I'm Doing A Presentation On Carmelites On Wednesday

[ChristinaTherese]

Well, we're leading a class about a book about Carmelites on Wednesday, so when we broke it up I took giving some background on the order (particularly as it pertains to the book), another person is doing a summary of the book for those who didn't actually read it so they can actually participate (and presumably going beyond that as well into deeper stuff), and the last one of us is going to tie it into other stuff we've read this quarter and try to instigate/lead discussion. The book is Lying Awake, by Mark Salzman, and is about a nun who has epileptic seizures. She thinks they're migraines, and has visions when she surrenders to the pain. So when she's told she has epilepsy, her whole world turns upside down and she's forced to consider whether the visions and her very intense feelings of God are real or not. Since we've been talking about the brain a lot in class, it pertains very much.

 

Since she's experienced a bunch of darkness and distance from God, and her name is Sr. John of the Cross, I really want to dig into St. John of the Cross' dark night of the soul (which I know very little about). I also want to go into prayer for the world, ora et labora, a general history of the Carmelites, discernment (possibly), poetry, cloister, community, and the major parts of Carmelite spirituality.

 

Here's my outline as it stands:

Elijah/eremetic beginnings:

silence and solitude

encounter with God

poetry (I assume this didn't originate back then, but it fits into the general concept all the same, I think. I'm not really going for recounting the history of the order, especially since I don't know it well myself.)

St. John of the Cross and St. Teresa of Avila:

community (not saying that it originated then in the order, simply not listing it under Elijah/eremetic)

cloister (nuns)

dark night of the soul

Ora et labora (Yes, I know that's Benedictine. Am I right to assume that it has presence in every order's life?)

prayer for the world

the Liturgy of the Hours and the Mass

pray Midmorning Prayer (None) as a class, maybe ask one of the others on our team to help us get into more of a prayerful mode beforehand

Other things that are optional to mention

discernment is an ongoing process (Sr. Miriam, a novice, is struggling and Sr. John helps her)

how religious names work (Since it might seem odd to my classmates for a woman to have a male name.)

the Church calendar/Saints' feast days

 

As far as resources, I mostly have PCC stuff... which is maybe lousy, but I know a lot more about that order. And the internet is great. I was thinking I would use one of Mother Francis (PCC)'s poems to illustrate another instance of Sr. John's kind of thought poetry taking physical things and working to spiritual ones, but if anyone has an OCD nun's poetry to recommend, I'd be glad to take a look and maybe use that instead. Or resources on any of the above, particularly St. John of the Cross' dark night (which I know little about and want to make a point of). I can use A Right to Be Merry and Mother Francis' writings on the cloister, since they're obviously applicable across the board (well, if you choose the right sections, probably), and I have a thing by a Dominican priest about cloistered nuns and the New Evangelization that is quite wonderful and beautiful that I can cite, but I'm basically lacking sources (outside of the sea that is the internet) about St. John of the Cross, Carmelite history, and Carmelite spirituality (for which I found these: http://www.carmelitesistersocd.com/2013/the-goal-of-carmel/ and http://www.carmelite.com/spirituality/default.cfm?loadref=4). Any help on any of this and/or mention of points that might be good to make that I don't know of because I don't really know the Carmelite order very well would be great.

[ChristinaTherese]

I'm thinking of using this quote from Sr. Mary Catharine, if she'll let me, as well. I'm not sure if it will fit in yet, but I think it might. (It was in Carla's thread.)

. . .

I wish this idea that the cloistered life is for a "special kind of person" wouldn't get perpetuated. It stops so many (myself included) from considering it. My experience is that this life is for those of us who are weak! We need the Lord to keep us in the "hot house" so that we can flourish! If we were out on the pathways we'd the seed of the Word of God would probably not take root and come to fruition!

 

Cloistered life is a very simple and ordinary life. It is intense in many ways, yes, but it is worth it!

. . .

 

[ChristinaTherese]

Oh, another thing. I was thinking that it might be nice to show a video of Carmelites, and I don't really want to go hunting one down on YouTube if I can avoid it if you guys can think of any good ones. (I'm willing to if there are no good suggestions made, I'd just rather ask first.) So, do any of you have any favorite videos that you think could make a good introduction to the concept of cloistered Carmelite life?

[ChristinaTherese]

Oh, I know I keep replying to myself here, but I just wanted to add one last thing. I'm at a Protestant school, so my friends at least have background on Christianity, but they don't really have much knowledge at all about religous life and probably have even less knowledge about cloisters.

