Latin Hymns

[DominicanHeart]

I agree. Mozarts Ave Verum is my all time favorite. But I have a few other favorites as well

[Credo in Deum]

 

While we have lost many of these amazing hymns we should all understand that VCII asked that Latin and Gregorian Chant have pride of place in the Liturgy. Simply put, these great things have been lost because we have been lazy about guarding them and reclaiming them.  We have willfully drunk the kool-aid promulgated by those who want us to believe that the Council called for such croutons like, "the NO is  the Vernacular Mass."  

[PhuturePriest]

15 minutes ago, Credo in Deum said:

 

While we have lost many of these amazing hymns we should all understand that VCII asked that Latin and Gregorian Chant have pride of place in the Liturgy. Simply put, these great things have been lost because we have been lazy about guarding them and reclaiming them.  We have willfully drunk the kool-aid promulgated by those who want us to believe that the Council called for such croutons like, "the NO is  the Vernacular Mass."  

Pope Paul VI also sent out a list of Gregorian chants he wanted at every Mass and sent it to every bishop in the world. Sadly, it seems the bishops looked at the letter and promptly threw it away.

[Credo in Deum]

Just now, PhuturePriest said:

Pope Paul VI also sent out a list of Gregorian chants he wanted at every Mass and sent it to every bishop in the world. Sadly, it seems the bishops looked at the letter and promptly threw it away.

It's just sad.  Then it doesn't stop other people blaming Pope Paul VI for that croutons. 

[PhuturePriest]

Just now, Credo in Deum said:

It's just sad.  Then it doesn't stop other people blaming Pope Paul VI for that croutons. 

In the words of Tim Staples, "With all the nonsense on the internet about Pope Paul VI, I can't wait until the day he's canonized."

[dominicansoul]

I understand Vatican II did not remove these beautiful hymns from us, but Vatican II was used (and is still being used) to implement liberal ideology into the church.  (Pope Paul VI called it the "smoke of satan.")  

I am an admirer of Pope Paul VI.  I believe he suffered tremendously because of this and what it did to the church, especially in the West.  I recall reading the account of Mother Marie William McGregor, O.P. who was the Superior of the Nashies at the time.  That community felt the effects almost immediately when hundreds of Sisters decided to ditch their habits and their horariums and let the "spirit of Vatican II" lead them into a new way of living their consecrated lives.  She would have none of it.  When she saw what this "spirit" was doing to several communities, she took the bold step to speak out against the changes at the annual LCWR conferences.  She also resigned from those conferences.  She disciplined her Sisters and brought them back into line.  When bishops and priests scolded her for this, she made a personal visit to Pope Paul VI to ask him herself for direction.  Her visit is recorded in the Nashies history.  It descibed the meeting in detail.  From what I read of that meeting, the Pope was weary and saddened by what was happening to religious life in America.  He of course told her that none of these changes should be made, and she came back to direct and guide the Nashies through those turbulent years.  Is it any wonder their community still stands as a beacon of authentic religious life today?  Is it any wonder I honor that courageous woman and seek her intercession when it comes to restoring our Liturgy?

When i started this thread, i was in tears.  What I wrote in my original post came to me during a conversation I had with God at Holy Hour about how much was forced upon my generation growing up in the Post-Vatican II church.  It seemed like those in authority had no desire to follow any Vatican II documents on worship, but created their own thing.  The Liturgy seemed quite foreign to us, and as a child, I could sense it was wrong...I'm not talking about the Novus Ordo Mass in general, but all the strange things added and subtracted and personal preferences of the priests that get stuck into the Liturgy.  I can't list it all here.  I thank God my parents were a bit older and had come from the rich traditions of Pre-Vatican II.  They also knew their religion and Loved Jesus very much.  So I followed their lead and not our priests.  

I'm angry because much of what was beautiful and majestic and sacred and holy were taken from us.  This is why it is important to know what we've lost, in the hope that we can restore it all back to its proper place again...my fellow Catholics, it's our duty and our jobs to do this...

I was an organist for over 30 years, believe me, I know what banality in Liturgical music does to a congregation.  The way we worship certainly does affect the Church... I quit because I didn't want to be a part of the problem any longer...now I hope to be a part of the solution...

[MarysLittleFlower]

13 hours ago, PhuturePriest said:

Pope Paul VI also sent out a list of Gregorian chants he wanted at every Mass and sent it to every bishop in the world. Sadly, it seems the bishops looked at the letter and promptly threw it away.

