Peace Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 (edited) Should we not pray for ISIS? I was thinking about this when reading the thread on Syrian refugees. We are to love our enemies and pray for those who persecute us. And that includes ISIS does it not? And when I say "Pray for ISIS" it should not only be "Pray that they are converted so that they no longer have a desire to harm us." We should earnestly pray for their well-being as they desire and attempt to kill us? We should pray for them with the same love that we pray for our family members? Is that crazy? Doesn't that sound crazy? But Jesus truly demands of us a love that is radical, right? A few days ago I watched a movie called "A man for all seasons" about St. Thomas More. I was truly touched by the story of this man, who was willing to give up his own life rather than sign something as simple as a piece of paper. That just seemed crazy to me, but that is really what we are called to. A love that almost seems crazy. Just some random thoughts I guess. Edited November 19, 2015 by Peace Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gabriela Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 Yes, I definitely agree with you. I think all Christians would. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarysLittleFlower Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 I agree with praying for them. And I really liked that movie too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Socrates Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 (edited) I would clarify to say to "pray for the people who are members of ISIS, that they may convert and find Christ." ISIS as an organization and the false religion/ideology behind it are thoroughly evil and satanic. Without the clarification, "pray for ISIS" is the same as saying "pray for Nazism." ISIS is an evil organization which must be defeated for the good of everyone. And, sorry, but converting from this evil is absolutely necessary to the well-being of those persons enslaved by this vile ideology, as following ISIS and its evil mission of hate, murder, and rape is a sure path to their soul's' eternal damnation. ISIS's activities are evil and murderous to the innocent as well as deadly to the souls of those perpetuating this evil. While obviously, it would be best if these evil terrorists converted peacefully with no harm to anyone, if harming or killing them is necessary to protect others from their murder, rape, and torture, then so be it. If it's not just to fight ISIS to protect others from harm, then its not just to fight anyone. Simply allowing them to continue murdering and perpetuating evil on others out of misplaced "love"or concern for their physical well-being is neither loving nor Christian. Edited November 19, 2015 by Socrates Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nihil Obstat Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 Our prayers should include that Daesh, jihadists, and indeed all Muslims, convert to the One True Faith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dominicansoul Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 We need to pray that God stunts their IQ levels... I just read they took down the Russian airplane with a bomb made out of a Scweppes Soda Pop can....sheesh... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarysLittleFlower Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 I agree its best for their welfare to convert... That is the most good we can ask for anyone, so that they would be with God We need to pray that God stunts their IQ levels... I just read they took down the Russian airplane with a bomb made out of a Scweppes Soda Pop can....sheesh... For real? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beatitude Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 I was inspired by the example of St Therese of Lisieux, who prayed for the convicted murderer, Pranzini. She did so with great love and compassion for him. I think it's easier to pray for people if we have a name and a face, so I spiritually 'adopted' one member of IS and I pray for her by name daily. I am sure God hears my prayer for all of members in IS when I pray for her. The style of prayer that we have in our PM November intentions for souls in purgatory could also be helpful - pray for the soul in IS who is most afraid, most at risk, most filled with hate, the soul who is most doubtful about the morals of what they're doing, the souls who have been forcibly recruited and don't feel as if they have a choice, the decision-makers in IS who give cruel orders, etc. Personally I find that it is easier for me to focus in prayer this way than if I just say, "God, I pray for members of Daesh." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peace Posted November 19, 2015 Author Share Posted November 19, 2015 (edited) I actually don't disagree with you Socrates. I didn't even think that was possible. I would clarify to say to "pray for the people who are members of ISIS, that they may convert and find Christ." ISIS as an organization and the false religion/ideology behind it are thoroughly evil and satanic. Without the clarification, "pray for ISIS" is the same as saying "pray for Nazism." ISIS is an evil organization which must be defeated for the good of everyone. Yeah. Thanks for the clarification. I meant "pray for the people who are members of ISIS". I did not mean that we should pray for the success of the organization itself. It is a point that goes without saying, but worth clarifying nonetheless. And, sorry, but converting from this evil is absolutely necessary to the well-being of those persons enslaved by this vile ideology, as following ISIS and its evil mission of hate, murder, and rape is a sure path to their soul's' eternal damnation. ISIS's activities are evil and murderous to the innocent as well as deadly to the souls of those perpetuating this evil. I also agree that turning away from that type of evil is necessary for their well being. I would certainly pray for their conversion. But I do not think that our prayers need to be necessarily limited to that. If some of them are hungry (I have no idea if this is the case) you could also pray for those sort of things as well. While obviously, it would be best if these evil terrorists converted peacefully with no harm to anyone, if harming or killing them is necessary to protect others from their murder, rape, and torture, then so be it. If it's not just to fight ISIS to protect others from harm, then its not just to fight anyone. Simply allowing them to continue murdering and perpetuating evil on others out of misplaced "love"or concern for their physical well-being is neither loving nor Christian. I believe in the just war doctrine, of course. But you can still pray for them. What is "misplaced love"? Love, at least as I understand it, is not something that can be misplaced. So when you put "love" in quotes - exactly what definition of "love" are you using there? When I say love I mean love. I do not mean some warped version of it that is not truly love. . . I also do not think that we should desire that they be physically harmed, or