nervous

[MarysLittleFlower]

This is another 'I'm so scared to talk to my family' threads. (Sorry!) I'm planning on making a retreat with a community and I'm so overwhelmed about talking to my family about that. I don't want to frighten them. They might wonder why I'm going but I don't know anything myself or the plans God might have with this retreat, so I don't know what to say. In the past any conversations on monasteries (in general) have not gone well. I'm even afraid of this affecting their health as they might wonder if I am thinking of entering. But I'm not making any plans cause I just want God's Will. Even if I was planning on entering there, i can't as I have financial obligations. I might realize that my vocation is in the world or somewhere else. Or i might not realize anything but just get a chance to spend time in prayer at a monastery. I just really want to go on a retreat there, pray for God's guidance, receive anything He wants for me. I would be really grateful for prayers or how to not get too stressed about this. Thank you

Edited February 15, 2016 by MarysLittleFlower

[NadaTeTurbe]

I can't help you for stress and family (my family isn't catholic, kind of the same situation as you), but here is a prayer of surrender by brother Charles de Foucault

Father,
I abandon myself into your hands;
do with me what you will.
Whatever you may do, I thank you:
I am ready for all, I accept all.

Let only your will be done in me,
and in all your creatures -
I wish no more than this, O Lord.

Into your hands I commend my soul:
I offer it to you with all the love of my heart,
for I love you, Lord, and so need to give myself,
to surrender myself into your hands without reserve,
and with boundless confidence,
for you are my Father.

Charles de Foucauld

[MarysLittleFlower]

Thank you! that's a beautiful prayer... I should say it more. I've been pretty stressed about this recently 

[MarysLittleFlower]

The one thing I don't seem to understand, if my family is helping me get to the retreat, am I obligated to tell them about my discernment, or could I tell them that I'm just going on a retreat to pray about God's Will, because I don't know my vocation yet? If I knew its that convent I'd tell them, but I don't know... If I just tell them I'm seeking God's Will I don't think they'd guess its discernment specifically...

But since I can't enter any time soon and don't know if its my vocation, I feel like its too early to tell them... It might make things worse '(

[Feankie]

What you are doing, MLF, is discerning, seeking God's Will for the remainder of your life - whatever that may be.  We are all discerning - all the time!  Yes, it's true.  One just doesn't "coast" where they are at present, but always seeking what the Lord wants, where the Lord wants it to happen, and the pathway to obedience to His Will.  You are seeking your vocation, no matter what it turns out to be.  IMHO it makes no sense to say anything specific about entering an Order as the Lord may indeed steer you in a different direction, one that you totally would not have chosen on your own.  Be open to the Spirit while you're away.  Ask the Lord for guidance and, by all means , listen with an open mind and heart.

[MarysLittleFlower]

Thank you! do you think there's no obligation to tell them so much? I've been feeling a lot of guilt about this for some reason. Yet at the same time, I can't say I'm planning to enter cause I don't yet know if God wants me in this community or even if its religious life. I'm also discerning consecrated life in the world. However I am discerning this question and its weird to not tell my parents when they are helping me get there. Especially as they might be upset if they knew. Yet if I tell them its telling them a very uncertain thing that might not be and if it will be, it won't happen for years probably. I just feel so confused! Please pray for me and my parents

I told my dad I want to seek God's Will and I have some ideas but I don't know if they are His Will too, so I'm waiting. I said the retreat could help me figure it out. 

[FlowerofCarmel]

Do what Jesus tells you, and don't hesitate about talking to your family, you know well in your heart what you want and what God wants.

Pray some more! God will let you know.

 

Let me correct myself. You are continuing to discover God's plan for your life, Don't hesitate about talking to your family. 

[Feankie]

What I would say to you is this......it's quite truthful to tell your parents that you appreciate their help in giving you some time away to think about and pray about what your next step/s in life might be; that you are seeking more clarity in your decision making processes; and the peace, quiet, and solitude of XYZ Community will help you clarify and quantify the ideas you have at present.  Which is all true, isn't it ?   

