White Privilege?

[Didacus]

​I do not see many - but the situations are not analogous. Asian Americans academically outperform white Americans. You would therefore expect to see them represented among management in greater numbers than their overall proportion of the population. The same can hardly be said for the small number of white people living in Japan - the vast majority of which cannot even read Japanese at an 8th grade level.

​You are ignoring the point.  Even if a white person was as skilled as a Japanese person - in Japan, none would even think of giving a white person equal rights or opportunities.

 

In fact, any Japanese who leave Japan are no longer considered Japanese.  They have racism there at a level we couldn't dream of, and sometimes I wish we could learn from their example.  It is their home, their land, their rules; point blank.  They are not doing anything wrong by saying to anyone else to outright stay out in my opinion.

Edited June 10, 2015 by Didacus
I wanted to edit my post

[Peace]

You are ignoring the point.  Even if a white person was as skilled as a Japanese person - in Japan, none would even think of giving a white person equal rights or opportunities.

I am not quite sure how I ignored this point. If you read my post you will notice that I wrote that being among the majority gives one advantages (whether that be among the majority in the USA or the majority in another country).

In fact, any Japanese who leave Japan are no longer considered Japanese.  They have racism there at a level we couldn't dream of, and sometimes I wish we could learn from their example.  It is their home, their land, their rules; point blank.  They are not doing anything wrong by saying to anyone else to outright stay out in my opinion.

This is a bit of an exaggeration I think (I lived in Japan for 6 years and currently work for a Japanese company in the USA. I am also fluent in Japanese). Perhaps you are referring to the period several centuries ago where the country was closed off? Perhaps you are referring to Japanese-Brazilians?  Yeah - although they look Japanese, they are culturally Brazilian. So that would make sense. But there are enough Japanese people who go overseas and come back without being considered "no longer Japanese" (you can start with some of the Japanese baseball players living overseas, for example). I have many friends who fall into that category.

As for Japan having a level of racism that we couldn't dream of - by that statement I would guess that you are a white American. I don't think you have to dream. You can just open a book and read a history of lynchings in the USA, for example. If one is among the majority he tends not too see racism (as he is typically a perpetrator or a beneficiary of it). On the other hand, if one is among the majority he tends to be much more cognizant of it (as he is more typically a victim of it). I would say that is why when many white Americans go to Japan they find the country much more racist than the USA - not because there is more racism in Japan, but because they are now in the minority, are now victims of it, and become much more cognizant of it. I do not think most non-white Americans go to Japan and find the country to be much more racist than the USA. I did not, personally. In some senses I found the racism in Japan to be more superficial, and the racism in the USA to be much more deeply ingrained and severe.  But I think my perspective is different, because when I moved from the USA to Japan I went from being a minority in one country to a minority in another country, as opposed to being in the majority in one country and then being among the minority in another.

As for desiring to learn from their example - I assume that by that statement you are referring to something other than racism. What was it?

Edited June 10, 2015 by Peace

[Peace]

Sorry. I made a typo:

"On the other hand, if one is among the minority majority  he . . ."

[Maggyie]

I am not quite sure how I ignored this point. If you read my post you will notice that I wrote that being among the majority gives one advantages (whether that be among the majority in the USA or the majority in another country).

This is a bit of an exaggeration I think (I lived in Japan for 6 years and currently work for a Japanese company in the USA. I am also fluent in Japanese). Perhaps you are referring to the period several centuries ago where the country was closed off? Perhaps you are referring to Japanese-Brazilians?  Yeah - although they look Japanese, they are culturally Brazilian. So that would make sense. But there are enough Japanese people who go overseas and come back without being considered "no longer Japanese" (you can start with some of the Japanese baseball players living overseas, for example). I have many friends who fall into that category.

As for Japan having a level of racism that we couldn't dream of - by that statement I would guess that you are a white American. I don't think you have to dream. You can just open a book and read a history of lynchings in the USA, for example. If one is among the majority he tends not too see racism (as he is typically a perpetrator or a beneficiary of it). On the other hand, if one is among the majority he tends to be much more cognizant of it (as he is more typically a victim of it). I would say that is why when many white Americans go to Japan they find the country much more racist than the USA - not because there is more racism in Japan, but because they are now in the minority, are now victims of it, and become much more cognizant of it. I do not think most non-white Americans go to Japan and find the country to be much more racist than the USA. I did not, personally. In some senses I found the racism in Japan to be more superficial, and the racism in the USA to be much more deeply ingrained and severe.  But I think my perspective is different, because when I moved from the USA to Japan I went from being a minority in one country to a minority in another country, as opposed to being in the majority in one country and then being among the minority in another.

