Breast Feeding At Mass

[Gabriela]

So this is the second comparison we've had in the thread, and like the last one, it's comparing apples with oranges.

 

Feeding a child is not comparable to exposing the Eucharist and urinating.

 

As usual, you miss the more fundamental point: You assumed that hiding something communicates it must be shameful. We hide the Eucharist when we're not adoring Him, or communing with Him, but not because we think Him shameful. Ergo, there's no reason to assume that people who prefer women to cover themselves when breastfeeding prefer that because they think it's shameful. People may have many reasons. Just like people don't care to see a penis in public, regardless of what it's doing exposed.

 

I find it amazing that Catholics think it so unbearably difficult to schedule breastfeedings around a 1-hour Mass, when Protestants, Eastern Orthodox, Jews, and Muslims manage just fine scheduling theirs around religious services that sometimes last for hours. Protestants, Jews, Eastern Orthodox, and Muslims manage to get their kids through much longer religious services without indulging their—to Catholics—apparently indomitable appetites with cheerios and other snacks. (I am not talking about special cases here, but in special cases, you would not find Protestants, Eastern Orthodox, Jews, or Muslims feeding their kids in the sanctuary.) Protestants, Jews, Eastern Orthodox, and Muslims somehow manage to keep kids quiet for hours during prayer services, or they somehow find the strength to remove them from the sanctuary when they have an outburst. For Catholics, though, this is just too inconvenient. WE have a RIGHT to be at Mass on OUR terms, regardless of what we think we need to be doing simultaneously because we just can't be bothered to rearrange our schedules or deny our children for the sake of discipline and education—and beaver dam anyone else who thinks it's inappropriate. Do we really think our lives are just so unbearably hard as they are that we can't handle adding consideration of others' (culturally perfectly normal) sensibilities to our burdens?

 

This thread started as an inquiry into the historical view of the Church on breastfeeding at Mass, and if that information were lacking, into others' views on the subject. I hoped that it would lead to some open discussion in which each "side" tried to understand the others' perspective. Instead it has turned into an "other people can bit.e me" and "if you've got a problem with it, you're obviously a pervert with ADHD who thinks women are good for nothing but sex" funfest. Some of the attitudes expressed here are positively hateful. I know this is the internet—but I thought it was part of the Catholic internet. Or maybe that's the problem: Catholic websites—forums, commboxes, etc.—seem so disproportionately full of anger and venom towards others. Really, what is going on with us?

 

If I have the right as the OP to request that this thread be shut down, I request that now. If I don't, I won't be back anyway. I'm sure no one will miss me.

 

Please, hate on in my absence.

Edited March 27, 2014 by curiousing

[blazeingstar]

Curisoing....with all those masses and breasfeedings you seem to be witness to I'm surprised you are also present on the inner-workings of at least 10 different faith practices.

 

You are also aware that some of the listed religions have rather draconian practices towards women and their small children, like declaring mothers unclean for the first 6 months after the birth of a child....precisely when breastfeeding on demand would most likely come into play.

[PhuturePriest]

As usual, you miss the more fundamental point: You assumed that hiding something communicates it must be shameful. We hide the Eucharist when we're not adoring Him, or communing with Him, but not because we think Him shameful. Ergo, there's no reason to assume that people who prefer women to cover themselves when breastfeeding prefer that because they think it's shameful. People may have many reasons. Just like people don't care to see a penis in public, regardless of what it's doing exposed.

 

I find it amazing that Catholics think it so unbearably difficult to schedule breastfeedings around a 1-hour Mass, when Protestants, Eastern Orthodox, Jews, and Muslims manage just fine scheduling theirs around religious services that sometimes last for hours. Protestants, Jews, Eastern Orthodox, and Muslims manage to get their kids through much longer religious services without indulging their—to Catholics—apparently indomitable appetites with cheerios and other snacks. (I am not talking about special cases here, but in special cases, you would not find Protestants, Eastern Orthodox, Jews, or Muslims feeding their kids in the sanctuary.) Protestants, Jews, Eastern Orthodox, and Muslims somehow manage to keep kids quiet for hours during prayer services, or they somehow find the strength to remove them from the sanctuary when they have an outburst. For Catholics, though, this is just too inconvenient. WE have a RIGHT to be at Mass on OUR terms, regardless of what we think we need to be doing simultaneously because we just can't be bothered to rearrange our schedules or deny our children for the sake of discipline and education—and beaver dam anyone else who thinks it's inappropriate. Do we really think our lives are just so unbearably hard as they are that we can't handle adding consideration of others' (culturally perfectly normal) sensibilities to our burdens?