 

[McM RSCJ]

You ask the implications if your family is helping you to get to the retreat. . . .

Does this mean you are asking them to pay your costs, or some of your costs, in traveling to and offering the donation to this Convent or Monastery?

If so, please know that I, as a long-time and happy Religious, find this deeply problematic. 

I realize my thoughts on this topic may not be well-received on this website, but I do not think a woman of 30 or 30+ should be asking her parents for money to pay for her visit to a community she is considering.  If you are not financially independent of your parents now, when will you be?  If you are not independent of your parents now, then, of course, they will be deeply concerned about your future--and how you will manage.   And that is bound to affect how they hear your thoughts about your possible vocation.  

In other words, I don't think the heart of the question you have posted is actually whether you should tell them you are "making a retreat" or whether you should tell them you are "considering if this is community you might enter."   The heart of the question is whether you are asking them to finance all or part of this.  If so, why?

You are an adult.  You have told us you have a full-time job and you cover your own costs.  So you should be paying your own way to meet this community, no? 

(If you need to save up money to do so, then get a second job, in a fast-food joint or waitressing if necessary, in the evenings or on on weekends until you have saved up what you need.  That's what people do.  Adults work for their goals.}

If I were a Formation Director, I would be very concerned about a thirty year old woman asking to come meet my community but depending on her parents to pay for the costs, in full or in part.  It would raise questions for me about that candidate's maturity and grasp of the real. 

Discernment, as I imagine your Spiritual Director reminds you, has to be rooted in reality.  And the reality is that no one owes an adult who is not seriously ill or disabled a living.  Once you enter, you will also need to do whatever is necessary to ensure you and the members of your community earn their living.  Maybe not in the brief period of the Noviceship.  And probably not in old age (though I know so many religious in my own order who continue to ear their living until well-advanced in years,) or during the time of grievous illness.  But this is just life.  And it's part and parcel of religious life, even of those communities who resort to begging in the name of the gospel. 

Of course, earning our living is not the heart of the gospel call.  But sometimes Phatmass can seem so unrealistic to those of us living Religious life.  . . .

 

Edited February 17, 2016 by McM RSCJ

[MarysLittleFlower]

47 minutes ago, McM RSCJ said:

You ask the implications if your family is helping you to get to the retreat. . . .

Does this mean you are asking them to pay your costs, or some of your costs, in traveling to and offering the donation to this Convent or Monastery?

If so, please know that I, as a long-time and happy Religious, find this deeply problematic. 

I realize my thoughts on this topic may not be well-received on this website, but I do not think a woman of 30 or 30+ should be asking her parents for money to pay for her visit to a community she is considering.  If you are not financially independent of your parents now, when will you be?  If you are not independent of your parents now, then, of course, they will be deeply concerned about your future--and how you will manage.   And that is bound to affect how they hear your thoughts about your possible vocation.  

In other words, I don't think the heart of the question you have posted is actually whether you should tell them you are "making a retreat" or whether you should tell them you are "considering if this is community you might enter."   The heart of the question is whether you are asking them to finance all or part of this.  If so, why?

You are an adult.  You have told us you have a full-time job and you cover your own costs.  So you should be paying your own way to meet this community, no? 

(If you need to save up money to do so, then get a second job, in a fast-food joint or waitressing if necessary, in the evenings or on on weekends until you have saved up what you need.  That's what people do.  Adults work for their goals.}

If I were a Formation Director, I would be very concerned about a thirty year old woman asking to come meet my community but depending on her parents to pay for the costs, in full or in part.  It would raise questions for me about that candidate's maturity and grasp of the real. 

Discernment, as I imagine your Spiritual Director reminds you, has to be rooted in reality.  And the reality is that no one owes an adult who is not seriously ill or disabled a living.  Once you enter, you will also need to do whatever is necessary to ensure you and the members of your community earn their living.  Maybe not in the brief period of the Noviceship.  And probably not in old age (though I know so many religious in my own order who continue to ear their living until well-advanced in years,) or during the time of grievous illness.  But this is just life.  And it's part and parcel of religious life, even of those communities who resort to begging in the name of the gospel. 

