oremus1 Posted July 12, 2014 Author Share Posted July 12, 2014 It seems to me that you are focusing too much on one singular aspect. If the Church allows for both the EF and OF forms, then the priest is not turning their back on the Lord. i meant, versus populum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oremus1 Posted July 12, 2014 Author Share Posted July 12, 2014 Depends on one's reasons for preferring the traditional Mass. For those priests who choose to primarily celebrate the traditional Mass, for instance the FSSP, a fairly large proportion of them would not celebrate the Novus Ordo no matter how formally it was done. My priest for instance categorically will not celebrate the Novus Ordo, and as he would be the celebrant it is simply not a matter of how formally it could be performed. He will not even concelebrate the diocesan chrism Mass. It stands to reason that many laypeople would feel similarly. ^^^ this. what are wannabe monks/nuns to do??? many such convents are busting or full already Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maximillion Posted July 12, 2014 Share Posted July 12, 2014 The Spirit blows where He will......... Historical and some other reasons have been given for the 'lack' you speak of. Ultimately it comes down to the inspiration of the Holy Spirit. It would seem these communities are not being Inspired into being. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beatitude Posted July 12, 2014 Share Posted July 12, 2014 ^^^ this. what are wannabe monks/nuns to do??? many such convents are busting or full already Perhaps they should try to remember that we worship Jesus through the liturgy, we don't worship the liturgy itself? Unless you are a discerner who hoped to enter a community with the EF Mass and were been turned away for lack of room (and it doesn't sound as though you are, going by your previous posts - in other places you have said that you're a CV) then I don't see what this hypothetical thread is meant to achieve except give you a chance to suggest that the Novus Ordo is sinful (as you did when you asked if we should make reparation for it). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oremus1 Posted July 12, 2014 Author Share Posted July 12, 2014 Perhaps they should try to remember that we worship Jesus through the liturgy, we don't worship the liturgy itself? Unless you are a discerner who hoped to enter a community with the EF Mass and were been turned away for lack of room (and it doesn't sound as though you are, going by your previous posts - in other places you have said that you're a CV) then I don't see what this hypothetical thread is meant to achieve except give you a chance to suggest that the Novus Ordo is sinful (as you did when you asked if we should make reparation for it). We can make reparation for communion in the hand though? Barnabas Nwoye said that the Lord said "It gives me great agony to see people recieveing communion in the hand". Also, the REAL third secret of Fatima said many things which seem to be about the NO. Bishop Schnider says there is likely to be schism between those who are Catholic and those who are modernist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AccountDeleted Posted July 12, 2014 Share Posted July 12, 2014 We can make reparation for communion in the hand though? Barnabas Nwoye said that the Lord said "It gives me great agony to see people recieveing communion in the hand". Also, the REAL third secret of Fatima said many things which seem to be about the NO. Bishop Schnider says there is likely to be schism between those who are Catholic and those who are modernist. I think the real schism comes when one side insists that their way is the only way that is reverent and condemns the other side for doing what it lawful and in most places recommended by the Church itself. The whole debate about on the tongue or in the hand belongs in the Debate Table but honestly, it is only brought up by those who want to insist that those of us who receive in the hand are somehow less reverent than they are who receive on the tongue. Those who receive on the hand are not condemning those who receive on the tongue. So who is causing the schism?? One day I was speaking to a Carmelite sister in one of my previous convents and I said, I love Jesus so much I wish I could just hold Him. She said to me, 'You do, every time you receive Him in your hand at Mass.' And I realized she was right. After that, every time I received Him, I gazed reverently at Him before putting Him into my mouth. And BTW in ALL 4 of the Carmels where I have been, the majority of sisters have received on the hand. And in the 1990 Constitutions Carmel (which is very pre Vat 2), they switched from tongue to hand while I was there because their Bishop had asked them to during the SARS scare - and they were being obedient. I doubt that any one of them felt less reverent towards the Eucharist. When I see Jesus in heaven, is He really going to ask me, did you receive me on your tongue or your hand? I don't think so. He is going to judge me on the reverence in my heart. "God does not see as a mortal, who sees the appearance. The LORD looks into the heart." 1 Sam 16:7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maximillion Posted July 12, 2014 Share Posted July 12, 2014 Grrr....out of props Nunsense, but I agree as above. