The Latin Mass

[Peace]

So what's so great about the "Latin Mass" for all of you Latin Mass heads out there?

I've been twice. Mostly didn't get it. Seem to prefer the Mass in a language that I can speak.

I am not saying that one is better/worse than the other. They are both from the Church and both good. But I am just wondering for folks who prefer the Latin Mass, what are the reasons for that preference?

I usually go to a "new mass" at a fairly conservative church here in Arlington VA. Actually the parish I go offers the Latin Mass, and even during the new mass the parts that can be said in Latin usually are said in Latin (such as the Gloria, etc.)

One thing I thought that was cool about the Gloria in Latin is that it actually flows better than when it is said in English, rythmatically.

One thing that I thought about the Latin Mass was that, depending on one's mental approach to it, it seems that it can become rather Protestant in that it becomes "entertainment". I thought that perhaps there was a danger that one could get too caught up in the beauty of the rite itself, such that the focus turns more inward or becomes more about one's own experience, rather than on worshiping God.

Peace

[chrysostom]

I go to one most of the time.  I find myself at home there.  I don't really worry about the details of the differences.  Much ink has been spilled over the differences that I won't repeat.  I just like it and I like the community I found at the particular church I go to.

If there is any particular element I would mention, it is the silence.  But I've been to very quiet OF Masses too.  I like those very much as well.

At Mass all I want to do is unite myself to Jesus Crucified.  Whatever is going to help me do that is a plus.  

[chrysostom]

One thing that I thought about the Latin Mass was that, depending on one's mental approach to it, it seems that it can become rather Protestant in that it becomes "entertainment". I thought that perhaps there was a danger that one could get too caught up in the beauty of the rite itself, such that the focus turns more inward or becomes more about one's own experience, rather than on worshiping God.

Sure, maybe.  But I think that could be equally said of any Mass if we're being hypothetical here.  And I am very hesitant to apply the label "Protestant" to any form of the Mass.  In fact, I wouldn't.

Regarding the focus being "inward" (now we're not really talking about EF or OF or anything) ... that's a separate but interesting discussion.  For example, there is always a lot of inwardness in my own experience of any Mass.  I look inward and tell my soul to adore.  It's hard to "lose myself" in God, though of course I would like to.  I'm always aware of the interiority of the encounter with Christ.  I guess what I mean is that I'm struggling to understand your comment about something becoming about one's own experience.  Everything is filtered through my own experience.  I don't know how to do things otherwise.

[beatitude]

 

One thing that I thought about the Latin Mass was that, depending on one's mental approach to it, it seems that it can become rather Protestant in that it becomes "entertainment". I thought that perhaps there was a danger that one could get too caught up in the beauty of the rite itself, such that the focus turns more inward or becomes more about one's own experience, rather than on worshiping God.

Interestingly, this is how some EF attendees feel about the OF - that it's as if the priest is giving a performance, because celebrating Mass facing the people puts more attention on him than on the Eucharist itself.

I think anything that you are unfamiliar with can leave you feeling like it's entertainment. When I attended an EF Mass for the first time (I was twenty and in university), I was reduced to treating it as a translation test or just a beautiful aesthetic experience. I didn't know the prayers or the customs, so I was feverishly trying to translate the Latin instead of being able to immerse myself in prayer; and when I couldn't keep up, I just enjoyed the music and tried to pray that way. But for people who grew up with this Mass as their own or who attend it regularly, it's different. It's as familiar to them as the OF is to me.

Now I am equally at home in both Masses. It just took some work. I was in Krakow in Poland when I realised that I had grown to love the EF Mass. It was celebrated there in a way I'd never seen before - it was held frequently, so it had become part of the life of the Church again, and the churches were packed out. It didn't feel like something arcane that was just for people who see themselves as very traditional, it was just Mass.

Looking back on it, the period in which the EF Mass felt alien to me was valuable in its own right, because God, while being our loving and intimate Friend, is also the same awe-inspiring Power who passed by Elijah on the mountain and who told Moses, "No man can see my face and live." The EF Mass brought home some of that mystery and awe to me, a real sense of the distinction between the everyday and the holy. I love the OF too. I don't like the superiority squabbles over the two, because I think someone who is humble enough and devoted enough to Christ in the Eucharist doesn't have any need for them. Both of them bring us Christ. I do, however, understand why people might have a personal preference for one or the other.

