question about a Blessed

[MarysLittleFlower]

Blessed Jeanne LeBer was a recluse in Montreal. Here is an interesting article about her.

One thing I noticed is that she had to ask her parents for permission. Why do you think that is?

Could it be her age? Because I thought we are not obligated to ask for permission? Are there times one should?

 http://www.magnificat.ca/cal/en/saints/blessed_jeanne_leber.html

 

I'm hoping to visit her relics sometime  

[Gabriela]

Blessed Jeanne LeBer was a recluse in Montreal. Here is an interesting article about her.

One thing I noticed is that she had to ask her parents for permission. Why do you think that is?

Could it be her age? Because I thought we are not obligated to ask for permission? Are there times one should?

 http://www.magnificat.ca/cal/en/saints/blessed_jeanne_leber.html

 

I'm hoping to visit her relics sometime  

Probably one of the Church/religious vocations historians on Phatmass would answer this best, but I noticed immediately she's an only child. Back then, there was no "social safety net" to care for aging/ailing parents except for children. They were also an immigrant family, so they really had no one to look after them. Probably that was the reason why.

Of course, it could also be that, where she was from, marriage was so expected of a young woman (and it seems she was a rather well-off young woman—nobility?), and this vocation so extreme, that it would have really upset the parents. Usually that's not a bar, though. Maybe, though, again, because she was an only child of an immigrant family, that was a concern in this case. Especially if she was nobility/very high-class, the breaking of a family line by a vow of celibacy from the only child could be devastating.

Also note that she was a recluse in her parents' house, until her mother's death. Usually a young woman will get married and go be a financial burden on someone else. But with this arrangement, her parents would presumably feed her until they died. So if she wasn't well off, that's definitely something that would need permission.

Edited July 17, 2015 by Gabriela

[Sr Mary Catharine OP]

Jeanne LeBer is a fascinating person and I was happy to have prayed at her tomb in Montreal several years ago. I learned about her as a child because Lydia Longely, the 1st American born Sister was taken in by her family when she was abducted by the Indians. Lydia was from my area in MA.

[truthfinder]

Reading through the link you posted, it sounds more like she asked for permission not to marry one particular suitor.  At this time, both men and women needed parental permission to marry (at ages much older than one might think: iirc 21 for women and 25 for men). New France also had an absolute shortage of women during this time.  If you want more info, pm me: I know next to nothing about LeBer, but can give other historical background. 

[MarysLittleFlower]

Probably one of the Church/religious vocations historians on Phatmass would answer this best, but I noticed immediately she's an only child. Back then, there was no "social safety net" to care for aging/ailing parents except for children. They were also an immigrant family, so they really had no one to look after them. Probably that was the reason why.

Of course, it could also be that, where she was from, marriage was so expected of a young woman (and it seems she was a rather well-off young woman—nobility?), and this vocation so extreme, that it would have really upset the parents. Usually that's not a bar, though. Maybe, though, again, because she was an only child of an immigrant family, that was a concern in this case. Especially if she was nobility/very high-class, the breaking of a family line by a vow of celibacy from the only child could be devastating.

Also note that she was a recluse in her parents' house, until her mother's death. Usually a young woman will get married and go be a financial burden on someone else. But with this arrangement, her parents would presumably feed her until they died. So if she wasn't well off, that's definitely something that would need permission.

Some of these possible reasons kind of bother me because I'm an only child of an immigrant family with no other family here and my parents are not Catholic, really want me to marry, and would be upset if I don't. Yet I made a choice not to marry and sometimes I get fearful if I even could choose that without their permission. I wouldn't just abandon them, I'd make sure they're taken care of in some way (don't know how yet and I'd have to speak to communities)... But based on the article I don't know if my situation is some kind of impediment? 

[truthfinder]

Some of these possible reasons kind of bother me because I'm an only child of an immigrant family with no other family here and my parents are not Catholic, really want me to marry, and would be upset if I don't. Yet I made a choice not to marry and sometimes I get fearful if I even could choose that without their permission. I wouldn't just abandon them, I'd make sure they're taken care of in some way (don't know how yet and I'd have to speak to communities)... But based on the article I don't know if my situation is some kind of impediment? 

No! The world of New France in the 1600s was very different. Although there are responsibilities towards parents, they are of the present, not what might happen in the future.  And comparing the legal realities of a very different time and place is not productive to discernment. 

[Maggyie]

Keep in mind that in those days, various social security entitlements  that provide healthcare, housing, cash payments, food vouchers etc for the elderly didn't exist. Nowadays we have all those things. 

I don't want to downplay the difficulty of being elderly poor but it certainly is not the dire straits of centuries ago even if your parents have saved nothing. The vast majority of people are fairly comfortable and don't rely at all on their children (if anything they might still be supporting the "kids"!)

[marigold]

Some of these possible reasons kind of bother me because I'm an only child of an immigrant family with no other family here and my parents are not Catholic, really want me to marry, and would be upset if I don't. Yet I made a choice not to marry and sometimes I get fearful if I even could choose that without their permission. I wouldn't just abandon them, I'd make sure they're taken care of in some way (don't know how yet and I'd have to speak to communities)... But based on the article I don't know if my situation is some kind of impediment? 

Where did your parents migrate from, just out of interest?

[Yaatee]

Where did your parents migrate from, just out of interest?

Continuing with Marigold's post how many years have your parents lived in the UK?   How fluent are they in English?  What does their social and support system look like?  How well could they manage without you?

You have indicated in previous posts an interest in contemplative life, especially the Discalced Carmelites.  I am sure that you are aware that they are under papal enclosure (I think), anyway, they don't go out for anything but medical/dental reasons and don't let people into the enclosure, unless they are seriously discerning, and in many cases, not even then.  Of course, observance varies.  But I doubt that in these monasteries, one could "leave" temporarily to take care of aging parents.  However, in the more "modern" active institutes, and possibly even contemplative ones not under papal enclosure (?Benedictines?  Sacramentines, Precious Blood nuns?), it might be possible to take care of aging/terminal parents.  I have read of sisters and possibly some nuns doing this.

I know that you have taken a private vow to a celibate state, but in the chance that you do end up considering marriage in the future, know that spouses can often be very helpful in caring for elderly in-laws.  Although this I suspect more frequently involved the daughter-in-law (as in my case),  it could involve sons-in-law as well.

[Feankie]

MLF,

I don't know if you ever told us your age.  If you at or above the age of legal majority in your country then you certainly do not have to ask your parents for permission for anything.  Yes, you might do it out of courtesy, but it isn't a necessity.  I wish I could reach across the Internet and talk to you face to face. Just from your posts, you seem (IMO) to be wrapped up in a blanket of worry and what if's.  My prayer to you is to let them go.  Worry never helped or changed anything - it just makes one anxious and unsure of every little decision. Take and deep breath and just BE in the moment.