Attracted and repulsed

[MarysLittleFlower]

I didn't get that sense from the poster and I thought his later posts werent a flame war. I also think its not the best idea to assume that someone is judging unless its super obvious and here I don't think it was like that.. I just think I'd be judging myself if I assumed someone had a judgemental attitude. Its not always clear on forums because we don't see the other person and it turned out he also lived in community. Anyway I totally understand being vigilant because of the situations we've had here in the past but new posters don't know that and to them it could just look like they're unwelcome. If I posted my first thread and people wondered out loud if I'm a troll, I probably wouldn't want to return though I'm not a troll. Vocations is such a personal thing and its taking a risk to open up about ones struggles

Edited August 4, 2015 by MarysLittleFlower

[Sister Leticia]

I am having the unfortunately circumstance of feeling extremely attracted and called to a rule and way of life, but not to the communities that are "living it." For instance, if I was attracted to the Franciscan Rule, but friars weren't living the rule (Its not actually the Franciscan rule I'm referring to, I just don't want to hurt the name of a community). What does one do? On one hand, saints have reformed orders for centuries. On the other hand, is it healthy to enter a community that does not attract you? My inclination is to pursue the calling to the rule and live as perfectly as possible, but the people who do that get booted for "false piety" and not desiring to play bingo at recreation. In reality, I just want to live the rule. If the other brothers don't, I cannot make them but only encourage them by example. I see this beautiful rule, charism, and constitution, but it's being wasted for a life of comfort and laxity.

The honest truth is that it kills me to see the rules of the saints and inspirations of the Holy Spirit being left by the wayside for worldly things. So how do I go about this in addition to continual pray and reception of the sacraments? Do I visit with more rigorous communities with a less preferred rule without visiting the lax communities with the preferred rule? Or do I still visit the lax community?

I didn't get that sense from the poster and I thought his later posts werent a flame war. I also think its not the best idea to assume that someone is judging unless its super obvious and here I don't think it was like that..

MLF - maybe we have different definitions of "judging" and "being judgemental", but I certainly found the OP to be extremely judgemental and critical, especially in his repeated use of the word "lax".

Like Sister Marie I have noted some very judgemental comments and throwaway remarks about different congregations, which can be damaging to reputations (if a community is named, which hasn't happened in this thread) as well as hurtful to read. As Sister Marie and others have said, it's easy to read a rule, which might have been written for a completely different era and context, but another thing entirely to actually live it in the here and now. Things can look very different from the outside looking in, to when you're inside living the life.

That's not to say we don't benefit and learn from the questions and observations of our discerners and candidates, but it depends how the question is asked!

Thank you to those who have displayed great charity. And to those who have responded harshly based on false assumptions, thank you for a moment of humility. I actually have lived in community and have visited 5 other religious communities for periods longer than 4 days, some for weeks. I am truly greatful for the advice and edifying responses, but I'll conclude on here since I seem to have given some sort out of scandal. God bless y'all. And please pray for my discernment.

PS. I would admonish us all to take the advice of MLF for responding to those seeking honest help.

Simeon - during these various visits and stays with communities, did you find the opportunity to sit down with someone like the novice master or VD, and talk about your perceptions of how they lived their lives? If so, what response did you receive?

[superblue]

I do not think anyone is going to find any community that lives strictly or perfectly to The Rule; there are flaws in every religious community to some degree.

 

 

[krissylou]

Do check out some more austere communities -- it can be tricky because they may not have an internet presence and be a bit harder to find.

So, we keep using the Franciscans as an example.  Maybe you aren't called to the OFM or Capuchins.  But the Franciscans of the Primitive Observance http://religiouslife.com/profile-view?id=1406 or Franciscan Brothers Minor http://www.franciscanbrothersminor.com/FBM/Home_1.html sound much more like what you are describing.  But since the OFM are EVERYWHERE and these other ones are quite small and less likely to have a significant internet presence (I think the FPO had to basically be ordered to have any internet presence at all), it can take some looking to find them.  But whatever you do, don't enter the OFM with the determination of living like a FPO.  That won't end well at all.

Or maybe you find Ignatian spirituality utterly compelling but the Society of Jesus just aren't it.  Maybe the Oblates of the Virgin Mary http://www.omvusa.org/ is a better fit for you.  Everybody knows the Jesuits.  It can take some digging to come across the Oblates.

