The Third Way: Homosexuality And The Catholic Church

[Fidei Defensor]

http://vimeo.com/93079367

Edited April 29, 2014 by tardis ad astra

[Eliakim]

Is this endorsed by the Church? 

 

Plays to emotion while downplaying Truth.  Agenda is to cause Catholics not to see the disorder as a vice and accept homosexuality. 

Catechism states the inclination is objectively disordered, not just the act. 

 

It did not escape notice that the OP had 6661 posts at time of posting this.  Witting or unwitting things undermining the Church can be posted. 

 

A sad story of people abused in this fallen world who feel trapped and do not know where to go because of their same-sex attraction experiences.  This video tells them they should just accept that they cannot change and try to practice chastity.     

 

Praise God there is more hope and renewal than this.  Do not believe the lie that this can never be changed.  There is a Fourth Way:

 

http://www.catholicnewsagency.com/resources/life-and-family/homosexuality/the-homosexual-condition-can-it-be-changed-prevented/

 

and a site that has videos and teaches Truth:

http://truthministry.org/

 

Love in Christ, but turn from sin and "be transformed". -Rom 12:2

 

E

 

 

[Fidei Defensor]

Is this endorsed by the Church? 

 

Plays to emotion while downplaying Truth.  Agenda is to cause Catholics not to see the disorder as a vice and accept homosexuality. 

Catechism states the inclination is objectively disordered, not just the act. 

 

It did not escape notice that the OP had 6661 posts at time of posting this.  Witting or unwitting things undermining the Church can be posted. 

 

A sad story of people abused in this fallen world who feel trapped and do not know where to go because of their same-sex attraction experiences.  This video tells them they should just accept that they cannot change and try to practice chastity.     

 

Praise God there is more hope and renewal than this.  Do not believe the lie that this can never be changed.  There is a Fourth Way:

 

http://www.catholicnewsagency.com/resources/life-and-family/homosexuality/the-homosexual-condition-can-it-be-changed-prevented/

 

and a site that has videos and teaches Truth:

http://truthministry.org/

 

Love in Christ, but turn from sin and "be transformed". -Rom 12:2

 

E

Did you even watch the whole thing? Living with same sex attraction is incredibly "emotional," as you put it. I'm not sure of your own personal struggles in life, but I can attest to the difficulties with same sex attraction.

 

The documentary does show a lot of the emotions, yes. But the last portion is all about being called to chastity, that you =/= your sexuality, that there is a difference between having the attractions and acting on them.

 

It may not be your cup of tea, and that is fine. However, unless you personally have experience in this area, you are best to not make overarching pronouncements about it.  Same sex attraction is a real struggle. I still struggle with feeling isolated. I practice chastity, but I still struggle with issues of lust in my heart, just like any heterosexual person.  So if you want to have a discussion about that stuff, we can. But please don't use such a condescending tone because you clearly don't know an awful lot about the struggle.

Edited April 29, 2014 by tardis ad astra

[Vitamin]

I know a Catholic gay man, an ex-Methodist minister, who was kicked out of his ministry after the church found out he was gay. Now, he serves Communion in a Catholic parish every Sunday. This man has also, over the course of our friendship, happened to share his walk with God with me. I don't see how his relationship with God is any lesser than anyone else's that I've seen. I don't see how, just because he has gay sex, that makes him some sort of illegitimate son, or however you would see his relationship with God. I mean, you can try to say "because the two become one flesh" instead of "because a penis goes in a vagainia" but you're just being less crude about it. You can put lipstick on a pig, but its still a pig.

[CrossCuT]

Is there a text version of this somewhere? I cant really watch a 38min video. :(

[mortify ii]

I do agree with over focus on people with same-sex-attraction and choose to ignore a much wider and more serious epidemic, namely addiction to pornography and self abuse. Many tend to forget that self abuse is also recognized as severely disordered and is classed as an unnatural sexual vice along with bestiality and sodomy. I've yet to hear any protest against the "wankers"!