As for desiring to learn from their example - I assume that by that statement you are referring to something other than racism. What was it?

I think you may be a bit naive about how things are in Japan. I recall the United Nations fairly recently did a human rights investigation and found pretty bad, systemic xenopheobia and discrimination in Japanese society. Particularly against other Asians.  

White people arent victims very often because as in most countries, as a group the Japanese tend to view them as better educated and wealthier and less likely to be a source of crime. I mean victims of truly pernicious xenophobia, like not being able to find work. I'm sure whites get the "my daughter is not marrying a foreigner" stuff etc. 

[Didacus]

Not an American.   

The older I get the more I am convinced that as long as one does not convey a disadvantage to others based on their race then there is nothing inherently wrong with racism.  

 

I am certainly convinced that diversity s not a strength at the very least.  

 

To suggest that whites are the only racists in the world is racist on itself - ALL races are racist in their culture and their past. All have killed in the name of their respective race. (I do not support killing for race - just to be clear. I do not believe anyone should give a disadvantage on account of race - but one race is not obligated to any other race either.)

[Benedictus]

I think you may be a bit naive about how things are in Japan. I recall the United Nations fairly recently did a human rights investigation and found pretty bad, systemic xenopheobia and discrimination in Japanese society. Particularly against other Asians.  

White people arent victims very often because as in most countries, as a group the Japanese tend to view them as better educated and wealthier and less likely to be a source of crime. I mean victims of truly pernicious xenophobia, like not being able to find work. I'm sure whites get the "my daughter is not marrying a foreigner" stuff etc. 

Yes, there is often disdain for South Koreans and Chinese - mostly due to politics. However, Chinese are also blamed for high levels of crime. Foreigners, in general, are accused of being the source of this though. Nationalist groups will often protest demanding that all foreigners be deported or executed. They are fairly small, but they feed into a more mainstream nationalism that is strong and anxious.

Anyone who isn't Japanese is perceived as a potential problem, ranging from breaking cultural customs all the way up to serious crimes. People often find that many Japanese will simply avoid or pull back from forming close relationships, which is difficult if you live there for any good length of time. Shops and businesses may well turn you away and so on. The system is very hard when trying to gain accommodation, especially for the first time. Many landlords won't hire to those who aren't of Japanese origin, even if you can get excellent references.  Even if a landlord is willing they know that other residents will check your recycling or report you if you break any minor rules to the authorities.

Race is tied very much to ideas of nationalism, and many negative aspects of it remain. Many will still call you a Gaijin, based on your skin color or heritage even if you were born and raised in Japan. Those of mixed Asian heritage, or any other biracial relationship, often suffer prejudice. It's seen by some as a betrayal and a weakening of the Japanese culture etc. Many have had to fight hard to make lives for themselves and overcome it.

 

Edited June 10, 2015 by Benedictus

[hotpink]

​I wouldn't really care about those things to be honest.  

 

I always found woman naturally beautiful without make-up to boot. I think my wife put on make-up like 4 times in the last 20 years for example.  

​That's nice for you but that dosn't mean everyone wants to act that way.  Every woman enjoys the ability to put on makeup and look good every so often...even if it's once in 20 years.  And quite frankly, makeup is about how it makes the woman feel, not how it makes the man feel.  Every person should be able to go to the store and find outfits that fit when they are a normal size for their culture.   Every person should be able to have a paper cut and not need to cover up with a bandaid that dosn't really look at all good.

Perhaps you don't care, but many people do.

And what people forget, Obama is half-white so despite his adherence to being the big black guy, he's not really.  I'm pretty convinced this is one of the only reasons that he was elected...if he was 100% or dark skined he wouldn't of been.

[Benedictus]

.

And what people forget, Obama is half-white so despite his adherence to being the big black guy, he's not really.  I'm pretty convinced this is one of the only reasons that he was elected...if he was 100% or dark skined he wouldn't of been.

