I feel like I want to blame God

[AccountDeleted]

Some might miss the point entirely because you did not state whether or not your agnostic brother has been baptized.  

​I'm sorry it was too difficult for you to understand, but you have still missed the point of my post. 

Never mind.

 

[Maggyie]

Thank you for the clarification and correction Maggyie.  It's a little bit more complicated than just that.  

An unbaptized man and woman can enter into a valid natural marriage which is not sacramental.   

A baptized man and woman who are not Catholic can enter into a sacramental marriage by virtue of their baptism.

A baptized Catholic man and woman must be married in the Church in the presence of a priest and two witnesses in order for it to be a valid sacramental marriage.

 

 

 

 

Yes but that's not my point. My point is the Church does NOT dispense this sacrament. Unless you think our catechesis or our cultural catechesis is better now than in years past it is logical that couples have more trouble nowadays contracting valid marriages. 

[beatitude]

I thought we'd managed to have a relatively snark-free Lent (compared to the usual PM standard), but the snideness seems to have waited for the Triduum to come out.  Come on guys. It's Easter within hours.

[Credo in Deum]

I thought we'd managed to have a relatively snark-free Lent (compared to the usual PM standard), but the snideness seems to have waited for the Triduum to come out.  Come on guys. It's Easter within hours.

Mea culpa.

[KnightofChrist]

I sound like a broken record, but it's so important in this discussion to get the sacramental theology correct. The church doesn't dispense the marriage sacrament. This is a very common misconception since she dispenses all others! It does not in any way raise doubts about other sacraments, because again, it is dispensed by 2 laymen who have hopefully been properly catechized about marriage so that they can do it correctly. Too often this is not the case  

The other sacraments are dispensed at the hands of professional clergymen who have masters degrees in theology, the graces that accompany ordination, and if they are priests have years of education on top of that. 

Yes, no human in the Church dispenses the sacrament of Marriage in the Church. But, Christ, as High Priest and Head of the Church does dispense the sacrament when Catholics are married within the Church. Thank you for the clarification and the opportunity to make myself clearer.

[Norseman82]

I thought we'd managed to have a relatively snark-free Lent (compared to the usual PM standard), but the snideness seems to have waited for the Triduum to come out.  Come on guys. It's Easter within hours.

​Well, this is the darkest 24 hours of human history that we are recalling - God Himself dead in the grave, put there by us.

[Nihil Obstat]

Popule meus, quid feci tibi? aut in quo constristavi te? responde mihi.

My people, My people what have I done to you, how have I offended you? answer me!

 

Quia eduxi te de terra Aegypti: parasti Crucem Salvatori tuo.

I led you out of Egypt from slavery to freedom, but you have led your Savior, and

nailed Him to a cross.

 

Agios o Theos.

Sanctus Deus. 

Agios ischyros.

Sanctus fortis. 

Agios athanatos eleison imas.

Sanctus immortalis, miserere nobis. 

 

[Norseman82]

​ just expressing an opinion that it's something very problematical IMO, and leads to unrealistic situations (e.g., a guy's wife leaves him, so he's doomed to celibacy because he married the wrong woman).

​Romans 7:2:

"A married woman is bound to her husband while he lives".

1 Corinthians 7:10-11:

"To those now married, however, I give this command (though it is not mine, but the Lord's):  a wife must not separate from her husband.  If she does separate, she must either remain single or become reconciled to him again.  Similarly, a husband must not divorce his wife."

Edited April 7, 2015 by Norseman82

[Era Might]

​Romans 7:2:

"A married woman is bound to her husband while he lives".

1 Corinthians 7:10-11:

"To those now married, however, I give this command (though it is not mine, but the Lord's):  a wife must not separate from her husband.  If she does separate, she must either remain single or become reconciled to him again.  Similarly, a husband must not divorce his wife."

​Yeah, I don't say early Christianity is not problematic. I mean, they had stylites living in trees...even monks needed a less radical way of life (which Benedict provided). Even if one accepts the radical implications of Christian ideas about marriage and sexuality, one can recognize there is something profoundly unhuman about them...even the Jews had polygamy and divorce, as did pagans. For me, life is hard enough without trying to live up to spiritual heroics...I don't see how that makes anyone happy, but then, Christianity has never been particularly concerned with happiness, so it's operating on different terms.