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oremus1 Posted July 12, 2014 Author Share Posted July 12, 2014 I think the real schism comes when one side insists that their way is the only way that is reverent and condemns the other side for doing what it lawful and in most places recommended by the Church itself. The whole debate about on the tongue or in the hand belongs in the Debate Table but honestly, it is only brought up by those who want to insist that those of us who receive in the hand are somehow less reverent than they are who receive on the tongue. Those who receive on the hand are not condemning those who receive on the tongue. So who is causing the schism?? One day I was speaking to a Carmelite sister in one of my previous convents and I said, I love Jesus so much I wish I could just hold Him. She said to me, 'You do, every time you receive Him in your hand at Mass.' And I realized she was right. After that, every time I received Him, I gazed reverently at Him before putting Him into my mouth. And BTW in ALL 4 of the Carmels where I have been, the majority of sisters have received on the hand. And in the 1990 Constitutions Carmel (which is very pre Vat 2), they switched from tongue to hand while I was there because their Bishop had asked them to during the SARS scare - and they were being obedient. I doubt that any one of them felt less reverent towards the Eucharist. When I see Jesus in heaven, is He really going to ask me, did you receive me on your tongue or your hand? I don't think so. He is going to judge me on the reverence in my heart. "God does not see as a mortal, who sees the appearance. The LORD looks into the heart." 1 Sam 16:7 this is going off topic clearly people feel strongly about the EF and associated issues. so surely it is just a matter of time before there are more orders to join which are exclusively EF. Deo gratias. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AccountDeleted Posted July 12, 2014 Share Posted July 12, 2014 (edited) this is going off topic clearly people feel strongly about the EF and associated issues. so surely it is just a matter of time before there are more orders to join which are exclusively EF. Deo gratias. I think you went off topic first by talking about reparation for receiving in the hand, and I simply responded, as I disagree with your views (and so does the Church). Certainly if a person has a strong affinity for the EF, then they should discern with those communities only. But to post a controversial statement on VS about receiving in the hand is just asking for trouble. Threads on VS get shut down when they turn into debates or they get moved to the Debate Table. BTW, there is nothing to stop you from starting [yet another] thread about this controversial topic in the Debate Table should you wish to discuss it further. I do hope, for those who prefer the EF, that more communities develop that can accommodate them. But no one should be made to feel in any way less reverent because they choose not to attend the EF Mass, not to receive in the hand, or not to enter an EF-only community. Pax Christi. Edited July 12, 2014 by nunsense Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brandelynmarie Posted July 12, 2014 Share Posted July 12, 2014 One day I was speaking to a Carmelite sister in one of my previous convents and I said, I love Jesus so much I wish I could just hold Him. She said to me, 'You do, every time you receive Him in your hand at Mass.' And I realized she was right. After that, every time I received Him, I gazed reverently at Him before putting Him into my mouth. This is what I do in my parish church. At the Maronite shrine, I receive on the tongue by intincture...I think that's the word... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmaD2006 Posted July 13, 2014 Share Posted July 13, 2014 Ok ... I am closing this thread for a number of reasons a) the original thread is fine, *but* questioning what is allowed by Rome and saying that "should reparation be done" for communion in the hand and the relocation of the Eucharist is liable to lead to Catholic vs. Catholic Bickering which is NOT allowed on Phatmass. b) this is Vocation Station -- discussions on religious orders and religious life is allowed. We've more recently allowed some discussions on other forms of consecration (as long as it hasn't dominated the board). In a few cases, since some of the discussions have been opened by VSers who don't venture much out of VS we have allowed a non-VS discussion. But -- we have asked for a charitable discussion, and not one that leads to a full fledged debate. Because of what I am stating above, and because there have been a significant number of reports on this thread, before this gets worse, I am closing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmaD2006 Posted July 13, 2014 Share Posted July 13, 2014 (sorry for the followup post) Re: reason B) The specific VS rule is: "The Vocation Station should maintain a holy, non-confrontational environment. Debating is not allowed. Any poster that engages in debates or makes a post in a confrontational or aggressive tone will be warned. Multiple warning shall result in a ban from phatmass." If anyone is not familiar with the VS rules please read the rules at the top of Vocation Station. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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