Why Is Transgender(ism ?) Homosexuality Not A Mental Disorder

[CrossCuT]

And of course you also called them all special snowflakes so i guess you dont even follow your own rules of "their condition should be taken seriously". 

 

So why the jokes at their expense? Seems like a bully thing to do.

[Catlick]

"Men who think they're female (and vice versa) are often mentally ill. Their condition should be taken very seriously. Their ideas not."

 

From my point of view transgenders are in the same boat as people with schizophrenia. Am I stigmatizing people with schizophrenia by saying that they are mentally ill? 

 

See, this is the new Stalinism: dark has to be called light, evil good, health illness, etc. etc.

[Catlick]

And of course you also called them all special snowflakes so i guess you dont even follow your own rules of "their condition should be taken seriously". 

 

I reserve the name 'snowflake' for LGBT-whatever people who consider themselves as the Chosen Ones and crusade against anything and anyone not fully recognizing that, be it co-workers who don't want to sign in on an 'LGBT-alliance', be it bakers who don't want to make cake for a gay wedding. 

 

Obviously not all people who suffer from 'transgenderism' behave like 'snowflakes', far from it. 

[CrossCuT]

I reserve the name 'snowflake' for LGBT-whatever people who consider themselves as the Chosen Ones and crusade against anything and anyone not fully recognizing that, be it co-workers who don't want to sign in on an 'LGBT-alliance', be it bakers who don't want to make cake for a gay wedding. 

 

Obviously not all people who suffer from 'transgenderism' behave like 'snowflakes', far from it. 

 

You have a severe misunderstanding of reality. 

The LGBTQ+ community to "crusade" against everything, they fight for equality and respect. Their person hood is so degraded by the big religious bullies that they are speaking out. 

 

The majority of the christian community has this odd twisted concept that the fight for equality is equivalent to oppression. It just comes down to the idea that people fear change and they fear what they dont understand. 

[Catlick]

You have a severe misunderstanding of reality. 

The LGBTQ+ community to "crusade" against everything, they fight for equality and respect. Their person hood is so degraded by the big religious bullies that they are speaking out. 

 

The majority of the christian community has this odd twisted concept that the fight for equality is equivalent to oppression. It just comes down to the idea that people fear change and they fear what they dont understand. 

 

I find the idea of the LGBT-community fighting for equality to be absurd, since members enthusiastically persecute Christian bakers who don't want to bake gay marriage cakes, while leaving alone Jewish bakers who don't like to bake neo Nazi cakes. 

 

By the way, equality is an illusion. A 'straight' couple is essentially different than an LGBT couple, as the former can procreate and the latter can... enjoy orgasms (here's the reason why the promiscuity in the LGBT-community is so massive that it would make Casanova blush). 

[Catlick]

And what is respectful about telling people that sodomy is perfectly normal? Go and talk to a doctor about how many gay guys come to the hospital because... Well, you can guess it. 

[CrossCuT]

I find the idea of the LGBT-community fighting for equality to be absurd, since members enthusiastically persecute Christian bakers who don't want to bake gay marriage cakes, while leaving alone Jewish bakers who don't like to bake neo Nazi cakes. 

 

By the way, equality is an illusion. A 'straight' couple is essentially different than an LGBT couple, as the former can procreate and the latter can... enjoy orgasms (here's the reason why the promiscuity in the LGBT-community is so massive that it would make Casanova blush). 

 

I dont know what goes on in your world, but in my world a persons worth and subsequent treatment is not defined by their ability to conceive children. Do not discriminate against people on some arbitrary aspect their  physicality. It has nothing to do with how good of a person they are or can become.

 

I also find it depressing that on a Catholic forum, the only two people who are coming to the defense of proper treatment of the LGTBQ+ community are two non Catholics. Maybe people are tired of the conversation I dunno. Just frustrating...frustrating that I have to explain to a Catholic why Catholics shouldnt mistreat people based on your OWN religious documents. 

Edited February 16, 2015 by CrossCuT

[Not A Real Name]

Maybe people are tired of the conversation I dunno.

