Catholic Support of Gay Marriage?

[Catlick]

In regard to some "truths" such as the Crusades and the Inquisition, the Catholic Church could not have been more wrong. 

The Crusade was a just war against Muslims who attacked Christian pilgrims in the Holy Land. 

The Inquisition was a just court in dealing with heresy and occultism. 

As Catholics we need not apologize. 

[Yaatee]

But not necessarily more purgation than will await you or me.

Good show again, Peace.

[Yaatee]

The Crusade was a just war against Muslims who attacked Christian pilgrims in the Holy Land. 

The Inquisition was a just court in dealing with heresy and occultism. 

As Catholics we need not apologize. 

You're really out there Catlick.  In some parallel universe.    You give Catholicism a bad name.

What the Catholic Church accomplished from both of these experiences, the Crusades, in which they failed (to rescue Jerusalem) and the Inquisition, where they also failed, was an extremely bad reputation, which haunts the Catholic Church to this day.

[Nihil Obstat]

 

You're really out there Catlick.  In some parallel universe.    You give Catholicism a bad name.

 

Totally inappropriate comment.

[MIKolbe]

Re the catechism: sin is a grave matter but is not regarded as either a grave matter or a sin by its performers.  I want to save my child from the possibility of mortal sin,  so I kill her.  Well, this is a grave matter, but I meant it in good faith. I have committed capital one murder, but I may not have committed a sin.

 

No, you would have committed a sin.

[veritasluxmea]

Re the catechism: sin is a grave matter but is not regarded as either a grave matter or a sin by its performers.  I want to save my child from the possibility of mortal sin,  so I kill her.  Well, this is a grave matter, but I meant it in good faith. I have committed capital one murder, but I may not have committed a sin.

I don't know what your beliefs are; but just so you know, Catholics like myself, MLF, JC, the pope in Rome, and the catechism, we do see that as a sin. If you decide "I'm going to do X!" FOR WHATEVER REASON (yes, even it's it done in good faith) and X is killing someone, you committed a sin. Even if you had good intentions. Their are a few times it changes, such as if your daughter was attacking you and about to kill you and you stopped her using the appropriate amount of force necessary and she died in the process (self-defense). Or if it was a complete freak accident. 

I think that a lot of those female duos and male duos had originally a sexual component. 

[Catlick]

the Inquisition, where they also failed, was an extremely bad reputation, which haunts the Catholic Church to this day.

The Inquisition (a) saved large parts of Europe from Protestantism and other heresies, (b) liberated communities from witches and other occult tyrants, (c) introduced basic rights like the right to counsel in age of barbarian common law ('the village elder says you're a witch? Let's throw you into the river in a sack with stones to see what God thinks'). 

And the 'extremely bad reputation'? LOL. Among 20th century historians, yes. But these guys collectively cheered when Stalin purged Soviet ranks, killing more people in a single week than the Inquisition did in +3 centuries. 

Edited July 2, 2015 by Catlick

[Ice_nine]

so 20th century historians think Stalin was a great guy? Must have missed that.

[Yaatee]

so 20th century historians think Stalin was a great guy? Must have missed that.

Irrevelant, sorry to say.  Also wrong century.  And Stalin didn't represent a church.

And Catlick, I don't believe in witches. You apparently do.

[Not The Philosopher]

To be fair, a lot of academics/intellectuals turned a blind eye to the atrocities committed behind the iron curtain, as it didn't jive with their political beliefs.

That said, iunno if you'll find many who were actively praising Stalin, with the exception of the odd guy who just wants to be edgy.

[Not The Philosopher]

Whoops this is totally going to turn into a debate about Stalin now isn't it.

[Ice_nine]

Irrevelant, sorry to say.  Also wrong century.  And Stalin didn't represent a church.

And Catlick, I don't believe in witches. You apparently do.

wrong century?

I don't get your response

[Yaatee]

wrong century?

I don't get your response

Cross reference from the Inquisition to Stalin.  And Not the Philo, yes what you say is true about European (mainly) leftists turning a blind eye to Stalin's atrocities.

[superblue]

When I heard that Ireland was the first country to legalize same-sex marriage by popular vote (62% in support), I was initially surprised because of the heavily Catholic population. Especially in the United States, younger Catholics support gay marriage at a higher rate than the rest of the population (http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2014/10/16/young-u-s-catholics-overwhelmingly-accepting-of-homosexuality/). A few articles attempt to offer an explanation (see, for example, http://theweek.com/articles/557418/why-are-catholics-supportive-gay-marriage) but I was wondering what you think. Why do you think that such a high percentage of Catholics support gay marriage? The Supreme Court is supposed to release a decision on Obergefell v. Hodges by the end of the month, and I've been seeing a lot of articles in the news related to this recently, so I've been giving it a lot of thought.

Ya got to scrutinize who is reporting figures,and what is their skin in the game.

IF younger Catholics are supporting gay marriage, it is due to the brain washing done in our social media, lead by mouth pieces in the democrat party ( which supports abortions among worse ) .  When young people see clean commercials with two people of the same gender not engaging in anything riske , not doing anything dangerous ,with background music that is pleasant to hear,, and a narrator with a calming voice speaking about how they just want to live the " American dream, and or adopt a child ", how can they not feel sympathetic ?  An the party of abortions goes on a rant about "equality" , and comparing the issue to former slavery with blacks in America, when there is real slavery taking place in the world still and this party could care less.  Now compound all of that with the fact that young people are very , very impressionable , may or may not be practicing Catholics, are not really thinking in a mature manner, but are basing their decisions on emotions, and sympathy  and there are a few answers as to why young Catholics are feeling this way. OR add onto this, that they may have homosexual friends and or relatives, who are good people, and they treat them with the same respect and dignity that they deserve in the image and likeness of God, and it compounds the problem more, now they can speak and engage first hand with someone who is homosexual, not a person who is robbing banks and doing drugs and etc , but just has a sexual orientation that is different than them, and then this dialogue beings of, Love is Love, with only the mindset of a youthful person...

That an i think there is a giant confusion between Civil Unions, and Holy Matrimony as a Sacrament, and that the two do not go hand in hand, that just because the state says yes, does not mean the Church is going to change into a progressive moral decay with the secular world.

But who cares, as long as it is not, " Ask not what your country can do for you, ask what you can do for your country " then it is fine.

Now it is, Demand that your government provide for you everything possible and beaver dam anyone who has an ounce of faith in Christ or the Church.

[Socrates]

Re the catechism: sin is a grave matter but is not regarded as either a grave matter or a sin by its performers.  I want to save my child from the possibility of mortal sin,  so I kill her.  Well, this is a grave matter, but I meant it in good faith. I have committed capital one murder, but I may not have committed a sin.

HIT-ler  felt that he was justified in starting WWII (in Europe) because of the defeat and humiliation and suffering Germany experienced during WWI, in which he fought, and also in murdering Jews, whom he felt were a pestilence.  He committed many crimes, but not necessarily sins.  He thought that he was justified and in the right.  It's that full knowledge part that is the kicker.   People don't say or think," I am committing a grave sin with my full knowledge and deliberate consent."

Once I did this with a venial sin, *sigh*.  I told a woman that I had received tenure.  I didn't like her.  She was trying to get tenure in a different field.  I didn't have to tell her, but I did.  Shame on me.

Ends don't justify the means.  Neither do subjective feelings.