Of course, earning our living is not the heart of the gospel call.  But sometimes Phatmass can seem so unrealistic to those of us living Religious life.  . . .

 

No I am not asking them to finance this trip...I need money to take a train part way and I'm going to pay for that myself. My dad goes to that area for work and my SD and I agreed it might be a good idea to go with him part way, for various reasons. My dad agreed. Finance is part of it as this would be cheaper but its not the deciding factor. It would just be much calmer for my family this way and they already have a lot on their plate. Anyway my SD didn't have any issue with my plan

1 hour ago, Francis Clare said:

What I would say to you is this......it's quite truthful to tell your parents that you appreciate their help in giving you some time away to think about and pray about what your next step/s in life might be; that you are seeking more clarity in your decision making processes; and the peace, quiet, and solitude of XYZ Community will help you clarify and quantify the ideas you have at present.  Which is all true, isn't it ?   

 

I just ended up talking to my dad on the phone! I told him I've been drawn to such places for a while, have considered if this is a life I could lead, but I want to seek God's Will and be open to anything, and it might help me to visit. My dad took it quite well because I made it obvious I want God's Will and just want to go on the retreat for that and I said God might use it in any way, including ways I don't expect. I said I'm still seeking His Will, and that's true because my desires for religious life have not been confirmed. I told dad a bit about my prayer life too which he's fine with. Yay! But mostly to be honest.I'm worried about my moms eventual reaction because she has more of a dream for me getting married. 

I wasn't too worried with dad. 

Edited February 17, 2016 by MarysLittleFlower

[MarysLittleFlower]

Not to say my dad wouldn't probably find it difficult if I was entering, but my mom and I have pretty emotional personalities plus strong views which makes these discussions more ..emotional. 

[Spem in alium]

I'm so glad your dad took this well! I bet that's a stress off your shoulders. 

I don't think there's really an obligation to tell them everything. As others have said, you could easily say that you are going to discern God's will. This may help more with your mom, especially if you know she will take it more difficultly.

I think it's important to stress what Francis Clare said about discernment never ending. I've come across people who seem to think you need to be 100% sure of your vocation before entering the convent, but I don't see how you can be sure of something like this unless you've lived it. Just because you enter a convent, are ordained a priest, get married, etc. doesn't mean you'll stay that way forever. In the past there was often the perception that a person couldn't leave the convent once they'd entered, that leaving was a sign of failure - to me, this is very sad.

Even before I entered, I wasn't definitely sure at all. I had several very intense and meaningful moments in prayer, but no "AHA!" or lightbulb moment that made me convinced this was my calling. Rather, everything was gradual and slow, but at the same time very powerful and persistent. And even now that I live in community I'm not 100% sure. I am happy and at peace, very much so, and I feel so incredibly "myself", but who knows what could happen in one month, one year, or ten years? Who knows what could happen tomorrow? Only God does. You sound like you're taking things slowly and not rushing, but just remember that these things, these incredibly good things, all take time, and in the meantime work on being open and pray for the strength and grace you need to do God's work, whatever that may be.

[Maggyie]

6 hours ago, McM RSCJ said:

You ask the implications if your family is helping you to get to the retreat. . . .

Does this mean you are asking them to pay your costs, or some of your costs, in traveling to and offering the donation to this Convent or Monastery?

If so, please know that I, as a long-time and happy Religious, find this deeply problematic. 

I realize my thoughts on this topic may not be well-received on this website, but I do not think a woman of 30 or 30+ should be asking her parents for money to pay for her visit to a community she is considering.  If you are not financially independent of your parents now, when will you be?  If you are not independent of your parents now, then, of course, they will be deeply concerned about your future--and how you will manage.   And that is bound to affect how they hear your thoughts about your possible vocation.  

In other words, I don't think the heart of the question you have posted is actually whether you should tell them you are "making a retreat" or whether you should tell them you are "considering if this is community you might enter."   The heart of the question is whether you are asking them to finance all or part of this.  If so, why?

You are an adult.  You have told us you have a full-time job and you cover your own costs.  So you should be paying your own way to meet this community, no? 

