How To Stop Sexualizing Everything

[PhuturePriest]

http://thefederalist.com/2015/12/28/how-to-stop-sexualizing-everything/

As a person who has experienced ridicule from guy friends for embracing them publicly (and, coincidentally, being an ENFJ,) this article really resonated with me. I've always felt compelled to express physical affection with friends, regardless of gender, and I've never once thought of it as being erotic in any way. 

Any thoughts?

[Nihil Obstat]

1 minute ago, PhuturePriest said:

 

Any thoughts?

 

Yeah, it is good food for thought. I recall reading that article a few weeks ago. I think that honest recognition of beauty is something that we are kind of missing in our society, and I think that subject is linked very closely with this. We can recognize beauty without having to form some kind of sexual or romantic attachment, likewise we can form friendships - in part when we recognize those desirable traits in other people - without having to tack on an arbitrary sexual component.

[NadaTeTurbe]

Yes yes yeeeeeeeeeeeeees 

I have a past - slept with many people, reputation to be a prostitute, etc... and giving up in this way of life was for me the return of friendship. It's the most beautiful things that had happened to me. I have friends. Before that - everything I did with other girls and boys was sexualised. I was always thinking "I'm going to do/say that, so he's going to know what I want..." Every words, every gesture - everything revolved around sex. It's tiresome. Sometimes you just want to cry in a friend's arms, and him to hug you - but if you do that, you've maybe opened to more. So you're going to cry alone. Or in your friend's arms, but thinking about how to avoid sleeping with him/resigning to sleep with him. That was something I thought. "he's such a good friend and he was so kind with me, I can't say no". it's a way of life that was slowly killing me, morally, physically, and spiritualy. So, after lot of thinking and the help of priest, I stopped it - but I also cleaned my friend's group - only keeping people who were safe and never tried to use me. Most of them are not catholic, but they have some kind of religion or share the same philosophy when it comes to sexuality. And now - friendship is back. I don't have to worry anymore that crying in a friend's arm is going to result in unwanted sex, or that saying "I love you" to another girl is going to result in a "if you're bi or gay, you can tell us." I'm very "tactile". I can't have a friend next to me without playing with his/her hairs/fingers/hands. I hug a lot and when I say goodbye it's "I love you". It's just friendship. Because I like to show my friend that they are loved, and that's all. 

[beatitude]

Nada, this reminds me of a conversation I had a week ago with a religious Muslim friend. I was telling her about my secular institute. It's not something I would normally discuss with people, as it's part of our vocation to remain hidden, but she's a close friend and she was starting to wonder why I always respond to her questions about marriage and children with a smile and, "It's not for me." I described consecrated life in general and the spirituality of my institute in particular, and she responded with horror: "But that sounds so hard. It's not realistic. Won't you be lonely? You should have things to enjoy in life." So I spoke about what making a commitment to consecrated life in the world has done for my friendships - how it has made them so much stronger, and given them a new flavour that they never had before. (The biblical phrase 'salt of the earth' always comes to mind when I think about friendship now.) I think this is one of the reasons why Christian celibacy is so important and necessary - it's a witness to the power and beauty of friendship, and a way of reminding others (especially those who aren't even trying to be chaste, let alone celibate!) what goodness God has placed in their lives through friends.

[Archaeology cat]

I agree. I just read this book, and thought it was really good except for one thing: instead of letting the two main characters (both men) have a close friendship, the author has them kiss. In all other respects, their relationship is described in terms of close friends, but it seems people can't grasp the concept of loving someone without sex.

[PhuturePriest]

2 hours ago, Archaeology cat said:

I agree. I just read this book, and thought it was really good except for one thing: instead of letting the two main characters (both men) have a close friendship, the author has them kiss. In all other respects, their relationship is described in terms of close friends, but it seems people can't grasp the concept of loving someone without sex.

I once read it is common for Russians to greet their close friends of both sexes with a kiss on the lips. The thought of that ever happening here without it being construed as erotic is simply laughable.

[PhuturePriest]

I actually found a link on it. At least according to it, kissing friends on the lips is a Russian pastime: http://www.guidetorussia.org/russian-culture/russian-kissing.html

[NadaTeTurbe]

 

5 minutes ago, NadaTeTurbe said:

Yes, it's common. At the Winter Olympic in Russia, two girls kissed each other on the lips to celebrate their victories, and everybody was like "congratulation ! you're celebrating LGBT rights !" when they were just happy to win. 

