of St. Jean who explained to me that in France, often the only thing a priest would wear to show that he was a priest was a very small cross pin. This is very different from the U.S.A., where most priests almost always dress as priests in public. Anyway, when Brother was making his final profession, his dad came to attend the ceremony. The dad wore a cross pin (common in the U.S.A. for laypeople to wear to show that that they are Christian), and everyone thought the dad was a priest!

One interesting thing, though---apparently in parts of France, consecrated virgins are allowed to wear a veil as part of their daily attire! 

[Gabriela]

3 hours ago, Sponsa-Christi said:

the U.S.A., where most priests almost always dress as priests in public.

What diocese are you in? Pretty much everywhere I've been, the priests dress entirely in secular clothes, unless they're actually physically in the parish.

Also, as regards CVs: I met one once in Steubenville who had a full habit. She said her bishop allowed it. She was crazy, but that's a different matter.

[Sponsa-Christi]

1 minute ago, Gabriela said:

What diocese are you in? Pretty much everywhere I've been, the priests dress entirely in secular clothes, unless they're actually physically in the parish.

Also, as regards CVs: I met one once in Steubenville who had a full habit. She said her bishop allowed it. She was crazy, but that's a different matter.

I'm in the greater New York area. It is normal for priests to wear secular clothes when they're in some kind of "off-duty" situation (like visiting their family, etc.) but generally any time you would be likely to see a priest here, he would likely be dressed as a priest. A certain age group of priests (like, those who are nearing retirement now) might wear secular clothes more often, but around here seeing your priest in clerical garb would be the more normal situation. 

Re. CVs...wearing distinctive clothing is entirely up to the discretion of the local bishop.

[NadaTeTurbe]

On 9/3/2016 17:29:37, Sponsa-Christi said:

This is really helpful and interesting. Thank you! So I guess it would be right to say that Worker Priests still very much function as priests?

I have a funny story about this...I once knew an American Brother of St. Jean who explained to me that in France, often the only thing a priest would wear to show that he was a priest was a very small cross pin. This is very different from the U.S.A., where most priests almost always dress as priests in public. Anyway, when Brother was making his final profession, his dad came to attend the ceremony. The dad wore a cross pin (common in the U.S.A. for laypeople to wear to show that that they are Christian), and everyone thought the dad was a priest!

One interesting thing, though---apparently in parts of France, consecrated virgins are allowed to wear a veil as part of their daily attire! 

But what is fuctionning as a priest ? You have four hours to answer this  More seriously... for the priest that I know, he functions as priest but the time where he does "priest" things is the same than a laypeople volunteering for the church. However, when he speaks about religion with a coworker, he does it as a priest, and it changes everything. 

Yes, the famous pin ! I always dreamed to have one but I'm not a priest  

Not the consecrated virgins in my diocese... Do you know in wich part of France ? I think the Bishop of Fréjus-Toulon, the Bishop of Bayonne, and maybe other diocese in the South, would allow it. 

[Sponsa-Christi]

17 minutes ago, NadaTeTurbe said:

But what is fuctionning as a priest ? You have four hours to answer this  More seriously... for the priest that I know, he functions as priest but the time where he does "priest" things is the same than a laypeople volunteering for the church. However, when he speaks about religion with a coworker, he does it as a priest, and it changes everything. 

Yes, the famous pin ! I always dreamed to have one but I'm not a priest  

Not the consecrated virgins in my diocese... Do you know in wich part of France ? I think the Bishop of Fréjus-Toulon, the Bishop of Bayonne, and maybe other diocese in the South, would allow it. 

By functioning as a priest, I meant having actual priestly ministry as an important part of his life.

I had heard a story (which, to be fair, might have been only a story) one about a Worker Priest who was a mechanic on a cruise ship. When the normal ship's chaplain was too sick to say a Sunday Mass, they went to the Worker Priest. But the Worker Priest said: "No, I can't---I'm on this ship to be a mechanic, not as a priest!" But this doesn't sound like something the modern-day Workers Priests would do based on how you've described them.

I think the veil-wearing CVs were in the north part of France somewhere? Unfortunately, I didn't have a chance to get to know them that well, since I don't speak any French. 

[NadaTeTurbe]

Of course, all depends of the priest. I have a positive experience with youngs Workers Priest/Prado Priest. Old one... well I can TOTALLY imagine them saying that. Little stories : my parents are socialist, but they would never read "L'humanité", a communist newspapers. I used to cook and clean for an old priest (who had been a worker priest) who read it religiously every week... 

Maybe Bayeux-Lisieux ? The bishop is very open to "new" way of living religious life. I don't know more in the Mordor North.