[Aragon]

I like both forms of the Mass and usually attend the OF, but I probably like the EF more. There are few things more beautiful than the hushed tones of an early morning Low Mass as the sun rises.

[Credo in Deum]

I've been twice. Mostly didn't get it. Seem to prefer the Mass in a language that I can speak.

I've been to hundreds of EF Masses and still do not  'get it' which is why I love them so much.  The Mass is a Mystery which I will never be able to 'get' and the EF helps me to always remember this fact. The sacred language in the liturgy help me call my attention to fact that the Mass, while in the world, is not of the world.  I also continue to attend because oddly enough I believe the EF is the closest Mass which resembles what the Magisterium wanted for the OF after Vatican II.  I've been to very few OF Masse where Gregorian chant is sung, or where Latin is preserved or even given pride of place.  I feel one of the greatest errors which came from the false "spirit of Vatican II" was that the Novus Order was suppose to be the "Vernacular Mass", just because the vernacular was allowed.  

Anyway there are other reasons but I'll just leave it at this for now.  Gotta go to work. 

[John Paul]

About not understanding the Language St.Theresa of the Child Jesus said She did not know latin well and all the prayers were in latin.So she thought of it telling Jesus and only he knew so it would be a mystery.Just like our Catholic Faith.

[MarysLittleFlower]

I like the Latin Mass because of its sense of the sacred (using another language and music gives that impression too - that this is not the everyday), silence, mystery, and I find I can pray more easily there. This wasn't the case at first but only when I got used to the silence. I think its great for mental prayer. Its also very reverent so I can more easily express worship to Our Lord. The OF has the Eucharist too of course but I find I pray better at the Latin Mass. I also like the richness of it in the symbolism - there's so much detail, and it adds to that sense of the sacred too. I don't think its an aesthetic feeling only, it lifts the mind and heart to God. 

Edited October 29, 2015 by MarysLittleFlower

[Not The Philosopher]

Pretty much any form of the liturgy can be soured if you approach it with the wrong intentions. But I don't think it's necessarily wrong to be awed by the beauty of the Latin Mass - beauty is after all one of the transcendentals, and, like goodness and truth, is worth appreciating for its own sake.

I definitely appreciate the contemplative quality of the TLM. Paradoxically, I find it easier to participate prayerfully if I have less to say/do. Maybe it's because I'm an introvert....

[Lady-Indis]

I go to both forms. Some reasons I go to the Latin Mass when I can is because it's slower, (I think) more reverent, and is steeped in years of tradition. I go to English masses because sometimes, the EF is not available, or I can't fit an EF mass into my schedule and the Mass is Mass.  I am NOT anti-OF in any way--sometimes I am mildly sour about music/homilies/art but that's mostly it. 

[Peace]

Regarding the focus being "inward" (now we're not really talking about EF or OF or anything) ... that's a separate but interesting discussion.  For example, there is always a lot of inwardness in my own experience of any Mass.  I look inward and tell my soul to adore.  It's hard to "lose myself" in God, though of course I would like to.  I'm always aware of the interiority of the encounter with Christ.  I guess what I mean is that I'm struggling to understand your comment about something becoming about one's own experience.  Everything is filtered through my own experience.  I don't know how to do things otherwise.

Hmm. When I talk about it being "inward" or about one's own experience I guess here is kind of what I meant.

A very typical question among non-Catholics when they ask about a church service is "what do you get out of it?" I have been asked that so many times by people when I told them that I attended XYZ church or ABC type of church.

I also have a good non-Catholic friend who stopped going to her parents church recently in favor of another church, because she felt that she did not vibe with her parents church. She had said that she did not like the music there so much, or that she did not relate to the sermon so much, did not like the community, etc. So to her that church was not worth going to, and she switched.

Based on that it seems that the reason for going to church for many people kind of boils down to their own "experience", or how the Church makes them "feel". The view is primarily what I would call inward. It focuses on one's own experiences and one owns feelings.