[ChristinaTherese]

Um. One last thing, really this time. I know I should have said Terce above, not None... Pretend I did, please.

[vee]

iono if this might help

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQNk5F-peg0

[OnlySunshine]

You might also consider using excerpts from "The Nun" documentary about a Carmelite nun who lives in Sweden.

 

There's also these videos on YouTube:

 

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v53bLHAJzwc[/media]

 

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zC_oa_Kbl5g[/media]

[OnlySunshine]

These videos give an excellent view of the life from postulancy to vows:

 

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NyK4XnLX0u4[/media]

 

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Yjzff_ykNw[/media]

[graciandelamadrededios]

Well, we're leading a class about a book about Carmelites on Wednesday, so when we broke it up I took giving some background on the order (particularly as it pertains to the book), another person is doing a summary of the book for those who didn't actually read it so they can actually participate (and presumably going beyond that as well into deeper stuff), and the last one of us is going to tie it into other stuff we've read this quarter and try to instigate/lead discussion. The book is Lying Awake, by Mark Salzman, and is about a nun who has epileptic seizures. She thinks they're migraines, and has visions when she surrenders to the pain. So when she's told she has epilepsy, her whole world turns upside down and she's forced to consider whether the visions and her very intense feelings of God are real or not. Since we've been talking about the brain a lot in class, it pertains very much.

 

Since she's experienced a bunch of darkness and distance from God, and her name is Sr. John of the Cross, I really want to dig into St. John of the Cross' dark night of the soul (which I know very little about). I also want to go into prayer for the world, ora et labora, a general history of the Carmelites, discernment (possibly), poetry, cloister, community, and the major parts of Carmelite spirituality.

 

Here's my outline as it stands:

Elijah/eremetic beginnings:

silence and solitude

encounter with God

poetry (I assume this didn't originate back then, but it fits into the general concept all the same, I think. I'm not really going for recounting the history of the order, especially since I don't know it well myself.)

St. John of the Cross and St. Teresa of Avila:

community (not saying that it originated then in the order, simply not listing it under Elijah/eremetic)

cloister (nuns)

dark night of the soul

Ora et labora (Yes, I know that's Benedictine. Am I right to assume that it has presence in every order's life?)

prayer for the world

the Liturgy of the Hours and the Mass

pray Midmorning Prayer (None) as a class, maybe ask one of the others on our team to help us get into more of a prayerful mode beforehand

Other things that are optional to mention

discernment is an ongoing process (Sr. Miriam, a novice, is struggling and Sr. John helps her)

how religious names work (Since it might seem odd to my classmates for a woman to have a male name.)

the Church calendar/Saints' feast days

 

As far as resources, I mostly have PCC stuff... which is maybe lousy, but I know a lot more about that order. And the internet is great. I was thinking I would use one of Mother Francis (PCC)'s poems to illustrate another instance of Sr. John's kind of thought poetry taking physical things and working to spiritual ones, but if anyone has an OCD nun's poetry to recommend, I'd be glad to take a look and maybe use that instead. Or resources on any of the above, particularly St. John of the Cross' dark night (which I know little about and want to make a point of). I can use A Right to Be Merry and Mother Francis' writings on the cloister, since they're obviously applicable across the board (well, if you choose the right sections, probably), and I have a thing by a Dominican priest about cloistered nuns and the New Evangelization that is quite wonderful and beautiful that I can cite, but I'm basically lacking sources (outside of the sea that is the internet) about St. John of the Cross, Carmelite history, and Carmelite spirituality (for which I found these: http://www.carmelitesistersocd.com/2013/the-goal-of-carmel/ and http://www.carmelite.com/spirituality/default.cfm?loadref=4). Any help on any of this and/or mention of points that might be good to make that I don't know of because I don't really know the Carmelite order very well would be great.

 

I sent you PM in response to what you posted here.

 

Gracian

[graciandelamadrededios]

Oh, another thing. I was thinking that it might be nice to show a video of Carmelites, and I don't really want to go hunting one down on YouTube if I can avoid it if you guys can think of any good ones. (I'm willing to if there are no good suggestions made, I'd just rather ask first.) So, do any of you have any favorite videos that you think could make a good introduction to the concept of cloistered Carmelite life?

