Choosing a Martial Art

[IgnatiusofLoyola]

While the rest of you talk about martial arts, I'm still thinking about women's defense classes.

Since I know nothing about physical ways to protect yourself, I'll let the rest of you discuss that.

But, a women's defense class might also teach some additional "street smarts" that you hadn't thought of before. 

I learned my "street smarts" by working in South Central LA for three years (think very poor and gangs). My co-workers gave me a lot of tips. I've also traveled a LOT alone, both for business and pleasure.

For example, Beatitude, I think you used amesome "street smarts" when you gave the man the wrong location for your house. The cell phone may be one of the best safety devices we can carry.

But, for example, in hindsight, perhaps it would have been better not to drive with a man alone whom you had not met. Obviously, you had friends who thought he was trustworthy. However, I no longer will get in a car alone with a man I haven't met. In hindsight, you might have driven yourself separately, and met the man and his contacts in a public place, as well as told someone beforehand where you were going. I don't like it that I'm not as trusting as I used to be, but I'm not.  

A women's defense class might have other tips that you wouldn't necessarily think of because you want to trust people.

I'm so sorry that you had this experience......

[tinytherese]

​

You as a man might not be aware of this, so let me inform you:

Women fending off a sexual assault are fighting for their lives.

Beatitude told us how she used her wits to escape, wouldn't it be nice if she could use some incredibly destructive and violent moves to maim and destroy the creep who threatened her.

Maybe if menfolk lived in fear of getting their heads caved in by women there would be fewer pigs among them. Certainly women living in fear of rape and assault has made them, as a group, sweet and submissive. 

​Again, using excessive force against an attacker can get you into legal trouble. I know that that is awful, but it's true.

[Winchester]

​Again, using excessive force against an attacker can get you into legal trouble. I know that that is awful, but it's true.

​Tried by twelve or carried by six.

[Lilllabettt]

​Again, using excessive force against an attacker can get you into legal trouble. I know that that is awful, but it's true.

 

There is no such thing as "excessive force" when it comes to repelling a sexual assault. Women are allowed to use any level of force, up to deadly force, to repel a sexual assault. Look it up. Where use of force rules are concerned, attempting to rape a woman is the equivalent of attempting to murder her.

tl/dr: Even if you don't think your attacker is going to kill you, or do you any "bodily harm" other than possible forcible penetration, you are allowed to blow a hole in his head, break every bone in his body, etc. 

The lesson for a man is that he should be 110% sure a woman wants what he is doing. There was a time when rape was a hanging crime. 

ETA: The lesson for a lady is to take Krav Maga and be ready to execute a summary judgment if necessary.

Edited May 17, 2015 by Lilllabettt

[Hna.Caridad]

Dear Beatitude,

 

I am so sorry that this happened to you—it was traumatic for me just to read about it.  In this circumstance, it seems that you did everything right, as evidenced by coming out of the situation physically unharmed.  (Making the fake calls and telling him that you lived somewhere you didn’t was brilliant.)

 

There are lots of suggestions in this thread, and I’ll make a few of my own. 

 

First, I recommend against getting a weapon.  I had heard somewhere that people with guns in their homes are 30 times more likely to sustain a gunshot injury than those who don’t have a gun in their house.  While I can’t find the study or data to back that up, I can tell you that I personally know at least 30 people who have been injured or killed with their own weapons, whereas I don’t personally know a single person who has ever successfully fended off an attack with a weapon.  (Those cases are so rare that when they do happen, they tend to make the national news.)  I, too, am a very small person & I know that if I were attacked and were carrying a weapon (such as a gun or pepper spray), more likely than not, my weapon would be wrestled away from me & then used against me.

 

That being said, I too, am always looking for ways (“street smarts” as Ignatius of Loyola said) to avoid bad situations, de-escalate violent situations, and basically, keep myself safe.  I’ve never studied martial arts, so I can’t offer any advice on that one.  A women’s- or self-defense class would hopefully offer you some more tools/ideas to use in case you’re ever threatened (or attacked) again.  Sometimes, there are things that we can do to prevent/discourage an attack (which you did incredibly well), and sometimes, there aren’t.  The main goal is always to come out alive.