(If you need to save up money to do so, then get a second job, in a fast-food joint or waitressing if necessary, in the evenings or on on weekends until you have saved up what you need.  That's what people do.  Adults work for their goals.}

If I were a Formation Director, I would be very concerned about a thirty year old woman asking to come meet my community but depending on her parents to pay for the costs, in full or in part.  It would raise questions for me about that candidate's maturity and grasp of the real. 

Discernment, as I imagine your Spiritual Director reminds you, has to be rooted in reality.  And the reality is that no one owes an adult who is not seriously ill or disabled a living.  Once you enter, you will also need to do whatever is necessary to ensure you and the members of your community earn their living.  Maybe not in the brief period of the Noviceship.  And probably not in old age (though I know so many religious in my own order who continue to ear their living until well-advanced in years,) or during the time of grievous illness.  But this is just life.  And it's part and parcel of religious life, even of those communities who resort to begging in the name of the gospel. 

Of course, earning our living is not the heart of the gospel call.  But sometimes Phatmass can seem so unrealistic to those of us living Religious life.  . . .

 

Not to be rude, and I would feel the same way as you. But that's because I am a middle class white woman brought up in North American culture by an assimilated family.

What I've found is that in many micro cultures it is actually expected that an unmarried woman of any age is dependent on her parents. This is related to class as well as culture. Working class people in general are more likely to live multi-generational lives, with children depending on parents and grandparents, and vice versa. It's also a very traditional way of life.

Your comment about getting a fast food job reminds me of the well-off individuals who respond to the strategies of the poor with the thought that they should "just get a second job waitressing or something" and "work for their goals."

It's easy for someone like you and me who has all their needs met to think this - "you can get what you want if you just work harder." For the poor it is almost never that easy. Usually they are already working their rear ends off. Life for them is a delicate balancing act. If they lose their balance (say with a second job that makes them late to a primary job) they can face eviction and hunger. You don't have that problem, do you sister? 

Well neither do I.

Again not trying to be fresh. I have the same reactions. But in reality, grown adults pooling resources and creating strategies to get what they want IS "working for their goals." I've learned to respect the resourcefulness of poor people and not judge them based on comparisons to my own strategies. Clearly MLF is not loafing around or failing to contribute to her own maintenance. Sounds like a successful adult to me. 

Edited February 17, 2016 by Maggyie

[McM RSCJ]

Maggyie,

I can respect what you say, Maggyie, because you read me as denigrating poor persons.  I don't believe that is what I was doing.  And I certainly didn't mean to do that.

And, for what it is worth, I've been working for a salary full or part-time since I was 13 years old. And my money before I left home went half to my family's household expenses and half to savings for education. That was the rule.  (The only time I haven't worked full or part-time was during the two years of the novitiate.  And to this day I have a full-time job and a part-time job--both wonderful ministries but both with bosses and expectations and evaluations and both salaried and and and.  . . And I do that so I can contribute as much as possible to the costs of my Religious Order.  I also live and work among young people who come from "underserved" communities, many different micro-cultures and macro-cultures, first generation college students, undocumented etc.  And I see what they do to manage and how hard they work and how many balls they juggle.  And two are actually homeless.  

So, sorry, I stick to what I was saying:  An adult of 30 or so who wants to go visit a convent for a retreat needs to save her money to pay for transportation and the retreat donation.  I do think it's problematic to expect family to pick up any portion of that.  I think those charged in Religious Communities with evaluating perspective members would expect such independence and foresight as well.  Picking up a second part-time job while already studying full-time and holding down a regular and continuing part-time job--for a few weeks or a few months to save up for something is something my students do all the time. 

Plus the real world facts of religious life include that each member has to contribute to the costs of the community.  There is no magic.

Edited February 17, 2016 by McM RSCJ

[MarysLittleFlower]

I just wanted to say that the main reason I asked my dad for help with transportation is not finance related. I'd rather not go into my reasons here. 

If I had a million dollars I'd still ask him. Its not because of money. 

Edited February 18, 2016 by MarysLittleFlower