[Fidei Defensor]

I do agree with over focus on people with same-sex-attraction and choose to ignore a much wider and more serious epidemic, namely addiction to pornography and self abuse. Many tend to forget that self abuse is also recognized as severely disordered and is classed as an unnatural sexual vice along with bestiality and sodomy. I've yet to hear any protest against the "wankers"!

Masturbation is indeed a silent plague. I remember years ago there used to be a thread here on Phatmass, for those who struggled with that particular sin, to band together and support one another in their battles. We should revive that!

[GregorMendel]

Praise God there is more hope and renewal than this. Do not believe the lie that this can never be changed. There is a Fourth Way:

http://www.catholicnewsagency.com/resources/life-and-family/homosexuality/the-homosexual-condition-can-it-be-changed-prevented/

and a site that has videos and teaches Truth:
http://truthministry.org/

Love in Christ, but turn from sin and "be transformed". -Rom 12:2

E

Im just gonna leave this here:

http://www.psych.org/File%20Library/Learn/Archives/ps2013_Homosexuality.pdf Edited April 29, 2014 by GregorMendel

[mortify ii]

Im just gonna leave this here:

http://www.psych.org/File%20Library/Learn/Archives/ps2013_Homosexuality.pdf

 

Again I have to make reference to "scientism" in contrast to science. Many people are unaware that the scientific community has its own dogmas, elites, propaganda, and form of excommunication to those that disagree. If you think everything these organizations promote is unbiased and neutral because it's "scientific" you need to get real! There is clearly a dominant philosophy that is exclusive to all others and makes itself assert itself as so. So to gain some perspective on the APA and its *opinion* on homosexual behavior, here is noted psychiatrist, Charles Socarides MD:

 

"Gays said they could "reinvent human nature, reinvent themselves." To do this, these re-inventors had to clear away one major obstacle. No, they didn't go after the nation's clergy. They targeted the members of a worldly priesthood, the psychiatric community, and neutralized them with a radical redefinition of homosexuality itself. In 1972 and 1973 they co-opted the leadership of the American Psychiatric Association and, through a series of political maneuvers, lies and outright flim-flams, they "cured" homosexuality overnight-by fiat. They got the A.P.A. to say that same-sex sex was "not a disorder." It was merely "a condition"-as neutral as lefthandedness.

 

"This amounted to a full approval of homosexuality. Those of us who did not go along with the political redefinition were soon silenced at our own professional meetings. Our lectures were canceled inside academe and our research papers turned down in the learned journals. Worse things followed in the culture at large. Television and movie producers began to do stories promoting homosexuality as a legitimate lifestyle.

 

...

 

"And now, what happens to those of us who stand up and object? Gay activists have already anticipated that. They have created a kind of conventional wisdom: that we suffer from homophobia, a disease that has actually been invented by gays projecting their own fear on society. And we are bigots besides, because, they say, we fail to deal with gays compassionately. 

"Gays are now no different than people born black or Hispanic or physically challenged. Since gays are born that way and have no choice about their sexual orientation, anyone who calls same-sex sex an aberration is now a bigot. Un-American, too. Astoundingly now, college freshmen come home for their first Thanksgiving to announce, "Hey, Mom! Hey, Dad! We've taken the high moral ground. We've joined the gay revolution."

 

http://educate-yourself.org/cn/howmaericawentgay10mar13.shtml

[The Bus Station]

Is this endorsed by the Church? 

 

Plays to emotion while downplaying Truth.  Agenda is to cause Catholics not to see the disorder as a vice and accept homosexuality. 

Catechism states the inclination is objectively disordered, not just the act. 

 

It did not escape notice that the OP had 6661 posts at time of posting this.  Witting or unwitting things undermining the Church can be posted. 

 

A sad story of people abused in this fallen world who feel trapped and do not know where to go because of their same-sex attraction experiences.  This video tells them they should just accept that they cannot change and try to practice chastity.     

