Summer Reading

[PhuturePriest]

Regarding reading - was that a Protestant idea? Because in the Church its servile labour that's not allowed. To my knowledge, pre V2 and today. I have never heard anything against reading.

Regarding witchcraft... The 'magic' in HP is witchcraft. Not made up creatures. 

Aslan symbolises Christ in the story and is opposite of the witch character who is evil. A lion is a neutral creature, something God made. There can be supernatural things that are not witchcraft. But if in HP its not witchcraft what is it? Its not relevant how you get it there. Its described as witchcraft and contains elements of real witchcraft though of course much has been added. 

Casting a spell vs having a made up creature are not the same I think.. The second case is just fiction. The first has a correlation to something in our world that is condemned.

​It's called witchcraft, but I assure you it most certainly isn't. I have extensively researched Wicca and witchcraft, and I can tell you that the "magic" in Harry Potter has no link whatsoever to real magic other than that they are called the same thing. As an example, I recently watched Romeo + Juliet starring Leonardo DiCaprio (one of the most hysterically bad movies I've ever seen), and in the movie they call guns "swords". Now, that doesn't make them swords in reality, it just means that in that universe, that's what a sword is. It's the same thing for Harry Potter: It's magic in that world, but it is not the magic that is expressly condemned in the Bible. They are called witches and wizards, but they are not the witches and wizards expressly condemned in the Bible. All of this is explained in the video I linked to earlier, in fact.

Edited June 13, 2015 by PhuturePriest

[PhuturePriest]

​I think since this conversation might be moved to the debate forum, maybe I'll just answer with a bit of a story as an illustration

I was reading HP when I was a teenager. I got very interested in it and really liked the characters... I was really obsessed with HP. When I thought of a "witch", I didn't think of something bad.. I thought of Hermione. Courageous, smart Hermione, who I wanted to be like. I even dressed as a witch for halloween for that reason. I wasn't Catholic then but my view of witches was influenced by HP, instead of the Church. Prior to this, when I was younger, I got really interested in pagan religions because of a tv show that I liked that had pagan elements. I actually wanted to join one of these religions and researched it. I found out that they do actually use wands - they don't see it quite like in HP but they're still wands. I'm not saying all children are impressionable, but I was always an emotional/imaginative child and this could easily go the wrong way just as it can go the right way. For someone who's really into the HP books, it could potentially lead to an obsession with these things, good emotional connections with the ideas and even the term "witches", which could influence how they might see real occult.. in any case, it's not pointing their imagination in the right way. If a story has something out of the ordinary but it's completely made up and not at all related to witchcraft, or something supernatural but linked to Christ even as symbolism, that is different from having a "good witch" who uses witchcraft "for good". There's no such thing. I'm glad now that I didn't pursue interest in HP more, but I remember really really wishing I could do those things that they do in the books. I also was really obsessed about the characters. Usually that leads to an interest in something that's associated with a character. It could be something good or neutral... but if the character is a witch, the word "witch" stops losing its bad association emotionally. I'm not talking about kids logic here, but about imaginative connections in the mind, which is more like how children read fictional books. There are other kids books that go into such things... for example, I had one about a boy who conjured a demon! things like that can be very damaging and that one was even more explicit than HP but tried to make it look "fun".

 

 

 

​​This is what Pope Benedict XVI was saying, actually -- that it's dangerous to read Harry Potter if you do not have a solid upbringing in the faith. However, if you do, it's fine to read and it's not dangerous. You didn't have a solid upbringing in the faith, so it makes sense that it had such an effect on you. I read it and had no such effect, even though I am much like you in that I am very impressionable.