killed. There are situations where we may have to physically harm them or kill them as a matter of necessity, but the internal desire or prayer that a non-violent solution may occur should not change, I think. I don't know if the "If we have to kill them then oh well, so be it" attitude is exactly the one that we should have. Edited November 19, 2015 by Peace Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 (edited) I heard the Vatican Exorcist say they are Satan in the flesh. It's impossible to pray for Satan so how can one pray for isis if they are actually Satan? I personally hate the devil. Edited November 19, 2015 by Guest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peace Posted November 19, 2015 Author Share Posted November 19, 2015 (edited) I heard the Vatican Exorcist say they are Satan in the flesh. It's impossible to pray for Satan so how can one pray for isis if they are actually Satan? I personally hate the devil. I think that perhaps you may have taken those words a bit too literally. It is not as though Satan was born incarnate in them in the same sense that the Second Person of the Trinity was born incarnate in Jesus. Edited November 19, 2015 by Peace Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dominicansoul Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 I'm not one to tell people how to pray or what to say, but...I'm praying for the total destruction of ISIS and that they all drop dead before they try another horrible attack against anybody...I guess I can pray that hopefully in the process of dropping dead they ask God for forgiveness? Iono, they dont' even believe in Jesus, so I think this is gonna take some extra flogging... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peace Posted November 19, 2015 Author Share Posted November 19, 2015 I'm not one to tell people how to pray or what to say, but...I'm praying for the total destruction of ISIS and that they all drop dead before they try another horrible attack against anybody...I guess I can pray that hopefully in the process of dropping dead they ask God for forgiveness? Iono, they dont' even believe in Jesus, so I think this is gonna take some extra flogging... Well. If God wills their destruction then it shall be. I guess that I should not come on here and try to tell other people how they should pray either. I guess that would not be right. But it does seem to me that we should pray for them in the same manner that we would hope to be prayed for if we were in their position. At least for me, I would think that if I were in grave error or committing grave sin, I would want people to pray for my conversion to good, rather than to pray that I be destroyed . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dairygirl4u2c Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarysLittleFlower Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 I was inspired by the example of St Therese of Lisieux, who prayed for the convicted murderer, Pranzini. She did so with great love and compassion for him. I think it's easier to pray for people if we have a name and a face, so I spiritually 'adopted' one member of IS and I pray for her by name daily. I am sure God hears my prayer for all of members in IS when I pray for her. The style of prayer that we have in our PM November intentions for souls in purgatory could also be helpful - pray for the soul in IS who is most afraid, most at risk, most filled with hate, the soul who is most doubtful about the morals of what they're doing, the souls who have been forcibly recruited and don't feel as if they have a choice, the decision-makers in IS who give cruel orders, etc. Personally I find that it is easier for me to focus in prayer this way than if I just say, "God, I pray for members of Daesh." I really like this idea! I actually don't disagree with you Socrates. I didn't even think that was possible. Yeah. Thanks for the clarification. I meant "pray for the people who are members of ISIS". I did not mean that we should pray for the success of the organization itself. It is a point that goes without saying, but worth clarifying nonetheless. I also agree that turning away from that type of evil is necessary for their well being. I would certainly pray for their conversion. But I do not think that our prayers need to be necessarily limited to that. If some of them are hungry (I have no idea if this is the case) you could also pray for those sort of things as well. I believe in the just war doctrine, of course. But you can still pray for them. What is "misplaced love"? Love, at least as I understand it, is not something that can be misplaced. So when you put "love" in quotes - exactly what definition of "love" are you using there? When I say love I mean love. I do not mean some warped version of it that is not truly love. . . I also do not think that we should desire that they be physically harmed, or killed. There are situations where we may have to physically harm them or kill them as a matter of necessity, but the internal desire or prayer that a non-violent solution may occur should not change, I think. I don't know if the "If we have to kill them then oh well, so be it" attitude is exactly the one that we should have. Yes killing an aggressor is something from necessity as self defense... Its a last resort when other methods have failed. Its not some ideal but a tolerated exception. Its not in itself a good thing rather its from necessity. I think we should rather pray for conversion I heard the Vatican Exorcist say they are Satan in the flesh. It's impossible to pray for Satan so how can one pray for isis if they are actually Satan? I personally hate the devil. i think this was probably referring to the organisation. The human beings are still humans with souls who Jesus died for. They are not literally the devil. Also the devil can't repent but they can. So we can pray for them I'm not one to tell people how to pray or what to say, but...I'm praying for the total destruction of ISIS and that they all drop dead before they try another horrible attack against anybody...I guess I can pray that hopefully in the process of dropping dead they ask God for forgiveness? Iono, they dont' even believe in Jesus, so I think this is gonna take some extra flogging... I think that God wants to show mercy to souls before justice. . justice is if they reject His mercy. I read of a victim soul who suffered the pain of the Passion for three hours for Stalin but he still rejected the grace. However God gave him a chance. St Faustina was asked to pray the Divine Mercy chaplet for a city that was facing chastisement. For this reason I think its good to pray for their conversion first and not be afraid to hope in that and make sacrifices. That's the best way to prevent the attacks because Jesus died for each of these souls, we don't want His death to be in vain for them Like how Jesus said, to love our enemies and pray for them... When He was crucified He prayed for the people who were against Him and said "Father forgive them for they know not what they do" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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