If God Wished That Nobody Would Perish In Hell, Then Why Did He Create

[veritasluxmea]

Edit: Title is supposed to say "If God wished that nobody would perish in hell, then why did he create it?"

 

Did God create hell, and if so, why? Was it a just or merciful act? If He created it to punish people, how can he be merciful and loving? 

 

How would you answer that question? 

Edited August 22, 2014 by veritasluxmea

[Fidei Defensor]

God's mercy requires our cooperation. If we refuse to cooperate, we are making a choice that is enforced by His justice — hell.

[Credo in Deum]

Edit: Title is supposed to say "If God wished that nobody would perish in hell, then why did he create it?"

Did God create hell, and if so, why? Was it a just or merciful act? If He created it to punish people, how can he be merciful and loving?

How would you answer that question?

I would still build a prison even though I personally would never want to see someone in it.

[John Ryan]

I tend to follow Karl Rahner in thinking of hell as a state not a place.

[superblue]

Edit: Title is supposed to say "If God wished that nobody would perish in hell, then why did he create it?"

 

Did God create hell, and if so, why? Was it a just or merciful act? If He created it to punish people, how can he be merciful and loving? 

 

How would you answer that question? 

 

 

I would answer it by saying God didn't create Hell, He  created free will, and that the question is thus flawed from the start.

 

A question which I know the standard answer to already, which I think you might like better is, if God doesn't want us ending up in Hell, why did He give us " free will ",

 

The answer to which is  " love " which is beyond annoying. Hey how about this for free will, how about giving humanity the option in Heaven to decide if we want to be born an go through a corrupt world in the first place.  Instead of screwing humanity over from the word go.

 

Gotta love omnipotence ,

[Fidei Defensor]

I would answer it by saying God didn't create Hell, He  created free will, and that the question is thus flawed from the start.

 

A question which I know the standard answer to already, which I think you might like better is, if God doesn't want us ending up in Hell, why did He give us " free will ",

 

The answer to which is  " love " which is beyond annoying. Hey how about this for free will, how about giving humanity the option in Heaven to decide if we want to be born an go through a corrupt world in the first place.  Instead of screwing humanity over from the word go.

 

Gotta love omnipotence ,

Love without free will is slavery.  

 

His love is unconditional—that is, He will love us no matter what we choose; but He is also infinitely just. If we choose to not cooperate with His love and mercy, He justly allows us to be separate from Him.

[superblue]

Love without free will is slavery.  

 

His love is unconditional—that is, He will love us no matter what we choose; but He is also infinitely just. If we choose to not cooperate with His love and mercy, He justly allows us to be separate from Him.

 

 

so love with out free will is slavery, then that means the angels in heaven are slaves,

 

and i'd of sure appreciated some love and the free will with the option to decide if I really wanted to be born and go through this life.

 

it isn't " free will " ,  the only one with actual  " Free will " is God , Christ, and the Holy Spirit,  the rest of us don't actually have a choice, when the option is, hey I love you, but if you do what you want, then ima punish you an cast you out, or perhaps it is free will if it is you can do what you want, ill always love you, but your going to pay a price before ya come home.

 

Anyhow I don't see how people think it is Free will, when there a zillion other things controlling ones life to begin with not even touching on the restraints the Church so lovingly puts on everyone and not even trying to fathom what Gods' definition of love is.

 

More over if free will is awesome as everyone thinks it is, then how awesome is it knowing we are always falling short to the standards God has put on us, and we have a better chance of getting hit by lightening 5 times in a row in the same day, versus actually living a life that God wants us to live.

 

and then how crazy are we to still try.

 

any how I will take my sarcasm down the road an toss it into on coming traffic.

[Nihil Obstat]

so love with out free will is slavery, then that means the angels in heaven are slaves,

 

 

The angels do have free will. That is why were able to rebel at the beginning.

But their intellects are complete, so their choices are irrevocable.

[superblue]

The angels do have free will. That is why were able to rebel at the beginning.

But their intellects are complete, so their choices are irrevocable.

 

 

Bolded is past tense, meaning now they are slaves,

 

only makes me wonder do we lose our " free will " once in heaven.

 

 

Though being a slave to God can't really be a negative now can it ?

Edited August 22, 2014 by superblue

[Nihil Obstat]

Wrong.