[MarysLittleFlower]

 Sorry about the weird formatting, not sure how to fix that... PP, i guess my whole point is regardless of how witches are actually like, kids dont know but it can create an obsession or interest with them. As for me now as a Catholic who knows that witchcraft is wrong, - I still dont read them because personally i just have an aversion to the whole thing. In the end i just followed my priests advice though at that point already i wasnt a fan of the books anymore

 

Edited June 13, 2015 by MarysLittleFlower

[marigold]

 Sorry about the weird formatting, not sure how to fix that... PP, i guess my whole point is regardless of how witches are actually like, kids dont know but it can create an obsession or interest with them. As for me now as a Catholic who knows that witchcraft is wrong, - I still dont read them because personally i just have an aversion to the whole thing. In the end i just followed my priests advice though at that point already i wasnt a fan of the books anymore

​Your earlier comment about wanting to be a good witch like Hermione gave me a chuckle. I was absolutely captivated by the characters too, and imagined being at a real Hogwarts and played dress-up and everything. One year I went to our school's book fair dressed as Harry Potter himself, complete with lipstick lightning scar... Me and my mum put so much effort into making the costume and in the end I didn't win first prize because I forgot to bring along the book itself. Still a bit sore about that!  After that, I grew out of dressing up in pointy hats and thinking that blazing torches were a good alternative to electric lighting, and the enduring thing that has kept me coming back to the books year after year is the unbreakable moral backbone of the whole story. I can't think of any other childhood/adolescent books that imprinted the Christian 'story arc' on me like Harry Potter did, and in many ways it prepared me to understand the Gospel. When I heard and read *those* stories, I already recognised so much; it wasn't a stretch, for example, to understand how someone could sell out their friend and teacher from a complex mix of motives including envy, love of wealth, and thinking they were doing the right thing...

I truly see where you are coming from, and I appreciate your caution around how fiction can cause us to think differently about things. However, I do quite firmly believe J.K. Rowling when she said that HP is Christian allegory. It is all over the books; once you see it, you can't unsee it.

[NadaTeTurbe]

http://karenedmisten.blogspot.fr/2007/08/mystery-of-harry-potter.html

I decided to share the book with the kids as a read-aloud. From the get-go, we talked about the difference between "magic" as it is forbidden in the Catechism of the Catholic Church:

 

2116 All forms of divination are to be rejected: recourse to Satan or demons, conjuring up the dead or other practices falsely supposed to "unveil" the future.⁴⁸ Consulting horoscopes, astrology, palm reading, interpretation of omens and lots, the phenomena of clairvoyance, and recourse to mediums all conceal a desire for power over time, history, and, in the last analysis, other human beings, as well as a wish to conciliate hidden powers. They contradict the honor, respect, and loving fear that we owe to God alone. 
2117 All practices of magic or sorcery, by which one attempts to tame occult powers, so as to place them at one's service and have a supernatural power over others - even if this were for the sake of restoring their health - are gravely contrary to the virtue of religion. These practices are even more to be condemned when accompanied by the intention of harming someone, or when they have recourse to the intervention of demons. Wearing charms is also reprehensible. Spiritism often implies divination or magical practices; the Church for her part warns the faithful against it. Recourse to so-called traditional cures does not justify either the invocation of evil powers or the exploitation of another's credulity.

and "magic" as it is portrayed in Harry Potter:

the magic of an imaginary fantasy world. J.K. Rowling's creation is an imagined, alternate universe in which "wizards" and "witches" are people who are born with the ability to do magical things. They do not call upon Satan or demons and they do not try to tame occult powers. There are no "occult" powers, because there is not a "source" for their kind of magic. "Magical" in Harry's world, is simply the way some people are born. There's an entire alternate wizarding world, unseen by "Muggles" (that would be us -- non-magical people) in which the fantastic is normal: unicorns exist, giants dwell in the forest, invisible creatures pull carriages and folks fly on broomsticks for a fast-paced game called Quidditch. Wizards can travel through fireplaces and wave a wand to get dinner going or to knit a cap for an elf.

And : 

 

Confession: I have loved the Potter series since I was 12 years old. I grew up with Rowling’s books and they continue to delight me. I cannot wait until my children are old enough to delve into the enchanting world of Harry Potter. Now, I know some folks take issue with the idea that the characters are wizards. Particularly in conservative Christian circles, the Harry Potter books have been maligned and enraged parents have demanded they be banned from school libraries. This is hard for me to understand. Few modern fictional works are built upon such a strong Christian philosophical framework as Rowling’s books. Your kids need to read them. For the sake of their souls (and I’m only being slightly hyperbolic.)