​I think this gives racists more credit than is true. Do you really think a racist person would give Obama a break because of who his mother was? You reckon they'd rate his mother that highly? It could be equally said his mixed heritage could have actually drawn more negative feeling towards him. To a racist he would simply be black and I doubt they'd fall over themselves to give him a vote. Why would a racist settle for a mixed race guy over a white guy?

In terms of his skin tone  -  he doesn't seem either light or dark to me. Unless anyone knew they would probably just assume his parents were black. I wouldn't blame Obama for describing himself as black either, it's not unusual in the US afterall. If he was in Europe it would likely be different.

Maybe you overlook the possibility that the population were actually inspired and happy to vote for him without any reservations about his race? 

[hotpink]

​I think this gives racists more credit than is true. Do you really think a racist person would give Obama a break because of who his mother was? You reckon they'd rate his mother that highly? It could be equally said his mixed heritage could have actually drawn more negative feeling towards him. To a racist he would simply be black and I doubt they'd fall over themselves to give him a vote. Why would a racist settle for a mixed race guy over a white guy?

In terms of his skin tone  -  he doesn't seem either light or dark to me. Unless anyone knew they would probably just assume his parents were black. I wouldn't blame Obama for describing himself as black either, it's not unusual in the US afterall. If he was in Europe it would likely be different.

Maybe you overlook the possibility that the population were actually inspired and happy to vote for him without any reservations about his race? 

​While he played the race angle, I've seen Italians darker than him.

[Didacus]

​That's nice for you but that dosn't mean everyone wants to act that way.  Every woman enjoys the ability to put on makeup and look good every so often...even if it's once in 20 years.  And quite frankly, makeup is about how it makes the woman feel, not how it makes the man feel.  Every person should be able to go to the store and find outfits that fit when they are a normal size for their culture.   Every person should be able to have a paper cut and not need to cover up with a bandaid that dosn't really look at all good.

Perhaps you don't care, but many people do.

And what people forget, Obama is half-white so despite his adherence to being the big black guy, he's not really.  I'm pretty convinced this is one of the only reasons that he was elected...if he was 100% or dark skined he wouldn't of been.

​I don't give a piss-flippin rats behind about Obama - regardless of his shape, form or colour. The fact that he is anti-christian and a 'secret' mohamedeen is a concern though.  

 

All the rest that your allude to is really not very consequential. Whenever societie's priorities reach the point of considering the colour of a band-aid as a chief national concern either we won't have anymore problems or the world will have ended! Come-on!   

 

 

Oh and what who else other than Europeen culture acknowledged the wrong and apologized for slavery in the past even though most cultures in history and across the world have openly practiced slavery? Do you know where the word slavery comes from? Look it up just for kicks...

[hotpink]

​I don't give a piss-flippin rats behind about Obama - regardless of his shape, form or colour. The fact that he is anti-christian and a 'secret' mohamedeen is a concern though.  

 

All the rest that your allude to is really not very consequential. Whenever societie's priorities reach the point of considering the colour of a band-aid as a chief national concern either we won't have anymore problems or the world will have ended! Come-on!   

 

 

Oh and what who else other than Europeen culture acknowledged the wrong and apologized for slavery in the past even though most cultures in history and across the world have openly practiced slavery? Do you know where the word slavery comes from? Look it up just for kicks...

​I'm guessing you're white.

 

This dosn't have much to do with slavery.  It has to do with a world which seems to believe that the world only needs products for a very white world.

[Credo in Deum]

Who defines what this "white privilege" is?  What is the criteria? At what point does this "white privilege" become no longer?  Who decides?

[Didacus]

​I'm guessing you're white.

 

This dosn't have much to do with slavery.  It has to do with a world which seems to believe that the world only needs products for a very white world.

​i'm guessing you're more of a racist than me but won't admit it.  

[hotpink]

​i'm guessing you're more of a racist than me but won't admit it.  

​No, I'm actually not.  I think that there are real problems in america that we won't face when it comes to race.

[Didacus]

​No, I'm actually not.  I think that there are real problems in america that we won't face when it comes to race.

​you either are or won't admit it or feel that since you believe your race has done no wrong and you are blameless and content to perpetually play the victim with a pocket full of race cards to cash in.  

 

What is so wrong if white privilege existed with anyhow? Shouldn't we have the right to preserve it? As long as we do not seek to cause detriment to other groups?