A Sermon I Heard

[Ancilla Domini]

Not sure where I ought to post this, so I chose here.

I thought I ought to share it, though, considering how theologically inaccurate it is.

 

The sermon was about the gospel passage in which the Canaanite woman asks Christ to cast a devil from her daughter, and He responds, "It is not right to take the children's bread and throw it to the dogs." She says,"Yea, Lord; for the whelps also eat under the table of the crumbs of the children," and Our Lord responds, "For this saying, go thy way, for the devil is gone out of thy daughter." 

 

As the priest gave his sermon, I became more and more shocked at what he was saying, and I actually wrote a few passages down in my notebook, while he was talking. Here are various things he said (word for word):

 

1. "Now, Christ would never have gotten away with saying this to the woman, nowadays. I bet if the early Christians could have suppressed this story, they would have. In fact, John didn't include it in his gospel; but Mark and Matthew felt obliged to put it in theirs."

 

2. "When the lady first asked Christ to heal her daughter, He felt He had to stick to his mission of saving the promised people only. Then, the woman nagged, and He finally caved in and cured her daughter. This encounter with this woman helped Christ to understand what He was supposed to do on earth. We see also that He had to surrender His own opinion in favor of God's." 

 

3. "There was an athlete in the news recently who was accused of making racist comments, but the things he said weren't as bad as what Christ said to this woman."

 

4. "At various points in the gospels, we hear Christ saying disparaging things to women. In fact, He addressed His own mother as 'woman.' "

 

My mind is blown...

 

Edited September 7, 2014 by Ancilla Domini

[Vincent Vega]

 

4. "At various points in the gospels, we hear Christ saying disparaging things to women. In fact, He addressed His own mother as 'woman.' "

 

 

TIL Woman is a disparaging term for a woman.

[PhuturePriest]

It's almost as if he's never taken a biblical theology course in his life, otherwise he would know what "Woman" means.

[veritasluxmea]

ugh. This passage is confusing, but this guy really clears it up. I highly recommend reading the entire page. 

 

http://christianthinktank.com/qcrude.html

 

 

Summary: This passage proves to be a masterful teaching session by the Lord. It does not contain the traditionally-assumed insults to the woman, nor the insensitive rejection of her anxious request. Instead, it shows a sensitivity to her urgent need AND the disciples' needs. Through the skillful selection of a warm, household image, Jesus creates a situation that leads the woman to a more informed faith, a more precise hope, and the disciples to a greater appreciation of their role and of their privilege. Jesus has stayed true to His priority at the time (His disciple's needs), but was willing to interrupt that (briefly) to minister to a needy, faith-filled heart and to use that in leading His disciples to the greater rest that comes from greater faith in God. And this situation, recorded in scripture, challenges US to recognize His power and His willingness to meet our needs, although we MAY have to learn something in the process too...:>)

Such a Savior!

 

[Nihil Obstat]

JEROME; Leaving the Scribes and Pharisees and those cavilers, He passes into the parts of Tyre and Sidon, that He may heal the Tyrians and Sidonians; And Jesus went thence, and departed into the coasts of Tyre and Sidon. 

REMIG; Tyre and Sidon were Gentile towns, for Tyre was the metropolis of the Chananaeans, and Sidon the boundary of the Chananaeans towards the north. 

CHRYS; It should be observed, that when He delivered the Jews from the observance of meats, He then also opened the door to the Gentiles, as Peter was first bidden in the vision to break this law, and was afterwards sent to Cornelius. But if any should ask, how it is that He bade His disciples go not into the way of the Gentiles, and yet now Himself walks this way; we will answer, first, that that precept which He had given His disciples was not obligatory on Him; secondly, that He went not to preach, whence Mark even says, that He purposely concealed Himself. 

REMIG; He went that He might heal them of Tyre and Sidon; or that He might deliver this woman's daughter from the demon, and so through her faith might condemn the wickedness of the Scribes and Pharisees. Of this woman it proceeds And, behold, a woman, a Chananite, came out from those parts. 