First, let’s get something out of the way. The main characters are described as wizards. True. And the school they attend is Hogwarts School of Witchcraft and Wizardry. That’s enough for some folks to throw them in the fire right then and there. But, an important distinction needs to be made. Sorcery in these books is not the sort of witchcraft forbidden in Holy Scripture. The wizards in Harry Potter do not invoke evil spirits or dark forces in order to change the physical world. Rather, they possess a genetic capability, like a superpower. No one seems to have objections to Tolkien’s Gandalf although he is a self-described wizard. For a more in depth explanation of the differences between witchcraft as defined in theCatechism of the Catholic Church and the sort of magic in Harry Potter, pleaseread Karen Edmisten’s excellent post.

Now that that’s out of the way, why is it so important that your children read this series? The Harry Potter books have many virtues including a high view of the family, strong female characters, and an Aristotelian view of friendship, but I want my children to read them because as humans we learn through stories. And these stories reveal an exaltation of virtue, an orthodox view of evil, a courageous view of self-sacrificial death, and a portrayal of the beauty and strength of love.

Themes of Christian virtue carry Rowling’s characters through the tale. Bravery, loyalty, self-sacrifice, compassion; these are all presented as important traits to be sought after. Now, that’s not to say that the characters never make mistakes. Indeed, the main characters lie, abandon friends in need, and neglect their families among other grave errors. But, it is clear when they transgress that they have done wrong and they suffer the consequences. There are no morally ambiguous or warped characters that you find yourself rooting for.  This is where the Potter books differ greatly from some other fantasy works such as the His Dark Materials trilogy by Philip Pullman.  Lyra, the main character of Pullman’s books, has an extraordinary ability to lie without detection, a skill from which she benefits and which is viewed as a positive trait. Rowling’s series has you cheering her characters on toward virtue. No one can help loving Ron and when he really fails his friends in The Deathly Hallows, it truly breaks your heart because you so dearly wanted him to do the right thing. When he makes amends, his redemption is splendid. The characters may be flawed, but the stories make the path of virtue clear.

Like Tolkien, Rowling’s depiction of evil is incredibly Augustinian. Early Church father St. Augustine defines evil as a perversion of the good. He also emphasizes that evil is not an equal match of the Good, but far weaker. As something good becomes twisted and warped, it moves closer to nonbeing. Lord Voldemort is really a perfect example of this. As he becomes more deeply entrenched in evil, he becomes less and less human, less and less alive. The acts of murder and cruelty he carries out literally tear apart his soul making his being less whole. He is a shadow of a man. The quest for power without goodness is truly a journey toward pathetic and grotesque brokenness as is portrayed in the King’s Cross chapter in The Deathly Hallowswhen Harry is face to face with a visual depiction of Voldemort’s soul. Like the White Witch in Lewis’ The Lion, the Witch, and the Wardrobe, evil according to the Potter books cannot even comprehend the great strength of love and is ultimately destroyed by it.

Indeed, Rowling’s works understand that love is the strongest magic of all and evil crumbles before it. Harry’s headmaster, Albus Dumbledore, explains this truth repeatedly. We can only be truly human and truly ourselves if we love, the story teaches. If we can live out self-sacrificial love, like Harry’s parents Lily and James, Harry himself, Dumbledore, and the numerous other characters willing to give their lives for those they love, we have already overcome. Sound familiar? Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends (John 15:13).