 

 

My favorites:

 

http://www.nzonscreen.com/title/the-carmelites-1969 - A video of what Carmel looks like before Vatican II, at the end of the Video - Mother Prioress and her companion pulled down their grate/great veils to cover their faces before opening the gate.

 

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&v=uNyqgaYdNro&feature=endscreen

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&v=FwU4FZZ8dzY&feature=endscreen

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0dqsnF9CEcM

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZUv70N6BYBg

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eKObpgUw23w

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tC1Ffo78lxw

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sbFqlPvnPd4

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tC1Ffo78lxw – terrible music but great video; very clear.  The video was taken in Carmelite Nun in Milan (CARMELITANE SCALZE DI VIA MARCO ANTONIO COLONNA A MILANO).  Impressive double grille!  The wooden crosses are bigger than with the community of three nuns being interviewed on the video below.  Day veils are shirred like Spanish.  The video is very clear!

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eKObpgUw23w – an interview with Italian Carmelite Nuns, their wooden crosses pinned outside their scapulars can be seen clearly, however, it was smaller – the crosses and not the scapular.  Beware Ursula, listening to this may mess up your Portuguese!  However, you can turn off the volume and just view without audio..

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4LKV5dWploE – profession of perpetual vows or solemn vows in Mexican Carmel but done outside the cloister which I do not like, the flowers and petals she was showered with is amazing; I am sure it was so fragrant!

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uNiROU_ilDA – Carmelite Nuns in Brazil, the newly professed sister is so happy and you can tell by her smile!

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_gVmLgJY2yo – Brazilian Carmel

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JTFKasemTsQ – Brazilian Carmel – death of a nun

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oE8Orwf_f3s – profession of vows in Brazilian Carmel

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4xe_qxAMYDk – Carmel in Curitiba, Brazil

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h3rv-ksVXZc – entrance in Carmel – Brazil

 

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HVUzcinBPgk – profession of vows – outside the choir – Brazil

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iYhJ3tBZr5A

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KlDoy93Bi8A

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eKObpgUw23w

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tC1Ffo78lxw

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i4L0A-bqUNE

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L6Jdo3DWcHQ

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JBOsOw79cBQ

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7l_xuIcJOPo

 

 

 

 

[ChristinaTherese]

Thanks for your help! Class was this morning, and it went rather well. I just gave an overview of the eremetic and communal nature of things, cloister, the dark night, prayer for the world, and maybe a little bit more. Then the other two of us continued with more specific stuff about the book, and we finished the class with Midday Prayer. So it was good, and information on videos, poetry, and impressions of the book that you gave either here or by PM were all helpful.

[graciandelamadrededios]

Thanks for your help! Class was this morning, and it went rather well. I just gave an overview of the eremetic and communal nature of things, cloister, the dark night, prayer for the world, and maybe a little bit more. Then the other two of us continued with more specific stuff about the book, and we finished the class with Midday Prayer. So it was good, and information on videos, poetry, and impressions of the book that you gave either here or by PM were all helpful.

 

Is that class for a Book Club?

 

What are the specifi topics or books you wanted to discuss in class?

[ChristinaTherese]

The class is about faith and science, and we were talking a lot about Sr. John's visions and epilepsy combined and the whole problem of whether or not they were trustworthy. I was simply laying a bit of groundwork for that discussion by introducing the background of the book. It was probably helpful for understanding the values she had and where she was coming from in her struggle. (It's the last class we need to take together for the honors program at our school. After finals next week, all most of us have left is our honors projects, which we work on individually. The reason I was involved in leading the class/teaching is that during our two Faith and Science courses, they like to split the students up into groups that lead class one day. It's a wonderful program and I love it very much.)

[graciandelamadrededios]

The class is about faith and science, and we were talking a lot about Sr. John's visions and epilepsy combined and the whole problem of whether or not they were trustworthy. I was simply laying a bit of groundwork for that discussion by introducing the background of the book. It was probably helpful for understanding the values she had and where she was coming from in her struggle. (It's the last class we need to take together for the honors program at our school. After finals next week, all most of us have left is our honors projects, which we work on individually. The reason I was involved in leading the class/teaching is that during our two Faith and Science courses, they like to split the students up into groups that lead class one day. It's a wonderful program and I love it very much.)

 

Thats good!  Are you Roman Catholic?

[ChristinaTherese]

I am. My school is Protestant, but I'm not. (I do have a Catholic prof in that class though.)