 

Praise God there is more hope and renewal than this.  Do not believe the lie that this can never be changed.  There is a Fourth Way:

 

http://www.catholicnewsagency.com/resources/life-and-family/homosexuality/the-homosexual-condition-can-it-be-changed-prevented/

 

and a site that has videos and teaches Truth:

http://truthministry.org/

 

Love in Christ, but turn from sin and "be transformed". -Rom 12:2

 

E

 

E,

 

I checked out the Truth Ministry website you posted.  Here is a quote from their "About Us" page:

 

"We do not attempt to alter anyone's attractions, nor do we promise that this will take place" (emphasis mine)

 

So there goes that.

 

Regarding the CNA article: Dr. Nicolosi's practice, while it reportedly has helped many, is highly controversial and is not specifically endorsed by the Catholic Church. I researched his therapy methods a few years ago, and they seem very intense and potentially emotionally and spiritually harmful. One particular exercise involves the patient explicitly reciting a sexual fantasy, while the doctor repeatedly asks the patient how they feel as the fantasy progresses. Well Doc, I'll be honest: I "feel" 110% turned on.  It could get ugly in here.  Let's arm wrestle instead.

 

Also, everyone who has 6,670+ posts once had 6,66something.  dUSt has yet to find a mathematical loophole to avoid this phenomenon.

 

While I had my own qualms with the above video, The Third Way, and I do agree with your contention that it played too much to the emotions, its message is important and true: Catholics with SSA are called to live lives of chastity, not to spend their lives "praying the gay away."  If you have never experienced SSA or are not close with someone who has it, then perhaps you truly do not realize that SSA is not something you can control or turn and off like a switch, and an adult who has always been attracted to the same sex likely always will be.

 

What can be overcome are the emotional wounds, bouts with depression, and addictions which are frequently a part of SSA, as shown in The Third Way.  Those are the prisons from which those with SSA must seek to be set free, through prayer, the sacraments, and the support of other people.  If you cannot sympathize with that, I pity you, and I suggest you find a completely different topic with which you can more effectively engage.

Edited April 29, 2014 by The Bus Station

[MIKolbe]

I thought the video was excellent.

[AugustineA]

I know a Catholic gay man, an ex-Methodist minister, who was kicked out of his ministry after the church found out he was gay. Now, he serves Communion in a Catholic parish every Sunday. This man has also, over the course of our friendship, happened to share his walk with God with me. I don't see how his relationship with God is any lesser than anyone else's that I've seen. I don't see how, just because he has gay sex, that makes him some sort of illegitimate son, or however you would see his relationship with God. I mean, you can try to say "because the two become one flesh" instead of "because a penis goes in a vagainia" but you're just being less crude about it. You can put lipstick on a pig, but its still a pig.

 

Vitamin, dude, read scripture. It's one of the two sins that calls out for vengeance. 

 

Study the catechism. It's gravely disordered. 

 

I have nothing but admiration for people who struggle with same sex attraction. Engaging in homosexual sex is not only a grave sin, it was condemned across the board, old testament, new testament, and in different cultural contexts. If he's doing that continually, without trying to turn away, he shouldn't be serving at Mass.

 

It's not the same as masturbation, which can be a grave sin and is not found in scripture let alone in the same context, and it's not the same as heterosexual sex, for similar reasons. For the record, masturbation can be overcome with enough Ave Marias. 

 

edit: And I suspect any sexual temptation for that matter.. 

Edited April 29, 2014 by AugustineA

[AugustineA]

Boom.. Orthodox vid on the matter as well. Hope some of you all enjoy it. 

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PCdU_0UA78o

[CatherineM]

I had some clients once who both had SSA. Male and female. Who decided that they wanted a normal life with kids. They got married, had kids, and both eventually came to be sexually attracted to their spouses more than they had ever had to someone of the same sex.

I suppose my first thought was that they were kidding themselves. Then I thought maybe it was chemical. He told me once that it didn't matter, gay, straight, or other, that you at some point in order to have a monogamous relationship, that you settle for the sexual release you will get with one person. There's always going to be someone out there younger or prettier or sexier. Most of us settle though for one person eventually. They decided to settle for each other.

[HisChildForever]

It did not escape notice that the OP had 6661 posts at time of posting this.  Witting or unwitting things undermining the Church can be posted. 

 

The first thing that came to mind after I read this remark was the lolwut pear.