And that brings us to a theme that Rowling returns to again and again: death. Rowling began writing the Harry Potter books as a way to process her own mother’s death and the very first chapter of the book reveals that Harry’s mother and father have been murdered, leaving him an orphan. The way Rowling deals with death in the series is just so….well, Christian. Firstly, the tales emphasizes that death is not the end. No, indeed. In fact, on Harry’s parents tombstone is the verse, “The last enemy to be destroyed is death” (1 Corinthians 15:26). Also, although death is a complex and difficult reality, it is not presented as something to fear. There are worse things than dying, the story shows us, such as destroying one’s soul through submission to evil. Giving up your life in order to save those you love is an unbeatable “magic “of incalculable power. In the end, evil is conquered by an act of ultimate sacrifice. Love and death are intricately connected. But love, as Rowling’s story shows us, is stronger than death.

I firmly believe that every parent should be closely involved with the books and ideas their children are presented with. So read the Harry Potter books. And if you find them as compelling as I do, share them with your kids.

http://www.carrotsformichaelmas.com/2012/06/11/why-your-kids-need-to-read-harry-potter/ 

http://www.carrotsformichaelmas.com/2013/05/05/8-reasons-molly-weasley-is-a-great-literary-mama/ 

http://www.carrotsformichaelmas.com/2015/04/23/why-voldemort-hates-homeschooling/ 

(this blog is super cool :D ) (but btw, I think the obligator book you should read to your kids is the Redwall series  )

[MarysLittleFlower]

​Your earlier comment about wanting to be a good witch like Hermione gave me a chuckle. I was absolutely captivated by the characters too, and imagined being at a real Hogwarts and played dress-up and everything. One year I went to our school's book fair dressed as Harry Potter himself, complete with lipstick lightning scar... Me and my mum put so much effort into making the costume and in the end I didn't win first prize because I forgot to bring along the book itself. Still a bit sore about that!  After that, I grew out of dressing up in pointy hats and thinking that blazing torches were a good alternative to electric lighting, and the enduring thing that has kept me coming back to the books year after year is the unbreakable moral backbone of the whole story. I can't think of any other childhood/adolescent books that imprinted the Christian 'story arc' on me like Harry Potter did, and in many ways it prepared me to understand the Gospel. When I heard and read *those* stories, I already recognised so much; it wasn't a stretch, for example, to understand how someone could sell out their friend and teacher from a complex mix of motives including envy, love of wealth, and thinking they were doing the right thing...

I truly see where you are coming from, and I appreciate your caution around how fiction can cause us to think differently about things. However, I do quite firmly believe J.K. Rowling when she said that HP is Christian allegory. It is all over the books; once you see it, you can't unsee it.

Marigold, I'm not saying there aren't good points in the story that can be helpful good always remains good. Its one of the reasons that the witchcraft in the story upsets me - because its mixed in with things that are so inspiring. I think JK Rowling may have had a good intent but I just wish she had made it a school of something other than "witchcraft and wizardry"... Or if Harry fought Voldemort with something other than spells.

[Gabriela]

I'm a grad student, so summer doesn't exactly mean anything for me. I'm reading, for school:

Heidegger on technology

Hannah Arendt's Human Condition

Aristotle's Politics

 

And for "fun", I'm reading:

St. Augustine's Confessions

Neil Postman's The Disappearance of Childhood

 

The only one of these I'm really eager to finish is the last one. Postman is a media ecologist (in the tradition of Marshall McLuhan), and I find him really interesting. I don't 100% buy into what he's saying in that book, but I do think he's circling around something important.

[MarysLittleFlower]

http://karenedmisten.blogspot.fr/2007/08/mystery-of-harry-potter.html

I decided to share the book with the kids as a read-aloud. From the get-go, we talked about the difference between "magic" as it is forbidden in the Catechism of the Catholic Church:

 

and "magic" as it is portrayed in Harry Potter:

the magic of an imaginary fantasy world. J.K. Rowling's creation is an imagined, alternate universe in which "wizards" and "witches" are people who are born with the ability to do magical things. They do not call upon Satan or demons and they do not try to tame occult powers. There are no "occult" powers, because there is not a "source" for their kind of magic. "Magical" in Harry's world, is simply the way some people are born. There's an entire alternate wizarding world, unseen by "Muggles" (that would be us -- non-magical people) in which the fantastic is normal: unicorns exist, giants dwell in the forest, invisible creatures pull carriages and folks fly on broomsticks for a fast-paced game called Quidditch. Wizards can travel through fireplaces and wave a wand to get dinner going or to knit a cap for an elf.

