Ugh... More Interfaith Mixing...

[Aloysius]

Hey budge,
I just heard about this Christian guy... he went to convert a bunch of pagans, and he found this shrine. He went to all the people and said that through this shrine they were worshiping a God they didn't fully understand, but he was gonna tell them who it was. It was ultimately the Christian God, the God of the Jews and of Jesus Christ. They just didn't know the fullness of him yet.

What a mix of Christianity and paganism, right? what do you think of this? Budge only answer, pls.

[Budge]

Wow you guys really stretch that verse.

There is nothing wrong with witnessing that way..

. I have a multitude of non-Christian friends and I even used their experiences to try and bring them to Christ.

However in the interfaith world proletyzation is frowned upon--all the "rap" Dialogue sessions in the world are only watering down the gospel rather then bringing anyone together to Christ. Everyone is saying that the Islamics, Hindus, Buddhists already know God which is far from true. [b]It is a watered down gospel, a gospel of the cosmic christ--"all religions lead to the same god"[/b] I suppose I didnt really venture that far becoming a Universalist seeking truths in other religions when I left Catholic Church at the age of 18 the first time. I have yet to read about any of these interfaith groups....saying Let me introduce you to Jesus Christ and actually doing any evangelization as done in the Bible.

What you end up is mixes like this website

[url="http://www.innerexplorations.com/"]http://www.innerexplorations.com/[/url]

The interfaith movement is a culmination of what Masons, and the New Age and others have been playing for years. It is the fulfilment of Revelation 17.

[url="http://www.diakrisis.org/Trojan.htm"]http://www.diakrisis.org/Trojan.htm[/url]

Edited June 14, 2004 by Budge

[Aloysius]

I'm just saying: THAT'S WHAT THE CATHOLIC CHURCH IS SAYING about the muslims, they worship the same God yet do not yet know who He is.

The Catholic Church does not frown upon evangelizing people in Islam. She clearly says that the Muslims have some truth (the same God they just don't know Him), we have all truth, and it'd be better for them to have all truth.

PAX

[Aloysius]

anyway, anyone can respond now, i just wanted to see. i figured he'd know what i was alluding to, but w/e.

My point was not to defend meshing of all religions which is clearly evil, but to say the Catholic Church does not believe in that. Saying that Muslims worship the True Creator of the Universe but do not fully know Him is just like St. Paul saying those people don't know Him but they are worshiping the Christian God.

PAX

[Apotheoun]

Aloysius,
You have made a valiant effort, but it is pointless to discuss this topic with a Fundamentalist, because as you implied in your original post, modern day Fundamentalists would have attacked St. Paul for his actions and statements at the Areopagus in Athens.

[Cure of Ars]

This type of behavior can be good or bad depending on why you are doing it. Bad if it sells out Christ. Good if it is to bring more people to Christ.

Why this type of behavior can be good is because we are at war. The biggest threat right now to the Catholic Church (and Christianity in general) is not Buddhism, Muslims, or any other religion. The biggest threat right now is secularism. It is so prevalent right now that most of us don’t even notice it. Most Christians right now care more for their bank account then they do for Christ. In France, right now, they are making laws that outlaw outward expressions of religion. In America they are making laws that are tearing down the 10 commandments and crosses. They are trying to hide all acknowledgments to God. If we are going to get world culture moving back in the right direction we are going to need all people of good will who have not sold out to secularism yet.

For the second reason I will quote Paul;

Although I am free in regard to all, I have made myself a slave to all so as to win over as many as possible. To the Jews I became like a Jew to win over Jews; to those under the law I became like one under the law--though I myself am not under the law--to win over those under the law. To those outside the law I became like one outside the law--though I am not outside God's law but within the law of Christ--to win over those outside the law. To the weak I became weak, to win over the weak. I have become all things to all, to save at least some. All this I do for the sake of the gospel, so that I too may have a share in it. (1 Cor 9:19-23)

[Winchester]

Budge, you're a non practicing Catholic? I did a stint as a communist, once, and then a wierd heretic thing that involved not going to church at all. It was pretty easy. I also tried being a liberal, but it was tiresome being wrong and defensive all the time.

Also, for a while I thought Doinald Trump was pretty cool, but that ws mainly due to Alex from Family Ties being so darned funny.

[Budge]

[quote] I'm just saying: THAT'S WHAT THE CATHOLIC CHURCH IS SAYING about the muslims, they worship the same God yet do not yet know who He is.[/quote]

And I disagree, I believe if anything they are following a demon....they dont KNOW God even in a diminished form.

By the way everyone Im a woman--everyone keeps calling me "He" just so you all know;) Im a bit older then most here too, Im 35.