[PhuturePriest]

​

You as a man might not be aware of this, so let me inform you:

Women fending off a sexual assault are fighting for their lives.

Beatitude told us how she used her wits to escape, wouldn't it be nice if she could use some incredibly destructive and violent moves to maim and destroy the creep who threatened her.

Maybe if menfolk lived in fear of getting their heads caved in by women there would be fewer pigs among them. Certainly women living in fear of rape and assault has made them, as a group, sweet and submissive. 

​Ultimately this seems to be coming down to a difference in philosophical approach. 

I am no stranger to sexual assault. I am aware that it is scary and dangerous. Personally, I think Beatitude's situation could have hardly gone better: she got out of the situation without one fist being thrown or one threat being laid down, and that's far preferable in my eyes to what you seem to think is preferable, which is Beatitude breaking his bones and maiming him for life. I know it's the automatic reaction for some to feel disgusted and wish him harm, but that would only make things worse. Violence begets violence.

Breaking something cannot fix something. He wouldn't have learned a lesson, and she would have been put in greater danger. She did the most perfect thing that could have possibly been done.

As for something more helpful than our bickering back and forth, Beatitude, have you considered filing this to the police and getting a restraining order?

[Nihil Obstat]

 

First, I recommend against getting a weapon.  I had heard somewhere that people with guns in their homes are 30 times more likely to sustain a gunshot injury than those who don’t have a gun in their house.  While I can’t find the study or data to back that up, I can tell you that I personally know at least 30 people who have been injured or killed with their own weapons, whereas I don’t personally know a single person who has ever successfully fended off an attack with a weapon.  (Those cases are so rare that when they do happen, they tend to make the national news.)  I, too, am a very small person & I know that if I were attacked and were carrying a weapon (such as a gun or pepper spray), more likely than not, my weapon would be wrestled away from me & then used against me.

 

 

​Where do you live where you know 30 people who have been injured or killed with their own weapons and zero who have successfully used them in a defensive manner? 

[Hna.Caridad]

​Where do you live where you know 30 people who have been injured or killed with their own weapons and zero who have successfully used them in a defensive manner? 

 

The "30 times" statistic is one that I heard when I lived in the U.S. (I've been living in Central America for the past several years.)  It rang true to my experience there.  I actually know a lot more than 30 people in the U.S. who have been injured or killed by guns found within their own home--suicide, accidents, domestic violence, etc.  As I said above, I don't know anyone who has successfully fended off an attack using their own weapon.

The problem with assaults is that they often happen so fast.  One minute, a person is walking down the street & the next minute, they're face-down on the pavement, with some guy on their back, holding a knife to their throat while simultaneously running his hand through their pockets.  There's seldom ever enough time to retrieve & successfully use a weapon during an assault.  I work in a very violent neighborhood & leave the house each day knowing that there's a very real possibility that I might be assaulted. 

That being said, there are certainly things that a person can do to lessen the likelihood of being assaulted (which Beatitude did very well).  I've learned to trust my street smarts to avoid violent situations, my communication skills to get me out of violent situations, and God to get me through violent situations far more than I would ever trust a knife, a gun, or pepper spray to keep me safe.  Being a Christian helps--knowing that life is about more than just this life.  Even though they exhibit profoundly damaging behavior, assailants are still children of God & God weeps when they're hurt, too.

(Needless to say, I've also found great inspiration in the modern-day Latin American martyrs and am very much looking forward to attending Monseñor Romero's beatification Mass next weekend.)  

 

 

[Winchester]

I've used firearms twice in confrontations that were defused without firing a shot. A friend of mine used a rifle to stop an assault with a deadly weapon (a pistol). He did not have to fire a shot.

I see several news stories every year that involve people using weapons to defend themselves from crime. And they don't make national news. 

 

[beatitude]

Thank you for all the advice, everyone. I have made a list of options for martial arts and/or self-defence classes and will investigate them all to see what fits me and my slightly wonky left side. It seems most places are happy to offer a taster class before you make up your mind to join.