And : 

 

Confession: I have loved the Potter series since I was 12 years old. I grew up with Rowling’s books and they continue to delight me. I cannot wait until my children are old enough to delve into the enchanting world of Harry Potter. Now, I know some folks take issue with the idea that the characters are wizards. Particularly in conservative Christian circles, the Harry Potter books have been maligned and enraged parents have demanded they be banned from school libraries. This is hard for me to understand. Few modern fictional works are built upon such a strong Christian philosophical framework as Rowling’s books. Your kids need to read them. For the sake of their souls (and I’m only being slightly hyperbolic.)

First, let’s get something out of the way. The main characters are described as wizards. True. And the school they attend is Hogwarts School of Witchcraft and Wizardry. That’s enough for some folks to throw them in the fire right then and there. But, an important distinction needs to be made. Sorcery in these books is not the sort of witchcraft forbidden in Holy Scripture. The wizards in Harry Potter do not invoke evil spirits or dark forces in order to change the physical world. Rather, they possess a genetic capability, like a superpower. No one seems to have objections to Tolkien’s Gandalf although he is a self-described wizard. For a more in depth explanation of the differences between witchcraft as defined in theCatechism of the Catholic Church and the sort of magic in Harry Potter, pleaseread Karen Edmisten’s excellent post.

Now that that’s out of the way, why is it so important that your children read this series? The Harry Potter books have many virtues including a high view of the family, strong female characters, and an Aristotelian view of friendship, but I want my children to read them because as humans we learn through stories. And these stories reveal an exaltation of virtue, an orthodox view of evil, a courageous view of self-sacrificial death, and a portrayal of the beauty and strength of love.

Themes of Christian virtue carry Rowling’s characters through the tale. Bravery, loyalty, self-sacrifice, compassion; these are all presented as important traits to be sought after. Now, that’s not to say that the characters never make mistakes. Indeed, the main characters lie, abandon friends in need, and neglect their families among other grave errors. But, it is clear when they transgress that they have done wrong and they suffer the consequences. There are no morally ambiguous or warped characters that you find yourself rooting for.  This is where the Potter books differ greatly from some other fantasy works such as the His Dark Materials trilogy by Philip Pullman.  Lyra, the main character of Pullman’s books, has an extraordinary ability to lie without detection, a skill from which she benefits and which is viewed as a positive trait. Rowling’s series has you cheering her characters on toward virtue. No one can help loving Ron and when he really fails his friends in The Deathly Hallows, it truly breaks your heart because you so dearly wanted him to do the right thing. When he makes amends, his redemption is splendid. The characters may be flawed, but the stories make the path of virtue clear.

Like Tolkien, Rowling’s depiction of evil is incredibly Augustinian. Early Church father St. Augustine defines evil as a perversion of the good. He also emphasizes that evil is not an equal match of the Good, but far weaker. As something good becomes twisted and warped, it moves closer to nonbeing. Lord Voldemort is really a perfect example of this. As he becomes more deeply entrenched in evil, he becomes less and less human, less and less alive. The acts of murder and cruelty he carries out literally tear apart his soul making his being less whole. He is a shadow of a man. The quest for power without goodness is truly a journey toward pathetic and grotesque brokenness as is portrayed in the King’s Cross chapter in The Deathly Hallowswhen Harry is face to face with a visual depiction of Voldemort’s soul. Like the White Witch in Lewis’ The Lion, the Witch, and the Wardrobe, evil according to the Potter books cannot even comprehend the great strength of love and is ultimately destroyed by it.