CHRYS; The Evangelist says that she was a Chananaean, to show the power of Christ's presence. For this nation, which had been driven out that they might not corrupt the Jews, now showed themselves wiser than the Jews, leaving their own borders that they might go to Christ. And when she came to Him, she asked only for mercy, as it follows, She cried to Him, saying, Have mercy on me, Lord, you Son of David. 

GLOSS; The great faith of this Chananaean woman is herein showed. She believes Him to be God, in that she calls Him Lord; and man, in that she calls Him Son of David. She claims nothing of her own desert, but craves only God's mercy. And she says not, Have mercy on my daughter, but Have mercy on me; because the affliction of the daughter is the affliction of the mother. And the more to excite His compassion, she declares to Him the whole of her grief, My daughter is grievously vexed by a demon; thus unfolding to the Physician the wound and the extent and nature of the disease; its extent, when she says is grievously vexed; its nature, by a demon. 

CHRYS; Note the wisdom of this woman, in she went not to men who promised fair, she sought not useless bandages, but leaving all devilish charms, she came to the Lord. She asked not James, she did not pray John, or apply to Peter, but putting herself under the protection of penitence, she ran alone to the Lord. But, behold, a new trouble. She makes her petition, raising her voice into a shout, and God, the lover of mankind, answers not a word. 

JEROME; Not from pharisaic pride, or the superciliousness of the Scribes, but that He might not seem to contravene His own decision, Go not into the way of the Gentiles. For He was unwilling to give occasion to their cavils, and reserved the complete salvation of the Gentiles for the season of His passion and resurrection. 

GLOSS; And by this delay in answering, He shows us the patience and perseverance of this woman. And He answered not for this reason also, that the disciples might petition for her; showing herein that the prayers of the Saints are necessary in order to obtain any thing; as it follows, And his disciples came to him, saying, Send her away, for she cries after us. 

JEROME; The disciples, as yet ignorant of the mysteries of God or moved by compassion, beg for this Chananean woman; or perhaps seeking to be rid of her importunity. 

AUG; A question of discrepancy is raised upon this, that Mark says the Lord was in the house when the woman came praying for her daughter. Indeed Matthew might; have been understood to have omitted mention of the house and yet to have been relating the same event; but when he says, that the disciples suggested to the Lord, Send her away, for she cries after us, he seems to indicate clearly that the woman raised her voice in supplication, in following the Lord who was walking. We must understand then, that as Mark writes, she entered in where Jesus was, that is, as he had noticed above, in the house; then, that as Matthew writes, He answered her not a word, and during this silence of both sides, Jesus left the house; and then the rest follows without any discordance. 

CHRYS; I judge that the disciples were sorry for the woman's affliction, yet dared not say, Grant her this mercy, but only Send her away as we, when we would persuade any one, oftentimes say the very contrary to what we wish. He answered and said, I am not sent but to the lost sheep of the house of Israel. 

JEROME; He says that He is not sent to the Gentiles but that He is sent first to Israel, so that when they would not receive the Gospel, the passing over to the Gentiles might have just cause. 

REMIG; In this way also He was sent specially to the Jews, because He taught them by His bodily presence. 

JEROME; And He adds of the house of Israel, with this design, that we might rightly interpret by this place that other parable concerning the stray sheep. 

CHRYS; But when the woman saw that the Apostles had no power, she became bold with commendable boldness; for before she had not dared to come before His sight but, as it is said, She cries after us. But when it seemed that she must now retire without being relieved, she came nearer, But she came and worshipped him. 

JEROME; Note how perseveringly this Chananaean woman calls Him first Son of David, then Lord, and lastly came and worshipped him, as God. 

CHRYS; And therefore she said not Ask, or Pray God for me, but Lord, help me. But the more the woman urged her petition, the more He strengthened His denial; for He calls the Jews now not sheep but sons, and the Gentiles dogs; He answered and said to her, It is not meet to take the children's bread, and give it to dogs. 