Yes.

[pippo buono]

Let's try to get back to the essence of the question. It seems like this isn't advancing at all as it is being posed, but I think this needs to advance. And maybe what I'm going to say has already been said, but I think it's the most interesting point of departure.

 

A psychological disorder, as someone has pointed out before on this thread by citing the DSM-5, is characterized by deviant, distressful, and dysfunctional patterns of thoughts, feelings, or behaviors. I think that this is a good baseline to be able to answer the question.

 

I imagine someone else has also pointed out that the first two editions of DSM actually understood homosexuality to fall under this category. It's true that homosexuality was taken out of the DSM-3. However, I think we need to be seriously concerned with the subjective use of this criteria. In the end, homosexuality was no longer considered a psychological disorder because of changing attitudes in the culture, making it less deviant or distressful in the common view. In short, it's entirely conventualism: It isn't a psychological disorder because the culture has accepted it. Though psychology is heavily associated with the psyche and, therefore, the subjective experiences one can have, this subjectivity is founded on the reality of the human person. To have a psychology that is entirely based on the subjective offers an incredibly poor anthropological base. Without any objective understanding of the human person, there isn't anything to improve or heal and all of us are speaking nonsense, whether we favor the definition of homosexuality as a psychological disorder or not.

 

I think these criteria for understanding psychological disorders are much more interesting when considered in light of a solid anthropology. Particularly when considering the full realization of masculine and feminine sexualities (I know I'm probably opening a can of warms but referring to these, but I think this would be good to establish before talking about so-called intersex realities), isn't it logical to understand homosexuality as a deviant and dysfunctional behavior? Perhaps those seem to be loaded words, but I don't think connotations should impede us from viewing those who have such disorders as being lesser persons, nor that they should keep us from talking about these things in general. Schizophrenia might be a psychological disorder, but that doesn't mean that the person who suffers it is more of a sinner or less of a person.

Edited February 16, 2015 by pippo buono

[CatherineM]

From my point of view transgenders are in the same boat as people with schizophrenia. Am I stigmatizing people with schizophrenia by saying that they are mentally ill?

See, this is the new Stalinism: dark has to be called light, evil good, health illness, etc. etc.

My husband has schizophrenia. Calling him mentally ill does stigmatize him. He has an illness that is treatable if not curable, yet, and so long as he takes his prescribed medication, he isn't ill.

[Socrates]

Moral disapproval of a form of behavior does not equal "bullying," nor hatred.

[4588686]

Moral disapproval of a form of behavior does not equal "bullying," nor hatred.

 

 

Nobody said that it did.

[Selah]

Moral disapproval of a form of behavior does not equal "bullying," nor hatred.

 

How it is conveyed, however, can dance a fine line between just disapproval and bullying.

 

Sadly, many trans people commit suicide, are murdered, or abused by their parents. This is something that needs to stop. 

[pippo buono]

What I worry about is being unable to discuss this topic or other controversial ones because certain words can be considered offensive when they are simply descriptive. I think it has the danger of creating an effect analogous to that of 1984, where a transformation of language takes place that makes it impossible to talk about the thing as it is.

 

The words "disorder" or "illness" appear to be charged words when placed after "mental" or "psychological" when all that they express is something that is out of place or not functionally normally (which implies a certain standard of normality). If the concern for stigmatizing people is taken to the extreme, there's no way talking about any disorder (biological, psychological, or spiritual). "Handicapped," "undeveloped," "sick" or any number of number of words become cuss words when they simply describe a difficult reality, and all that's left are euphemisms to talk around it.

 

I think the temptation is to want to make people feel better about the situation. And while I do think that reconciliation needs to take place in these difficult situations, I also think that it takes place in something deeper than language.

[Ice_nine]

I think some people are trying to say is that these people are stigmatized and probably have to deal with a lot of heartache regardless of what they choose to do about it so maybe just don't be a total db about it? Saying "we shouldn't take them seriously" is kind of a dismissive and db thing to say, or it can easily be construed as such. Just a little compassion with your truth juice.