Indeed, Rowling’s works understand that love is the strongest magic of all and evil crumbles before it. Harry’s headmaster, Albus Dumbledore, explains this truth repeatedly. We can only be truly human and truly ourselves if we love, the story teaches. If we can live out self-sacrificial love, like Harry’s parents Lily and James, Harry himself, Dumbledore, and the numerous other characters willing to give their lives for those they love, we have already overcome. Sound familiar? Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends (John 15:13).

And that brings us to a theme that Rowling returns to again and again: death. Rowling began writing the Harry Potter books as a way to process her own mother’s death and the very first chapter of the book reveals that Harry’s mother and father have been murdered, leaving him an orphan. The way Rowling deals with death in the series is just so….well, Christian. Firstly, the tales emphasizes that death is not the end. No, indeed. In fact, on Harry’s parents tombstone is the verse, “The last enemy to be destroyed is death” (1 Corinthians 15:26). Also, although death is a complex and difficult reality, it is not presented as something to fear. There are worse things than dying, the story shows us, such as destroying one’s soul through submission to evil. Giving up your life in order to save those you love is an unbeatable “magic “of incalculable power. In the end, evil is conquered by an act of ultimate sacrifice. Love and death are intricately connected. But love, as Rowling’s story shows us, is stronger than death.

I firmly believe that every parent should be closely involved with the books and ideas their children are presented with. So read the Harry Potter books. And if you find them as compelling as I do, share them with your kids.

http://www.carrotsformichaelmas.com/2012/06/11/why-your-kids-need-to-read-harry-potter/ 

http://www.carrotsformichaelmas.com/2013/05/05/8-reasons-molly-weasley-is-a-great-literary-mama/ 

http://www.carrotsformichaelmas.com/2015/04/23/why-voldemort-hates-homeschooling/ 

(this blog is super cool :D ) (but btw, I think the obligator book you should read to your kids is the Redwall series  )

There are good points in the books..The witchcraft still bothers me though. I mean even if its not exactly like real life it shares the title and its inspired by it.. With Tolkien, Gandalf is a non human being who humans call a wizard cause they don't know what to call him. I wish actually he was called something else but I believe Tolkien was against witchcraft and his reasons for choosing words were often complex. In HP they themselves refer to it as witchcraft. I just wish it was different.

[dominicansoul]

Fatima in Lucia's own words

 

it inspired me when i was 6 and still inspires me today.  you can read this amazing book in its entirety here:

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/36774506/Fatima - In Lucia's Own Words.pdf

[CatherineM]

I'm reading Brown's books on John for a Johannine literature class.  My last for my Masters.  I've got a paper of Revelation, and I'm done.  Then all I have left is a 50 plus page thesis.  I can write that in a couple of weeks.

[HopefulHeart]

I finished The Castafiore Emerald. It was hilarious, as always.

I also started the biography James Alberione: A Marvel of Our Times. I'm excited to learn more about the founder of the Daughters of St. Paul!

[LittleWaySoul]

I'm working my way through the Narnia series for the second time and in between reading a few Flannery O'Connor short stories from a book of them. :)

[NadaTeTurbe]

I finished the book about the North Korean prisonner who escaped from his camp. It was beathtaking but I wanted to cry because it was so horrible... THe worst is that the people who escape can't really adapt into our world. I thought about my family members who were in Dachau for "only" one or two years and were traumatized, and then I thought about this boy who was BORN into this and I wanted to cry. 

I really needed a light read a good old Redwall, Mariel, one of my favorite  Then I will read GOne with the wind. 

[Ancilla Domini]

150 or so pages into the very large Anna Karenina, which I am enjoying immensely. Not sure what I'll read after that. I've been really into Russian literature lately.

[NadaTeTurbe]

150 or so pages into the very large Anna Karenina, which I am enjoying immensely. Not sure what I'll read after that. I've been really into Russian literature lately.

​Anna Karenina is amazing ! Have you read "Childhood, Boyhood, Youth" by Tolstoy ? It's his autobiography. Worth reading. Resurrection by Tolstoy is very good, and it speak about Christ. And War and Peace are very good, if you have one month entirely free to read it !