You get the idea.  There are congregations who maintain very very strict ways of life.  And maybe if, say, you're starting off attracted to Dominicans, who HAVEN'T really ever split into different congregations (while the Franciscans seem to have a new branch of the family tree every half hour) maybe that's God nudging you to explore different orders.

[puellapaschalis]

Have we mentioned the Carthusians yet? Cartusia nunquam reformata quia nunquam deformata

[Gabriela]

Cartusia nunquam reformata quia nunquam deformata

Absolutely untrue. I know it's their motto, but a lot has changed with the Carthusians since VII.

[truthfinder]

I know the Jesuits have been mentioned, but for whatever reason I keep thinking of the Hermits of the Blessed Virgin Mary of Mt. Carmel in Texas - as far as I can tell they celebrate the ordinary form. I have no personal experience with them, but I do get the impression they keep the rule rather strictly. http://www.carmelitehermits.org/index.htm

[puellapaschalis]

Absolutely untrue. I know it's their motto, but a lot has changed with the Carthusians since VII.

Ah yes - well that's quite another can of worms.

[Benedictus]

Absolutely untrue. I know it's their motto, but a lot has changed with the Carthusians since VII.

Well, this life is still very tough though. The fathers still only talk once a week and they spend most of their life in cell. Some places do now have central heating, flushing toilets and allow more ease in how they treat novices. There is also more connection between the fathers and brothers, but they still have seperate roles.

[Benedictus]

Thank you to those who have displayed great charity. And to those who have responded harshly based on false assumptions, thank you for a moment of humility. I actually have lived in community and have visited 5 other religious communities for periods longer than 4 days, some for weeks. I am truly greatful for the advice and edifying responses, but I'll conclude on here since I seem to have given some sort out of scandal. God bless y'all. And please pray for my discernment.

PS. I would admonish us all to take the advice of MLF for responding to those seeking honest help.

I think everyone was just being honest and helpful, even if it seemed harsh. Religious life is hard - sometimes living with the image of ideals can hurt us when we realize people, times and places fall very short of what we expect (as we do too).

It is tough when receiving a comment or analysis that seems scolding and blunt, especially if it reflects something about ourselves, but it can be a good preparation for religious life. The process isn't comfortable and it's not scold free either, not in my experience anyway The important thing is how you respond and move onward. I wish you luck and offer prayers

[katherineH]

Welcome Simeon! I pray that you will not become discouraged in your discernment process.  If our Lord has given you a vocation to religious life, then surely He will bless with a community that is consistent with the desires of your heart.  I don't think He would give you a vocation if there was no place for you to live out that vocation  

I second the recommendation to check out the Franciscans Minor in Ohio, and I would also add the Brothers of the Slaves of the Immaculate Heart of Mary

May God bless you on your journey!

Katherine

[Gabriela]

Well, this life is still very tough though. The fathers still only talk once a week and they spend most of their life in cell. Some places do now have central heating, flushing toilets and allow more ease in how they treat novices. There is also more connection between the fathers and brothers, but they still have seperate roles.

I don't know about the men, but I've discerned with the women. It certainly is still a difficult life. But anyone going in with an expectation that nothing has changed with the Carthusians will be very disappointed by their liturgy.

Still, if one really wants to give EVERYTHING to God, and to focus on Him ONLY, this really is the way to go. There are VERY few distractions in Carthusian life (although you can always find some if you're trying!).

[marigold]

I don't know about the men, but I've discerned with the women. It certainly is still a difficult life. But anyone going in with an expectation that nothing has changed with the Carthusians will be very disappointed by their liturgy.

Still, if one really wants to give EVERYTHING to God, and to focus on Him ONLY, this really is the way to go. There are VERY few distractions in Carthusian life (although you can always find some if you're trying!).

I'd be interested to hear more about your experiences, if you want to share?

[Gabriela]

I'd be interested to hear more about your experiences, if you want to share?

I don't mind sharing. What would you like to know? I spent three weeks with the Carthusian nuns of Reillane, France. They were absolutely delightful, with wonderful formation and an outstanding VD. I would recommend that community to any woman discerning the Carthusian life.

[marigold]

I don't mind sharing. What would you like to know? I spent three weeks with the Carthusian nuns of Reillane, France. They were absolutely delightful, with wonderful formation and an outstanding VD. I would recommend that community to any woman discerning the Carthusian life.

Just curious as to what it was like, what you got up to, what you talked about with the superiors, what kind of general impression they gave of what they're about and who they want to join them. Ya know. Stuff.