Benedictus Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 (edited) I'd have to ask are enough men in established marriages (in their 50's, 60's age wise) being encouraged in a possible calling they could have to be permanent deacons. Also the hosts from a certain number of masses per year, when a priest is present, could be used when he isn't there. They could be distributed by deacons at weekly masses of the word. This isn't so different to taking the Eucharist to people's homes, as done now, even by lay people. The Pope is being receptive to their ideas but he has said he favours celibate priests in the past. He has actually said any changes would be from culture and not priest shortages. Making someone a priest in this instance is, in a sense, showing a lack of respect and dignity. It also ignores the needs the situation is bringing to the surface regarding priestly formation and the vocations and teaching of the people in such places. If a certain locality has problems or fruit isn't growing there it often shows there must be deep causes for it. The pope has said that the growth in vocations, and faithfulness, in the new areas of the church shows something about the more established areas of the church. Areas that think they always wield the power and direction of the church, namely the US and Europe. My personal view is that celibate secular priests is more practical. The local church would have to face the consequences, financially and otherwise, of priests being married. They can't be moved between parishes or missions freely, parish work can strain a marriage and time with family (esp children), and it poses problems if the marriage breaks down or the wife, or priests children, bring disrepute to his role. Another problem is that once a church, in law, starts to deal with wives and pensions if will find itself having to start being clearer regarding contracts, and then dealing with priests who will enter illicit marriages and unions (homosexual or otherwise). The canon process for removing priests, and the fallout of their family with no income, will create problems. The damage seen among Anglican clergy should be a warning this isn't to be welcomed. Edited April 12, 2014 by Benedictus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhuturePriest Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 I always liked Jason Evert's article about this: http://chastity.com/chastity-qa/vocations/dont-you-think-vocations-crisis-would- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhuturePriest Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 Late bloomer. I started growing mustache hairs when I was twelve, and beard hair when I was thirteen. I was proud of it and refused to shave it for two or three years. Thankfully I decided to shave it finally, as everyone tells me it looked incredibly stupid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OnlySunshine Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 Just imagine that you are on your deathbed and request your last rites at 4am. The hospital or your family calls the parish priest and he says that he can't come because his wife is away and someone has to stay with the kids. It's too late (or early) to find a babysitter and his family doesn't live close by. Thus, you are deprived of your last rites. It may be a severe situation that requires priestly assistance and, if they had a family, they wouldn't be free to drop things at a moment's notice like they are now. Matthew Kelly said it best when he said that those who put other needs before their own would be mothers first and priests 2nd. Priests can work 100 hours a day 365 days of the year and not make a dent in the spiritual life of the parish. It's constantly changing and requiring a priest presence at all times. I'd hate to be married to a priest and keep him away from the duties of his parish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winchester Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 Do you think God would deny someone entry into Heaven because they didn't receive last rites even if they desired them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tab'le De'Bah-Rye Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 (edited) The holy bible says nothing of priests being married, and the holy catholic church already excepts anglican priests whom convert and are already married to stay married and remain priests, ie: like St Peter. The only biblical mention of married religious is the role of deacon and elder but to be classified as an elder you need to have children of age practising the faith. Read your scriptures people. Sacred tradition, the holy sacraments, and THE HOLY BIBLE! reflects the trinity, for realz :P 3 sources of divine revelation. Edited April 12, 2014 by Tab'le De'Bah-Rye Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benedictus Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 (edited) Winchester - No, but to the dying person it would matter and also to their family. It would be a pastoral failure. If the priest knew this was happening it must be discouraging. Something often has to give, and from reading and hearing about Anglican priests, its often ends up being a choice between their ministry or their marriage. That's if their wife hasn't already made the decision for them! Being a priests wife mustn't be easy; people come to your door all the time and expect you to be and act a specific way. Even worse if the wife happens to not be a Christian, or has a job that those in the parish frown upon. If she doesn't have children, or enough, then this brings gossip and questions. It's a situation that brings more problems than it necessarily solves. On some level though having a priest take the place of Christ in a parish, but not being able to follow Christ in clerical celibacy seems a bit of an oxymoron to me. It seems clear St Paul's view of marriage was that it shouldn't be the norm or be encouraged, but as a mercy for Christians who aren't strong enough to persevere. I believe that in the Orthodox churches those entering priesthood have to be married before they are ordained. If they are single they then cannot marry once ordained. Celibate men are the only ones allowed to become bishops. Those men who are married cannot then marry again if their wife dies or she divorces him. I think this is similar for Eastern Catholics. While this grew up for understandable reasons I think it would be detrimental to the western church to adopt this practice in the current climate where the move would be politically hijacked and seen as a sign of liberalism, weakness or the collapse of the church. It's sad but these are the times we are in. That aside, from my experience of the churches, the way the dioceses and the laity behave often engage and behave (plus the scandals) I'm not surprised many men don't want to give their lives to the ministry. One of the biggest hindrances for men entering the seminary I heard at vocations groups was the worry they'll train to be priests, forsaking marriage, and then 10 or 15 years later the church changes course and they'll feel cheated. Although this maybe isn't a good reason to put a vocation off, it sure is understandable why men apply later in life. I think if the church wants men to be serious about priestly vocations they need to set their course and provide some reassurances one way of the other. Edited April 12, 2014 by Benedictus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winchester Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 Life is full of failures. Other rites have married priests. If it happens, it will be okay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benedictus Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 :rolleyes: :huh: And the Latin rite generally doesn't, so it will be okay :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winchester Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 I'm not the one hyperventilating. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benedictus Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 No it's opinionated typerventing, different problem :dancer2: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basilisa Marie Posted April 13, 2014 Share Posted April 13, 2014 And what if your parish priest is home sick with the flu? It's not like he's going to be able to go the hospital to give someone last rites. Stuff happens. It's not like a celibate priest is always on call 100% of the time, either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigJon16 Posted April 13, 2014 Share Posted April 13, 2014 Open minded? Good! We should always be open minded about things, but that doesn't necessarily mean that they'll actually happen. I'm open minded about the apocalypse, open minded about leaving the seminary, open minded about getting married, open minded about picking up a second major, open minded about giving a reflection at my parish this summer, open minded about getting a doctorate someday, open minded about writing books, open minded about becoming a photojournalist, open minded about winning at poker with my bro seminarians tonight, etc. etc. I am open minded about all of these things, but that doesn't mean that any of them will actually happen. Some are more likely to happen than others (second major, parish work, writing a book) while others are even more less likely (doctorate, apocalypse, winning at poker). My point is this: "Open minded" does not mean definite or even possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OnlySunshine Posted April 13, 2014 Share Posted April 13, 2014 Open minded? Good! We should always be open minded about things, but that doesn't necessarily mean that they'll actually happen. I'm open minded about the apocalypse, open minded about leaving the seminary, open minded about getting married, open minded about picking up a second major, open minded about giving a reflection at my parish this summer, open minded about getting a doctorate someday, open minded about writing books, open minded about becoming a photojournalist, open minded about winning at poker with my bro seminarians tonight, etc. etc. I am open minded about all of these things, but that doesn't mean that any of them will actually happen. Some are more likely to happen than others (second major, parish work, writing a book) while others are even more less likely (doctorate, apocalypse, winning at poker). My point is this: "Open minded" does not mean definite or even possible. You don't want to be so open-minded, either, that your brain falls out. ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winchester Posted April 13, 2014 Share Posted April 13, 2014 Or so closed that they suffocate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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