Half Of Priest And Bishops Are Gay

[Ash Wednesday]

This thread has already gone Full Voris.

[PhuturePriest]

41 minutes ago, Josh said:

Most and I stress the word MOST men who are married to woman (attracted to women) aren't attracted to any males whether they are boys or teenage boys. Or adults. I'm from the Midwest. That's the way it is here. Maybe it's different other places.

So if half of priests and bishops are gay, and they get married, that magically solves the inherent weakness gay men allegedly have towards pedophilia? 

[Guest]

8 minutes ago, PhuturePriest said:

So if half of priests and bishops are gay, and they get married, that magically solves the inherent weakness gay men allegedly have towards pedophilia? 

Yeah I don't know. I have a tough time believing half are gay. Although I'm not an expert. I've never been a Voris fan. I enjoyed your blog. I'm surprised more Catholics don't speak out against him. I think the reason being most like/agree with him. I don't know enough about the Church to agree or disagree with him. I just never cared for him or the vortex. At any rate prayers for Him and the Church.

[bardegaulois]

I've never been into Voris much myself. When he first came onto the scene about five or so years ago, I found his videos a little on the cheap side and his tone somewhat incendiary. Nonetheless, I've got to give credit where credit is due. My home diocese is swimming in homosexuality (and, at one time, its near kinsman pederasty) among the clergy, and consequently it was hit very hard by the abuse scandal. If I were really to state the full scope it, I'd have to post details that would allow others to identify it, and, in the interests of charity, I'd rather not do that. But suffice it to say that I have friends and family members, both of my generation and that of my parents, who have been propositioned by priests, and very few of them are practicing Catholics any longer. Altar boys would use the buddy system to make sure that no one was in the sacristy with Father alone. It's done such grave damage to the faith here.

The benefit, though, is that wherever there was a priest who exuded a robust masculinity, who hadn't the effeminate quality that other priests had, he would find himself very popular with young men, to the point that his parish would become known as an incubator of vocations (though many left seminary eventually and refused to talk about it). Sadly, those priests would often find themselves on the bishop's naughty list for some reason or another. Seeing a good priest I trusted, who helped teach me how to serve the TLM, unceremiously cashiered recently, shows that this rubbish that has been going on for a few generations is still very much with us. It's led to a broad loss of trust in the bishop and the priests here, up to the point that I'd even call the faith moribund here.

So, do I find it credible that half of clergy are gay? I absolutely do, though I'm sure the proportion varies considerably from diocese to diocese.

[PhuturePriest]

19 minutes ago, bardegaulois said:

I've never been into Voris much myself. When he first came onto the scene about five or so years ago, I found his videos a little on the cheap side and his tone somewhat incendiary. Nonetheless, I've got to give credit where credit is due. My home diocese is swimming in homosexuality (and, at one time, its near kinsman pederasty) among the clergy, and consequently it was hit very hard by the abuse scandal. If I were really to state the full scope it, I'd have to post details that would allow others to identify it, and, in the interests of charity, I'd rather not do that. But suffice it to say that I have friends and family members, both of my generation and that of my parents, who have been propositioned by priests, and very few of them are practicing Catholics any longer. Altar boys would use the buddy system to make sure that no one was in the sacristy with Father alone. It's done such grave damage to the faith here.

The benefit, though, is that wherever there was a priest who exuded a robust masculinity, who hadn't the effeminate quality that other priests had, he would find himself very popular with young men, to the point that his parish would become known as an incubator of vocations (though many left seminary eventually and refused to talk about it). Sadly, those priests would often find themselves on the bishop's naughty list for some reason or another. Seeing a good priest I trusted, who helped teach me how to serve the TLM, unceremiously cashiered recently, shows that this rubbish that has been going on for a few generations is still very much with us. It's led to a broad loss of trust in the bishop and the priests here, up to the point that I'd even call the faith moribund here.

So, do I find it credible that half of clergy are gay? I absolutely do, though I'm sure the proportion varies considerably from diocese to diocese.

Wouldn't it be more fair to say that perhaps in some dioceses half of priests are gay, but that it's a magnanimous statement which requires a lot of hard data to claim this is true of the Church as a whole? I have no doubt some dioceses have been dreadful. The Archdiocese of Miami is notorious for it. But I think we should be very reserved and careful when we make such big statements.

[Freedom]

Link please.

[bardegaulois]

4 minutes ago, PhuturePriest said:

Wouldn't it be more fair to say that perhaps in some dioceses half of priests are gay, but that it's a magnanimous statement which requires a lot of hard data to claim this is true of the Church as a whole? I have no doubt some dioceses have been dreadful. The Archdiocese of Miami is notorious for it. But I think we should be very reserved and careful when we make such big statements.