[quote]You have made a valiant effort, but it is pointless to discuss this topic with a Fundamentalist, because as you implied in your original post, modern day Fundamentalists would have attacked St. Paul for his actions and statements at the Areopagus in Athens. [/quote]

I agree with what Paul did and I witness to unbelievers all the time using what they believe as a stepping stone. The main point is preaching the gospel. I do not see the gospel preached at any of these interfaith groups.
[quote] The biggest threat right now is secularism. It is so prevalent right now that most of us don’t even notice it. Most Christians right now care more for their bank account then they do for Christ. In France, right now, they are making laws that outlaw outward expressions of religion. In America they are making laws that are tearing down the 10 commandments and crosses. They are trying to hide all acknowledgments to God. If we are going to get world culture moving back in the right direction we are going to need all people of good will who have not sold out to secularism yet. [/quote]

I think the bigggest threat is universalism--secularism hand in hand. Secular Humanism, Theosophy all playing their huge roles.

I agree with what you have to say but remember its more then atheists, its liberal Christians, Humanists, universalists.

[quote]
Budge, you're a non practicing Catholic? I did a stint as a communist, once, and then a wierd heretic thing that involved not going to church at all. It was pretty easy. I also tried being a liberal, but it was tiresome being wrong and defensive all the time.[/quote]

Im not a Catholic. Im an Fundamental Baptist. See my intro. I also reject liberalism and communism. Glad you got out of that one.

[EcceNovaFacioOmni]

I don't see this as watering down the Gospel or liberalizing Christianity.

[quote][u][b]The Catechism of the Catholic Church[/b][/u]
[u]The Church and non-Christians[/u]

...

845 [b]To reunite all his children, scattered and led astray by sin, the Father willed to call the whole of humanity together into his Son's Church[/b]. The Church is the place where humanity must rediscover its unity and salvation. The Church is "the world reconciled." She is that bark which "in the full sail of the Lord's cross, by the breath of the Holy Spirit, navigates safely in this world." According to another image dear to the Church Fathers, [b]she is prefigured by Noah's ark, which alone saves from the flood[/b].334

[u]"Outside the Church there is no salvation"[/u]

846 How are we to understand this affirmation, often repeated by the Church Fathers?335 Re-formulated positively, it means that all salvation comes from Christ the Head through the Church which is his Body:


[b]Basing itself on Scripture and Tradition, the Council teaches that the Church, a pilgrim now on earth, is necessary for salvation[/b]: the one Christ is the mediator and the way of salvation; he is present to us in his body which is the Church. He himself explicitly asserted the necessity of faith and Baptism, and thereby affirmed at the same time the necessity of the Church which men enter through Baptism as through a door. Hence they could not be saved who, knowing that the Catholic Church was founded as necessary by God through Christ, would refuse either to enter it or to remain in it.336

847 [b]This affirmation is not aimed at those who, through no fault of their own, do not know Christ and his Church[/b]:


Those who, through no fault of their own, do not know the Gospel of Christ or his Church, but who nevertheless seek God with a sincere heart, and, moved by grace, try in their actions to do his will as they know it through the dictates of their conscience - those too may achieve eternal salvation.337

848 "Although in ways known to himself God can lead those who, through no fault of their own, are ignorant of the Gospel, to that faith without which it is impossible to please him, [b]the Church still has the obligation and also the sacred right to evangelize all men[/b]."338

Citations:
334 St. Augustine, Serm. 96,7,9:PL 38,588; St. Ambrose, De virg. 18 118:PL 16,297B; cf. already 1 Pet 3:20-21.
335 Cf. Cyprian, Ep. 73.21:PL 3,1169; De unit.: PL 4,509-536.
336 LG 14; cf. Mk 16:16; Jn 3:5.
337 LG 16; cf. DS 3866-3872.
338 AG 7; cf. Heb 11:6; 1 Cor 9:16.[/quote]

Edited June 15, 2004 by thedude

[the lumberjack]

[quote name='Aloysius' date='Jun 14 2004, 10:39 PM'] anyway, anyone can respond now, i just wanted to see. i figured he'd know what i was alluding to, but w/e.
[/quote]
Budge is a man???

[KennC]

[quote]Budge is a man???[/quote]
No, .. she is a she.

Peace, Ken

[Bruce S]

This organization has been on MY list, and I'm on their mailing list since 1995, please send an hour, listen if you CAN to the audio lectures, and you will see "home base central" for the Interfaith movement.

PLEASE take the time to really, really, understand these people, they have contacts that you wouldn't believe.

[url="http://www.lucistrust.org/goodwill/links.shtml"]http://www.lucistrust.org/goodwill/links.shtml[/url]

AUDIO LINK HERE ->> [url="http://www.lucistrust.org/radio/index.shtml"]http://www.lucistrust.org/radio/index.shtml[/url]

This one is particularly interesting, in REAL AUDIO

[url="http://media.lucistrust.net:8080/ramgen/lucistrust/inner-sight/75-new_world_religion.rm"]http://media.lucistrust.net:8080/ramgen/lu...rld_religion.rm[/url]

Edited June 16, 2004 by Bruce S