I think that the Mass for the most part is different. It is not so much "what you get out of it" (although we do get a lot of out of it - for obvious reasons) but rather "what we put into it". Our view is more outward looking. We are there to worship. We are there to participate in the sacrifice of the Mass. So even if we find the homily to be bland (which I often do) or even if we find that the church service does not excite us or that the sense of community is lacking (I feel that way sometimes too), I would not consider the Mass to have been a "bad" or "unsuccessful" Mass, because I am not primarily there to have a good experience or have good feelings (although I often do feel good and have a good experience). I am there to keep my focus on God, to worship, to participate in the Mass, and I would call the Mass "good" or "successful" if I accomplish those things. I think the Mass is more "outward" or "vertical" in this sense.

[MarysLittleFlower]

I agree with not going to Mass to seek an experience, but I think what I meant - maybe the others too - is that the reverence and beauty of the Latin Mass can really lift the mind and heart to God, and help to have better dispositions to worship Him... Than in a very casual liberal liturgy - like a folk Mass. This has been my personal experience... It just helps me to have better dispositions to receive and give more we can also find this more in a more reverent Novus Ordo compared to a more casual one. The graces we receive does depend on our dispositions and though the intrinsic merit of the Mass is always infinite, the extrinsic merit can differ. There have been cases where I went to more casual liturgies and God helped me to worship Him, but it was something despite the aspects that I found troubling, not because of them. When the Mass is done reverently and seriously and there is time to pray, it can raise your prayer life to a new level over time - once you get used to that much silence! i struggled at first with that but now my mind is used to it. I found for me the TLM helps me to worship God even more than a very 'conservative' Novus Ordo Mass. 

I mean precisely about worship not sense of community etc which is not a primary aspect of it for me. 

Edited October 30, 2015 by MarysLittleFlower

[Gabriela]

I prefer the EF, but when I first went to one, I absolutely hated it. (It's a terrible thing to say that about any Mass, but it's true in this case.) Now, I love it for the quiet (I've always preferred low to high Mass), and for its facilitation of prayer and reflection. It's simple—simpler than any NO I've ever been to—which I prefer. I just feel closer to Christ at an EF Mass, because I'm better able to focus on Him there. At NOs, I'm constantly distracted by other people moving around and doing stuff. There's too much activity and my mind is scattered. For me, the EF is a more "inward" (with Jesus) experience.

[truthfinder]

My first EF, I liked, but I was pretty sure I wasn't going to make it my usual Sunday Mass.  My first low Mass, which I had only gone to after being pretty comfortable with the high Mass, was really 'painful' in the sense that there was so much silence.  Now, however, sometimes I just really enjoy not having to do anything at Mass.  Usually I'll follow the Mass texts, others my prayers, and sometimes just be in the silence. 

[Kateri89]

During this last year, I've gradually been transitioning to making the EF my regular Sunday Mass.  I still attend the OF during the week because it fits in with my work schedule better and I think it keeps me balanced.  When I first attended the Latin Mass I was completely lost.  I didn't have a missal to help me follow along, plus the parishioners stood, knelt, and sat at different times than I was used to.  There were two things that drew me in though.  The first was the fact that so many people came to Mass dressed like they were there to meet a King which of course they were.  Most women were veiled and everyone was modest.  The second (and probably more important) factor that made me fall in love with the Mass was the way our Eucharistic Lord was received.  Everyone knelt at the altar with their hands folded in prayer and received Him on the tongue.  Now, I know that there have been many debates about Communion on the tongue vs. in the hand and I'm not trying to stir up that debate.  All I'm saying is that it overwhelmed me to see such reverence and it made me think about when Thomas Merton attended his first mass and how when the priest elevated the Host, he just had this powerful sense that it was really Jesus.

At this point, I'm far more used to the EF and the novelty of it has worn off.  I still love it deeply though, in part for the reasons previously listed but also because I feel connected to the saints who celebrated it in the same way (that's a nod to All Saints Day).  And for what it's worth, it may just take you time to get used to it.  I imagine you may have felt the same way if you had only attended the EF your whole life and then suddenly attended the OF.  If you give it a few more tries and still struggle with it, by all means continue with the OF.  When I attend the OF I focus on showing Jesus as much reverence as I can.  We get as much out of the Mass as we put into it.  Hope that answers your question!