Why Is There No Crucifix At The Altar Of Icksp?

[HisChildForever]

So would that be like Opus Dei?

[pdavis]

Nihil Obstat is correct.

 

Also the following regarding canons, and on the ICKSP:

 

Secular canons live an apostolic life, since they "do not say religious vows."

They make a promise to the head of the institute to live an apostolic life.

They are not a member of a religious order.

They dress according to their own choir dress, which also distinguishes them as secular canons.

ICKSP says the Traditional Latin Mass.

 

Religious Priests:

 

Religious priests live a consecrated life, since they "do say solemn religious vows of celibacy, poverty, and obedience."

Religious priests answer to their Bishop.

Religious priests are members of religious orders.

Religious priests dress in more traditional Catholic vestments.

Religious priests says the Traditional Latin Mass, or Novus Ordo Mass.

 

Additionally, this link and portion from the ICKSP website briefly discusses their secular canon membership:

 

http://www.institute-christ-king.org/institute/questions/

 

"Traditionally, priests living in a community attached to a church and dedicated to the celebration of the solemn Latin liturgy but without religious vows have been called secular canons and were distinguished by their own choir dress."

 

[PhuturePriest]

If you knew your stuff, you'd know the crucifix that hangs on the wall is completely optional. What's mandatory is the crucifix on the staff that they carry in during the opening procession.

[pdavis]

See above post for crucifix requirement at the altar.

 

Catholic Bishops state what is required at the altar in the General Instruction of the Roman Missal (GIRM 308).

 

The attached link from the US Conference of Catholic Bishops:

 

"308. Likewise, either on the altar or near it, there is to be a cross, with the figure of Christ crucified upon it, a cross clearly visible to the assembled people. It is desirable that such a cross should remain near the altar even outside of liturgical celebrations, so as to call to mind for the faithful the saving Passion of the Lord."

 

http://www.usccb.org/prayer-and-worship/the-mass/general-instruction-of-the-roman-missal/girm-chapter-5.cfm

[ithinkjesusiscool]

look at this: http://www.katolskakyrkan.se/1/1.0.1.0/254/1/

[PhuturePriest]

See above post for crucifix requirement at the altar.

 

Catholic Bishops state what is required at the altar in the General Instruction of the Roman Missal (GIRM 308).

 

The attached link from the US Conference of Catholic Bishops:

 

"308. Likewise, either on the altar or near it, there is to be a cross, with the figure of Christ crucified upon it, a cross clearly visible to the assembled people. It is desirable that such a cross should remain near the altar even outside of liturgical celebrations, so as to call to mind for the faithful the saving Passion of the Lord."

 

http://www.usccb.org/prayer-and-worship/the-mass/general-instruction-of-the-roman-missal/girm-chapter-5.cfm

 

Yes. That is referring to the Crucifix attached to the staff. Note the bolded part. "Either on the altar or near it", doesn't refer to a gigantic crucifix attached to the wall, it refers to a crucifix. Even if you had that giant crucifix on the wall, you still need the one on the staff.

[pdavis]

Thank you for the link. The photos on your European website link are correct. The altars only have a crucifix. The crucifix is very small in each photo, however, those altars are not overshadowed by other statues.

 

What I said in my post is that the ICKSP altar with the very large statue of the Infant of Prague, is placed "above" their very small cross at the altar, was much larger than the ICKSP cross. The secular canon is shown raising the eucharist to the very large statue of the Infant of Prague, venerating the statue. There should be no other statute above the cross at the altar. Veneration should only be done to the crucified image of Christ, that represents Christ died for our sins.

 

The Infant of Prague has a place for devotion in the church, but definitely not at the altar, above the cross or crucifix of the crucified image of Christ.

 

The attached link from the US Conference of Catholic Bishops:

 

"308. Likewise, either on the altar or near it, there is to be a cross, with the figure of Christ crucified upon it, a cross clearly visible to the assembled people. It is desirable that such a cross should remain near the altar even outside of liturgical celebrations, so as to call to mind for the faithful the saving Passion of the Lord."

 

http://www.usccb.org...m-chapter-5.cfm

 

 

 

[the171]

can you stop repeating yourself? it's really not helping you.

[beatitude]

Well, this makes a nice change from communion on the hand, the merits of the EF versus the OF, and the romantic lives of gay people.

[pdavis]

Not everybody reads each and every one of the posts in the thread. It is helpful to re-post the GIRM # 308 with the requirements of the crucifix at the altar. Individuals do not need to search for it in previous posts.

[Basilisa Marie]

Nah, people usually read a thread if it's only two pages. If it were posted ten pages ago, then it might warrent a repost. :)

[PhuturePriest]

Not everybody reads each and every one of the posts in the thread. It is helpful to re-post the GIRM # 308 with the requirements of the crucifix at the altar. Individuals do not need to search for it in previous posts.

 

GIRM #308 does indeed state requirements for a crucifix at the altar. But it does not specify that it must be a life-sized Jesus hanging on the wall. I have spoken with priests about this very subject, and they said all you need is the crucifix attached to the staff (I don't know the technical name for it.).

[HisChildForever]

So--what's the solution we're looking for here? Write to the ICKSP about the issue if it's such a problem.

[Maggyie]

And again, when the priest elevates the Host he is NOT NOT NOT "venerating" the Infant of Prague, the crucifix or anything else that happens to be there. He is offering the sacrifice to the Father, and at a practical level allowing the faithful to venerate the Eucharist more easily.

Again the Host is NOT to be used to venerate any image or statue or anything, rather the Eucharist Himself is to be venerated.

Now I'm repeating myself!

[pdavis]

Will repeat because it appears my post is not being read in it's entirety:

 

"A statue of the Infant of Prague, or any other statue, should not be larger than a cross, and should not be placed above a cross, or be venerated and devoted "at the altar" during Mass by raising the eucharist to the statue.  The eucharist should only be raised to the crucifix representing the suffering Christ made for our sins.

 

What I said in my post is that the ICKSP altars with the very large statue of the Infant of Prague, is placed "above" their very small cross at the altar, is much larger than the ICKSP cross. The secular canon is shown raising the eucharist to the very large statue of the Infant of Prague, venerating the statue. There should be no other statute above the cross at the altar. Veneration should only be done to the crucified image of Christ, that represents Christ died for our sins.

 

The Infant of Prague has a place for devotion in the church, but definitely not at the altar, above the cross or crucifix of the crucified image of Christ.

 

My question is has anyone noticed changes in the traditional Catholic altars over time, especially with this group?