That's so sad

[MarysLittleFlower]

22 minutes ago, dominicansoul said:

I understand Vatican II did not remove these beautiful hymns from us, but Vatican II was used (and is still being used) to implement liberal ideology into the church.  (Pope Paul VI called it the "smoke of satan.")  

I am an admirer of Pope Paul VI.  I believe he suffered tremendously because of this and what it did to the church, especially in the West.  I recall reading the account of Mother Marie William McGregor, O.P. who was the Superior of the Nashies at the time.  That community felt the effects almost immediately when hundreds of Sisters decided to ditch their habits and their horariums and let the "spirit of Vatican II" lead them into a new way of living their consecrated lives.  She would have none of it.  When she saw what this "spirit" was doing to several communities, she took the bold step to speak out against the changes at the annual LCWR conferences.  She also resigned from those conferences.  She disciplined her Sisters and brought them back into line.  When bishops and priests scolded her for this, she made a personal visit to Pope Paul VI to ask him herself for direction.  Her visit is recorded in the Nashies history.  It descibed the meeting in detail.  From what I read of that meeting, the Pope was weary and saddened by what was happening to religious life in America.  He of course told her that none of these changes should be made, and she came back to direct and guide the Nashies through those turbulent years.  Is it any wonder their community still stands as a beacon of authentic religious life today?  Is it any wonder I honor that courageous woman and seek her intercession when it comes to restoring our Liturgy?

When i started this thread, i was in tears.  What I wrote in my original post came to me during a conversation I had with God at Holy Hour about how much was forced upon my generation growing up in the Post-Vatican II church.  It seemed like those in authority had no desire to follow any Vatican II documents on worship, but created their own thing.  The Liturgy seemed quite foreign to us, and as a child, I could sense it was wrong...I'm not talking about the Novus Ordo Mass in general, but all the strange things added and subtracted and personal preferences of the priests that get stuck into the Liturgy.  I can't list it all here.  I thank God my parents were a bit older and had come from the rich traditions of Pre-Vatican II.  They also knew their religion and Loved Jesus very much.  So I followed their lead and not our priests.  

I'm angry because much of what was beautiful and majestic and sacred and holy were taken from us.  This is why it is important to know what we've lost, in the hope that we can restore it all back to its proper place again...my fellow Catholics, it's our duty and our jobs to do this...

I was an organist for over 30 years, believe me, I know what banality in Liturgical music does to a congregation.  The way we worship certainly does affect the Church... I quit because I didn't want to be a part of the problem any longer...now I hope to be a part of the solution...

I know what you mean DS and this has been a major struggle for me as well. When I was looking into the Church I was reading books about the Saints, devotions, etc, and it gave me such a rich view of Catholicism. I really loved it. And then when I started going to Mass, I loved the Eucharist but felt like something wasn't there. I couldn't find all those things I read about except the Sacraments. It was sometimes painful to be becoming Catholic because I felt like the Church I loved didn't exist. Of course its the same Church, I know that, but my very contemporary parish with modern hymns seemed very different.

I discovered some videos with old holy cards, chant and pictures of the TLM and I couldn't stop watching them. When I went to my first TLM with all the chant and incense etc I had no clue what's going on but I cried, it was so beautiful and exactly what I had sought. I don't just mean aesthetic beauty but something that lifts the mind to God.

I wish so much that all this beautiful music, devotions, were also in the OF. It makes the Mass feel like sharing in the worship of Angels, rather than a "gathering".

This Sunday I couldn't go to the TLM and went to my nearby parish. There are good things there - I like the priests, the rubrics are followed, and at this time of year there are nice Christmas hymns. But there was also clapping and talking after Mass and one of the hymns was "City of God", that I'm just not fond of at all.. Its too centred on us, just like many other modern hymns. And I don't think we build the city of God, rather God builds His Kingdom with our cooperation and through us. Also many modern parishes around here lack artwork - they might have some, but little and in a more modern style. But sacred art can be very helpful. 

I remember a couple maybe in their 40s visiting our FSSP parish and I overheard them saying, this is just like going back in time. In a way it is, and it makes me really sad that in most parishes today Catholics don't get to experience all these aspects of our faith, and they think what they have is all there is - and "that's what its like today". But the OF could be done in a much different way. I think a lot of people have used VII. I also believe Pope Paul VI suffered a lot. Because of all this I just mostly stay in my little TLM parish bubble where the liturgy has not been affected by any liberalism. 

By the way, do you happen to know what year was the meeting with Pope Paul VI that you describe?