If I had been trained to physically fend off an attacker, I wouldn't have used the skills in that situation, as the harassment took place in a moving car - attacking the driver wouldn't have achieved much except to get me in a road smash. I am interested in learning self-defence for the sake of what could have happened rather than what did. Suppose those two old men hadn't had a late finish in their orchard and hadn't decided to stay overnight in their hut, what then? I would have been trapped on my own with him in a rural area where no one could have heard me scream. In that situation I want to be sure I know how to immobilise someone long enough for me to run for it or attract help. It would also give me more confidence to know I could physically defend myself if it came down to it, and right now I know that even if I needed to I couldn't. I have a clear sharp head in an emergency but I don't know how to protect myself physically.

Iggy, I will also be less trusting of people in future. I hate that, as it seems so horrible to have to be suspicious of people from the first meeting, especially when they come warmly recommended by good friends. I just have to keep reminding myself of what I already know but, like most women, am reluctant to really believe - that most sexual assault is committed by an attacker known to the victim, not a stranger, so knowing someone personally isn't a guarantee of your safety however much you might want it to be. Unhappy but true.

[Seven77]

 Praise be to God that the Holy Spirit gave you such presence of mind and inspiration to get out of that situation!

[Lilllabettt]

​Ultimately this seems to be coming down to a difference in philosophical approach. 

I am no stranger to sexual assault. I am aware that it is scary and dangerous. Personally, I think Beatitude's situation could have hardly gone better: she got out of the situation without one fist being thrown or one threat being laid down, and that's far preferable in my eyes to what you seem to think is preferable, which is Beatitude breaking his bones and maiming him for life. I know it's the automatic reaction for some to feel disgusted and wish him harm, but that would only make things worse. Violence begets violence.

Breaking something cannot fix something. He wouldn't have learned a lesson, and she would have been put in greater danger. She did the most perfect thing that could have possibly been done.

As for something more helpful than our bickering back and forth, Beatitude, have you considered filing this to the police and getting a restraining order?

​

My concern and my profound irritation is at the suggestion by multiple people on this thread that a woman defending herself from a sexual assault using, like, Krav Maga, could possibly use excessive force in repelling her attacker.

Cuz first of all, that's not even accurate, from a legal perspective. And 2 ... NO.

Girl has already been stressed her whole life about whether what she wears or how she walks is "asking for it." Girl is now super concerned about escaping with her life and body in one piece. Now Girl has to think about how to stop her attacker but not hurt him so bad that its too much ... like no. 

Somebody come at you like that, you hurt them and you hurt them bad. 

[Ice_nine]

I think you can actually get in legal trouble if you only attempt to maim someone rather than use lethal force. I.e. just shooting him (or her, if we're being pc) in the leg or something, because you're only allowed to use lethal force if your life or body is in danger but I don't think there's a legal allowance for attempting to maim someone.

 

I could be wrong. Not a lawyer.

[beatitude]

​

My concern and my profound irritation is at the suggestion by multiple people on this thread that a woman defending herself from a sexual assault using, like, Krav Maga, could possibly use excessive force in repelling her attacker.

Cuz first of all, that's not even accurate, from a legal perspective. And 2 ... NO.

Girl has already been stressed her whole life about whether what she wears or how she walks is "asking for it." Girl is now super concerned about escaping with her life and body in one piece. Now Girl has to think about how to stop her attacker but not hurt him so bad that its too much ... like no.

​I agree. I'd always prefer to get out of a bad situation by using just my head if necessary, because I think my brain is a better weapon than my body and I don't exactly relish the thought of being violent to another person. But if I were put in a position where I had to fight off a rapist, then I probably wouldn't be thinking to myself, "Hmm, is this Krav Maga technique excessive?" I hope I wouldn't, anyway - when I got home after that horrible night I was actually worried about cancelling our next meeting in case I seemed rude. As though I were the one who had to worry about my behaviour! I also did worry briefly that I'd 'asked for it' by agreeing to ride in his car, but thankfully I was able to firmly push that one aside - if I were a guy in the same situation I wouldn't be thinking that. This conditioning goes very deep.

[Winchester]

I think you can actually get in legal trouble if you only attempt to maim someone rather than use lethal force. I.e. just shooting him (or her, if we're being pc) in the leg or something, because you're only allowed to use lethal force if your life or body is in danger but I don't think there's a legal allowance for attempting to maim someone.

 

I could be wrong. Not a lawyer.

​You can take the combat out of the man. Once you have them down, if you continue to deliver strikes, then you can be charged with a crime.