But you're presuming half as an upper limit in any diocese. I'm sure there are some in which it's an absolute majority, a supermajority even. Likewise there is some dioceses in which there are few or even no gay priests. It's impossible to know the true figures; some researcher could try a survey, but no one is ever completely truthful on surveys. Would half be a reasonable collective mean across all dioceses of the United States, or even of the entire Western world? Just based on what I've seen in my travels, I wouldn't be at all surprised if that were conclusively proven to be the case.

[Nihil Obstat]

33 minutes ago, PhuturePriest said:

Wouldn't it be more fair to say that perhaps in some dioceses half of priests are gay, but that it's a magnanimous statement which requires a lot of hard data to claim this is true of the Church as a whole?

You need to study harder in Composition.

[PhuturePriest]

1 hour ago, bardegaulois said:

But you're presuming half as an upper limit in any diocese. I'm sure there are some in which it's an absolute majority, a supermajority even. Likewise there is some dioceses in which there are few or even no gay priests. It's impossible to know the true figures; some researcher could try a survey, but no one is ever completely truthful on surveys. Would half be a reasonable collective mean across all dioceses of the United States, or even of the entire Western world? Just based on what I've seen in my travels, I wouldn't be at all surprised if that were conclusively proven to be the case.

That's a pretty big stretch, and I don't think it's reasonable to believe in such a thing unless presented with solid evidence. 

[Amppax]

50 minutes ago, Nihil Obstat said:

You need to study harder in Composition.

Or

[PhuturePriest]

14 minutes ago, Amppax said:

Or

I don't think this meme is as magnanimous as you think it is.

[veritasluxmea]

An adult I respect on FB "believes in" this article (not sure how else to put it) and is talking about how seminaries are suffering from a homosexual activity problem and the whole nine yards. I just... ugh. Not something I want to see on my feed. 

[superblue]

proof, proof, proof, proof ! everybody wants proof. This study shows this, this one shows that, you can trust this study but not that study, agenda, agenda, agenda.  A bad priest or bishop , is just that, regardless of sexual orientation.  The rules are the problem and the double standards. We are being taught and teaching that you can be a homosexual, just don't act on those homosexual tendencies; and you can be a homosexual priest if you do not act on those tendencies  AND if you do not acknowledge that you are indeed a homosexual, not matter how obvious it may or may not be. THOUGH, do not mention heterosexual priests ever being able to be married, and do not quote history and the priests, bishops, and past Popes that have been.  When the rules become grey, and exceptions are constantly being made, and nothing is clear, trouble happens.  Either homosexuals are able to be in the priesthood, with out having to hide their sexual orientation, or they should not be allowed in at all, that to me should be the issue; not an issue of crimes by priests. A crime is a crime and you can put any sexual orientation, or race, it is still a crime one is talking about.

If the church leaders really wanted to emphasis welcoming homosexuals into the church, then do it, stop making those with SSA hide, and let them be an example of celibacy. An let those homosexual priests be the example to others facing SSA and wanting to be Catholic. Instead of letting the media dictate how they should feel about the Church and having congregations and clergy confused as on how to approach the situation because leaders at the top send mixed messages or completely ignore and hide from the situation that they in part helped create.

[PhuturePriest]

5 minutes ago, superblue said:

proof, proof, proof, proof ! everybody wants proof. This study shows this, this one shows that, you can trust this study but not that study, agenda, agenda, agenda.  A bad priest or bishop , is just that, regardless of sexual orientation.  The rules are the problem and the double standards. We are being taught and teaching that you can be a homosexual, just don't act on those homosexual tendencies; and you can be a homosexual priest if you do not act on those tendencies  AND if you do not acknowledge that you are indeed a homosexual, not matter how obvious it may or may not be. THOUGH, do not mention heterosexual priests ever being able to be married, and do not quote history and the priests, bishops, and past Popes that have been.  When the rules become grey, and exceptions are constantly being made, and nothing is clear, trouble happens.  Either homosexuals are able to be in the priesthood, with out having to hide their sexual orientation, or they should not be allowed in at all, that to me should be the issue; not an issue of crimes by priests. A crime is a crime and you can put any sexual orientation, or race, it is still a crime one is talking about.

If the church leaders really wanted to emphasis welcoming homosexuals into the church, then do it, stop making those with SSA hide, and let them be an example of celibacy. An let those homosexual priests be the example to others facing SSA and wanting to be Catholic. Instead of letting the media dictate how they should feel about the Church and having congregations and clergy confused as on how to approach the situation because leaders at the top send mixed messages or completely ignore and hide from the situation that they in part helped create.

Who said anything about making priests with SSA hide? No one here has said that. I have no issue with a priest being open about his SSA. So long as he remains faithful to his promise of celibacy, I think such a thing would be a great inspiration for others who struggle. I can't wait for the day we canonize the first saint who openly had same-sex attraction and used it to inspire others who struggle with it to strive for holiness. 

[CatherineM]

No idea who or what Voris is.