[PhuturePriest]

Here's the thing: Hell is, in its own sense, a mercy. Why do I say that? Because with our actions, we choose whether we want heaven or hell. We choose sin or virtue, or vice-versa. So if you choose sin, if you choose that you don't want to be with God, then when you are at your judgment, you will feel so much shame it hurts, because God will look at you with all His purity. It will literally be less painful for you to be in hell than for you to be near God. You will want hell over being near God, because it's so incredibly awful for you to be near him due to your shame.

Edited August 22, 2014 by The Phetus

[Winchester]

Because genies aren't real.

[veritasluxmea]

I tend to follow Karl Rahner in thinking of hell as a state not a place.

Does the Church have a definitive teaching on the matter? 

 

I would answer it by saying God didn't create Hell, He  created free will, and that the question is thus flawed from the start.

 

A question which I know the standard answer to already, which I think you might like better is, if God doesn't want us ending up in Hell, why did He give us " free will ",

 

The answer to which is  " love " which is beyond annoying. Hey how about this for free will, how about giving humanity the option in Heaven to decide if we want to be born an go through a corrupt world in the first place.  Instead of screwing humanity over from the word go.

 

Gotta love omnipotence ,

So the concept of free will is flawed? That seems to challenge the idea that God is perfect, and therefore challenges the entire idea of God existing, period. However, the universe couldn't exist without God- so that puts us in a paradox, and would put him in something like agnosticism. Therefore, if we go from the assumptions that God exists, the universe is not a paradox, and the truth or religion can be known, free will is not flawed. 

 

so love with out free will is slavery, then that means the angels in heaven are slaves,

 [Edited for space]

Angels are similar to computers. They can't grow or learn new things; they have what they have. That's why Satan and the demons don't have a savior or confession and their choice is permanent. They can't grow and change and repent because they have "setting". It's a brilliant, perfect setting- but one setting nonetheless. As humans, we grow and change and learn new things and become different. God's mercy towards us is also a form of justice- it wouldn't be quite fair to condemn us forever when we can change and become better as time goes on. The angels, including Satan and demons, made their choice- and that's it. No growing up or learning new things about God. So yes, they have free will, like us they can chose to be with God or without him. Unlike us, there's no growing better or worse- they are where they are. They're like computers. If you consider the nature of being like a computer, unchangeable, as slavery- then yes, they are slaves. 

 

Here's the thing: Hell is, in its own sense, a mercy. Why do I say that? Because with our actions, we choose whether we want heaven or hell. We choose sin or virtue, or vice-versa. So if you choose sin, if you choose that you don't want to be with God, then when you are at your judgment, you will feel so much shame it hurts, because God will look at you with all His purity. It will literally be less painful for you to be in hell than for you to be near God. You will want hell over being near God, because it's so incredibly awful for you to be near him due to your shame.

That would make sense, especially with the line of thought that hell is a state and not a place. (Or is it a place where people are all in the same state?) If people would rather be in hell than be with God, and I believe that some people just really can't stand Him so they wouldn't want to be with Him, why can't they just hang out in a nice, boring place for all eternity? Why do they have to be in torment just because they can't stand him? Doesn't seem that merciful to me. 

[KarenJoanna]

I think because if we don't accept God with our free will, He who is the creator of all things good, then we reject all things good at the same time so the only place to go is hell, and it is merciful because if we don't want to be with Him, then we don't have too. It's like being cold because we don't want heat.  And, Hell isn't really a creation of God, as I like to think. It is a creation of absence of God, sin and Satan. He just lets it be there so we can choose.

[PhuturePriest]

That would make sense, especially with the line of thought that hell is a state and not a place. (Or is it a place where people are all in the same state?) If people would rather be in hell than be with God, and I believe that some people just really can't stand Him so they wouldn't want to be with Him, why can't they just hang out in a nice, boring place for all eternity? Why do they have to be in torment just because they can't stand him? Doesn't seem that merciful to me. 

 

Simple: Because God is love. Without love, there is no happiness. Have you ever lost someone and became so sad, so depressed, and just felt completely empty and awful on the inside? That's what Hell is like, because it is completely devoid of God and His love. That's the very definition of Hell; not a place of punishment, but a place completely devoid of God, and since God is love, that means you are devoid of all love and happiness.