GLOSS; The Jews were born sons, and brought up by the Law in the worship of one God. The bread is the Gospel, its miracles and other things which pertain to our salvation. It is not then meet that these should be taken from the children and given to the Gentiles, who are dogs, till the Jews refuse them. 

JEROME; The Gentiles are called dogs because of their idolatry; who, given to the eating of blood, and dead bodies, turn to madness. 

CHRYS; Observe this woman's prudence; she does not dare to contradict Him, nor is she vexed with the commendation of the Jews, and the evil word applied to herself; But she said, Yea, Lord, yet the dogs eat of the crumbs which fall from their masters' table. He said, It is not good; she answers, 'Yet even so, Lord;' He calls the Jews children, she calls them masters; He called her a dog, she accepts the office of a dog; as if she had said, I cannot leave the table of my Lord. 

JEROME; Wonderful are shown the faith, patience, and humility of this woman; faith, that she believed that her daughter could be healed; patience, that so many times overlooked, she yet perseveres in her prayers; humility, that she compares herself not to the dogs, but to the whelps. I know, she says, that I do not deserve the children's bread, and that I cannot have whole meat, nor sit at the table with the master of the house, but I am content with that which is left for the whelps, that through humble fragments I may come to the amplitude of the perfect bread. 

CHRYS; This was the cause why Christ was so backward, that He knew what she would say, and would not have her so great excellence hid; whence it follows, Then Jesus answered and said to her, O woman, great is your faith, be it to you according to your will. Observe how the woman herself had contributed not a little to her daughter's healing; and therefore Christ said not to her, 'Let your daughter be healed', but, Be it to you according to your will; that you may perceive that she had spoken in sincerity, and that her words were not words of flattery, but of abundant faith. And this word of Christ is like that word which said, Let there be a firmament and it was made; so here, And her daughter was made whole from that hour. Observe how she obtains what the Apostles could not obtain for her; so great a thing is the earnestness of prayer. He would rather that we should pray for our own offenses ourselves, than that others should pray for us. 

REMIG; In these words is given us a pattern of catechizing and baptizing children; for the woman says not 'Heal my daughter,' or 'Help her,' but, Have mercy upon me, and help me. Thus there has come down in the Church the practice that the faithful are sponsors to God for their young children, before they have attained such age and reason that they can themselves make any pledge to God. So that as by this woman's faith her daughter was healed, so by the faith of Catholics of mature age their sins might be forgiven to infants. Allegorically; This woman figures the Holy Church gathered out of the Gentiles. The Lord leaves the Scribes and Pharisees, and comes into the parts of Tyre and Sidon; this figures His leaving the Jews and going over to the Gentiles. This woman came out of her own country, because the Holy Church departed from former errors and sins. 

JEROME; And the daughter of this Chananean I suppose to be the souls of believers who were sorely vexed by a demon, not knowing their Creator, and bowing down to stones. 

REMIG; Those of whom the Lord speaks as children are the Patriarchs and Prophets of that time. By the table is signified the Holy Scripture, by the fragments the best precepts, or inward mysteries on which Holy Church feeds; by the crumbs the carnal precepts which the Jews keep. The fragments are said to be eaten under the table, because the Church submits itself humbly to fulfilling the Divine commands. 

RABAN; But the whelps eat not the crust only, but the crumbs of the children's bread, because the despised among the Gentiles on turning to the faith, seek out in Scripture not the outside of the letter, but the spiritual sense, by which they may be able to profit in good acts. 

JEROME; Wonderful change of things! Once Israel the son, and we the dogs; the change in faith has led to a change in the order of our names. Concerning them is said, Many dogs have come about me; while to us is said, as to this woman, your faith has made you whole. 

RABAN; Great indeed was her faith; for the Gentiles, neither trained in the Law, nor educated by the words of the Prophets, straightway on the preaching of the Apostles obeyed with the hearing of the ear, and therefore deserved to obtain salvation. 

