PhuturePriest Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 Can someone explain this to me? I just don't see how guns are an inherent right as human beings. Life, education, proper medical care, these are human rights. How is shaped metal that shoots shaped metal a human right? I don't understand this line of thinking, and I've been led to believe that the only reason people say it is is because 'Murica. Someone please correct me if I'm wrong. I can't promise you'll change my opinion, but I am genuinely curious as to how this logic works. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Not The Philosopher Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 From the right to life comes a right to legitimate self-defense. I consider the owning, and, in certain cases, the use of firearms to fall under 'legitimate'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotreDame Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 What does "guns are a god-given right" mean and who holds that point of view? Also, explain what "Life, education, proper medical care, these are human rights" means, ie. what are "human rights" and why do these rights include the three things you've mentioned? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhuturePriest Posted April 8, 2014 Author Share Posted April 8, 2014 (edited) What does "guns are a god-given right" mean and who holds that point of view? Also, explain what "Life, education, proper medical care, these are human rights" means, ie. what are "human rights" and why do these rights include the three things you've mentioned? This is a fair enough question. I know for a fact I've read in the Catechism that life, education, and proper medical care are human rights. However, I have not been able to find that section. And I've heard many conservatives say that it's a God-given right to have guns. Edited April 8, 2014 by FuturePriest387 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotreDame Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 This is a fair enough question. I know for a fact I've read in the Catechism that life, education, and proper medical care are human rights. However, I have not been able to find that section. And I've heard many conservatives say that it's a God-given right to have guns. So.... I'm not really sure you understood the questions that I asked, but your answer only makes me want to ask more. You are conflating "human rights" with "God given rights" and now you are bringing Catholic teaching into it... Although all three use the term 'right' they all mean different things and are usually arrived at in different ways. Putting all the issues with your post aside, you are essentially just asking why one would believe citizens should have the right to own guns? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhuturePriest Posted April 8, 2014 Author Share Posted April 8, 2014 So.... I'm not really sure you understood the questions that I asked, but your answer only makes me want to ask more. You are conflating "human rights" with "God given rights" and now you are bringing Catholic teaching into it... Although all three use the term 'right' they all mean different things and are usually arrived at in different ways. Putting all the issues with your post aside, you are essentially just asking why one would believe citizens should have the right to own guns? Perhaps I am confusing terms. But this wouldn't be a proper FP thread without me confusing terms, other people, and myself, all at the same time. It's a talent I have. I'm asking why some citizens believe that owning a gun is a right given by God. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
havok579257 Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 (edited) From the right to life comes a right to legitimate self-defense. I consider the owning, and, in certain cases, the use of firearms to fall under 'legitimate'. self-defense is a given right. although the use of guns is not a given right unless you believe self defense is impossible without guns. Edited April 8, 2014 by havok579257 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotreDame Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 Perhaps I am confusing terms. But this wouldn't be a proper FP thread without me confusing terms, other people, and myself, all at the same time. It's a talent I have. I'm asking why some citizens believe that owning a gun is a right given by God. well, "god given right" is usually used in the natural right/law sense. I'd start on that subject by reading up on John Locke: http://www.fee.org/the_freeman/detail/john-locke-natural-rights-to-life-liberty-and-property Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrysostom Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 If Abel had been informed of his rights, he would have had a .45 loaded and ready to raise himself some Cain (in self-defense). But due to misinformation about gun rights and the Democratic Party platform, he was offed in a field. :crazyshoot: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhuturePriest Posted April 8, 2014 Author Share Posted April 8, 2014 If Abel had been informed of his rights, he would have had a .45 loaded and ready to raise himself some Cain (in self-defense). But due to misinformation about gun rights and the Democratic Party platform, he was offed in a field. :crazyshoot: He wouldn't have been offed in a field if he wasn't oft in a field. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrysostom Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 He wouldn't have been offed in a field if he wasn't oft in a field. And especially not if he had been often afield. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winchester Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 Owning property is a human right. The owning of a firearm is not inherently evil, nor is the use of one inherently evil. Those who claim that gun ownership is not a human right generally claim that the use of violence to prevent others from owning weapons is their right, even if they must go through the process of supporting a an agent to act on their behalf. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhuturePriest Posted April 8, 2014 Author Share Posted April 8, 2014 Owning property is a human right. The owning of a firearm is not inherently evil, nor is the use of one inherently evil. Those who claim that gun ownership is not a human right generally claim that the use of violence to prevent others from owning weapons is their right, even if they must go through the process of supporting a an agent to act on their behalf. I've never said firearms or the ownership of them are inherently evil. Guns are morally neutral. Saying a gun is inherently evil is like saying chocolate chip cookie dough is inherently sinful (though it is, however, inherently delicious.) I just question that the ownership of a gun is a God-given right like life, education, and medical care are, which is clearly stated in the Catechism passage that seems to no longer exist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
polskieserce Posted April 9, 2014 Share Posted April 9, 2014 Sometimes guns are the only way to get rid of evil. Could you imagine living in Europe and belonging to a group on Hitler's extermination list before the Allies invaded Europe? Sometimes entire governments have to be taken down to force. That is why guns, and other weapons for that matter, are a God-given right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhuturePriest Posted April 9, 2014 Author Share Posted April 9, 2014 Sometimes guns are the only way to get rid of evil. Could you imagine living in Europe and belonging to a group on Hitler's extermination list before the Allies invaded Europe? Sometimes entire governments have to be taken down to force. That is why guns, and other weapons for that matter, are a God-given right. To elaborate on this, you believe it's the right of people to have weapons to defend themselves in the cases of tyrannical governments, ergo guns? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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