 

Edited January 27, 2016 by NadaTeTurbe

[bardegaulois]

We live in a society fraught with sexuality. My way of escaping it was simple: 1. kill your television; 2. avoid contemporary film (for the most part; I do occasionally watch Scorsese flicks when they come out); and 3. don't listen to pop music (it hurts my ears anyway).

Most of us probably grew up imbued with these things. In my 20s, it was more the lack of artistic quality than the moral content that made me abjure most popular culture, seeing it as mere mindless entertainment. I think it goes to show that ugliness and mindlessness follow sin. I look at the younger generation now who take all of this for granted, and everything seems sexualized to them. Some young people have even presumed that a good woman friend of mine, who is married, and I are having an affair because we "faisons les bises" (that is, kiss each other thrice on the cheeks) when greeting. There's nothing sexual about that at all; we're both of French-Canadian extraction and it's just what we do. A lot of this foolishness is in the eye of the beholder, but then, look at the cultural diet on which they were raised.

[Credo in Deum]

I usually stop reading at INTJ and KFC. I don't know why all of these personality labels irritate me but they do. Yet I digress.  In my own life I have found the best promoter of phileo relationships has been my faith.

When I was young my experiences were a lot like Nadas, however, when I came back to the faith I was given the way to view others with the dignity they hold as persons made in the image of God. The faith has shown me how to love others correctly and how I should treat actions which are shown to me by others. Sex anytime ouside of marriage is the abuse of what sex was intended for so not only does this help me control myself it also helps me control my outlook towards actions others have towards me. With my faith I can now be huged or told I'm loved without having to feel there is something sexual about it.  I don't need to care if someone is ENFJ or INTJ or whatever because until they state their motives or until we're married I will never view their actions of affection as anything other than acts of friendship.

The Church in Her Divine mission has taught me to love my neighbor correctly and I feel that if we want an insurgency of phileo relationships in our society then we need to do nothing more than love and live our Catholic Faith. 

 

 

[Gabriela]

6 hours ago, bardegaulois said:

My way of escaping it was simple: 1. kill your television; 2. avoid contemporary film (for the most part; I do occasionally watch Scorsese flicks when they come out); and 3. don't listen to pop music (it hurts my ears anyway).

 

I second all of your recommendations. But I do find that, most of the time, the BBC, ABC (Australian), and CBC (Canadian) are acceptable viewing. I'm quite partial to historical dramas, myself.  

[Archaeology cat]

21 hours ago, PhuturePriest said:

I once read it is common for Russians to greet their close friends of both sexes with a kiss on the lips. The thought of that ever happening here without it being construed as erotic is simply laughable.

Yeah, if the characters had been Russian, that would've worked.  This was written to describe as sexual/erotic, unfortunately. 

The elderly Monsignor at my parish greets people with a kiss. Clearly not sexual/erotic at all.

[Oremus Pro Invicem]

Pray to the Blessed Mother.  

[Anomaly]

Different people, different family cultures, different ethnicities.   I go with the flow and personally don't am naive and never take a sexual connotation for a hug or kiss from a male or female (though I draw the line at kissing the lips).  My wife says it is my super power of being friendly.  

[MarysLittleFlower]

I think one thing I've found helpful in my friendships is really basing them on Christ and seeking to love the person with a more charity agape sort of love, loving them in Christ, rather than selfishly or simply with human affection. I read that the love of the Saints was more supernatural. Of course I'm not there yet. Its just a goal right now :) I don't like how everything is sexualized in our culture either. I have to say I don't feel comfortable hugging guys not because I would intend something impure but I believe in being a bit more 'formal' with them than with girls. Same with conversation topics. To me its like an element of modesty... But it still doesn't mean that the only love out there is romantic love and all the rest of these modern ideas. 

I certainly think you can feel much love for someone and it doesn't have to be sexual. I agree that a feeling can be very strong yet not about that at all. My girl friends and I would say "I love you" to each other and it is considered normal not at all sexual. I agree with the article that we need to forget about "bromance" and i agree that a feeling can be more passionate but not impure. Personally I am less expressive with guy friends though. If I care for them as friends I just try to be a good friend but I wouldn't hug or kiss them. I also wouldn't tell them as many personal things. I don't consider that puritanical.. I've just noticed that sometimes a strong emotional connection with a guy can turn to romantic feelings and I'm discerning a vocation so I want to guard my heart. I don't mean sexual feelings necessarily - rather a crush on the guy.