GLOSS; And if the Lord delays the salvation of a soul at the first tears of the supplicating Church, we ought not to despair, or to cease from our prayers, but rather continue them earnestly. 

AUG; And that to heal the Centurion's servant, and the daughter of this Chananean woman, He does not go to their houses, signifies that the Gentiles, among whom He Himself went not, should be saved by His word. That these are healed on the prayer of their parents, we must understand of the Church, which is at once mother and children; the whole body of those who make up the Church is the mother, and each individual of that body is a son of that mother. 

HILARY; Or, This mother represents the proselytes, in that she leaves her own country, and forsakes the Gentiles for the name of another nation; she prays for her daughter, that is, the body of the Gentiles possessed with unclean spirits; and having learned the Lord by the Law, calls Him the Son of David. 

RABAN; Also whosoever has his conscience polluted with the defilement of any sin, has a daughter sorely vexed by a demon. Also whosoever has defiled any good that he has done by the plague of sin, has a daughter tossed by the furies of an unclean spirit, and has need to fly to prayers and tears, and to seek the intercessions and aids of the saints.

[Vincent Vega]

tfl;dfr

[Basilisa Marie]

Sounds like the guy has spent way too much time doing armchair theology and not enough time in class. 

 

So he's trying to promote the role of a woman through this story...by playing off of nasty tropes like the nagging wife? And ignoring the fact that the woman agrees with Christ that she is a "dog" in the eyes of the Jews, too? She's not demanding Christ do anything, she's humbling herself before the Lord and asking for his help. It's a cruddy kind of false feminism that ignores scholarship, history, and what the woman herself says and does in the text in order to make Jesus more palatable for the comfortable masses. 

 

UGH.  Plus he ignores the context of which he calls Mary "woman" - they're all at key points in his ministry, like when it begins (Cana) and ends (Calvary). It points to who she is in the economy of salvation, she is the woman, not blessed simply because she gave birth to Christ, but because she heard the word of God and cooperated with it so completely. There's probably something there about the spiritual meaning of femininity, too - it doesn't make sense that he would simply be addressing her biological sex in these cases. 

 

Rawr.  Save me from terrible feminism. 

 

 

[Nihil Obstat]

tfl;dfr

Shaddap, UnitedAirlinesΙΧΘΥΣ

[Ancilla Domini]

Sounds like the guy has spent way too much time doing armchair theology and not enough time in class. 

 

So he's trying to promote the role of a woman through this story...by playing off of nasty tropes like the nagging wife? And ignoring the fact that the woman agrees with Christ that she is a "dog" in the eyes of the Jews, too? She's not demanding Christ do anything, she's humbling herself before the Lord and asking for his help. It's a cruddy kind of false feminism that ignores scholarship, history, and what the woman herself says and does in the text in order to make Jesus more palatable for the comfortable masses. 

 

UGH.  Plus he ignores the context of which he calls Mary "woman" - they're all at key points in his ministry, like when it begins (Cana) and ends (Calvary). It points to who she is in the economy of salvation, she is the woman, not blessed simply because she gave birth to Christ, but because she heard the word of God and cooperated with it so completely. There's probably something there about the spiritual meaning of femininity, too - it doesn't make sense that he would simply be addressing her biological sex in these cases. 

 

Rawr.  Save me from terrible feminism. 

 

Aaaand...he denies the omniscience of Christ and claims that Christ and God have conflicting opinions...

 

Excuse me while I go throw things.
 

Edited September 8, 2014 by Ancilla Domini

[Basilisa Marie]

Aaaand...he denies the omniscience of Christ and claims that Christ and God have conflicting opinions...

 

Excuse me while I go throw things.
 

 

Yeah, and while I get that the interplay between the human and divine natures of Christ is basically a mystery (how much did Jesus know during his human lifetime about everything, or can Jesus be omniscient when the scripture says that he "learned and grew"?), stuff like this just goes WAY too far in one direction.