 

This thread started as an inquiry into the historical view of the Church on breastfeeding at Mass, and if that information were lacking, into others' views on the subject. I hoped that it would lead to some open discussion in which each "side" tried to understand the others' perspective. Instead it has turned into an "other people can bit.e me" and "if you've got a problem with it, you're obviously a pervert with ADHD who thinks women are good for nothing but sex" funfest. Some of the attitudes expressed here are positively hateful. I know this is the internet—but I thought it was part of the Catholic internet. Or maybe that's the problem: Catholic websites—forums, commboxes, etc.—seem so disproportionately full of anger and venom towards others. Really, what is going on with us?

 

If I have the right as the OP to request that this thread be shut down, I request that now. If I don't, I won't be back anyway. I'm sure no one will miss me.

 

Please, hate on in my absence.

 

Timing breastfeeding around Mass? Do you even know how babies eat? You can't starve a baby for an hour just so you can feed him twenty minutes before Mass so he won't be hungry during it -- I do believe that's called child abuse. Besides, it most likely wouldn't work. My nephew will eat for ten minutes, quit, eat again twenty minutes later for five, quit, and then eat again five minutes afterwards. Babies don't eat like adults do.

Edited March 27, 2014 by FuturePriest387

[fides quarens intellectum]

Timing breastfeeding around Mass? Do you even know how babies eat? You can't starve a baby for an hour just so you can feed him twenty minutes before Mass so he won't be hungry during it -- I do believe that's called child abuse. Besides, it most likely wouldn't work.

 

Depends on the age of the baby.  Newborns?  Sure - they eat around the clock.  10-month-olds?  Aside from health issues and disabilities, most are fine being trained to eat every couple hours (or longer) from several months in.  Most of the moms I know had their 4 and 5-month-olds eating every 3-4 hours (we couldn't because of reflux, but again, that's a health issue).

 

Yeah, I'm one of those moms who will feed an older baby before Mass so that he doesn't need to eat during the hour-long Mass.  Yep, child abuser.

[PhuturePriest]

Depends on the age of the baby.  Newborns?  Sure - they eat around the clock.  10-month-olds?  Aside from health issues and disabilities, most are fine being trained to eat every couple hours (or longer) from several months in.  Most of the moms I know had their 4 and 5-month-olds eating every 3-4 hours (we couldn't because of reflux, but again, that's a health issue).

 

Yeah, I'm one of those moms who will feed an older baby before Mass so that he doesn't need to eat during the hour-long Mass.  Yep, child abuser.

 

It's a little different if the baby is older. I'm used to young babies, so I think in terms of young babies. Sorry if I offended you.

[Tab'le De'Bah-Rye]

I have a question. Why would it be disruptive to go into the foyer and feed the bub?  Also though i understand the whole psychotic sexualisation of the u.s.a or the world perhaps and the paranoia about a women exposing her breast anywhere to feed her child. It SUX! But the thing is the breast isn't a sex organ so what's the go? But again " Why would it be disruptive to go into the foyer and feed the bub?" A breast feeding mother to be less supposedly disruptive could get to holy mass early and sit at the edge of a pew for easy exit, simple solution if people are going to get upset by it. Maybe it is the people who have failed in raising there own children to be practising Catholic Christians that are doing the complaining, and/or single men and women that can't find a partner for the life of them and have been trying for many many years. A case of Jealousy and or envy perhaps.

 

Onward Christian souls.

 

JESUS IZ LORD!

Edited March 27, 2014 by Tab'le De'Bah-Rye

[Fidei Defensor]

For the love of God, it's not like He doesn't know what the human form looks like. I hardly think He'd mind.

[Eliakim]

no, you don't breastfeed at Mass.  Give your kid a bottle of milk or pacifier.  Or feed him jello. 

Edited March 27, 2014 by Eliakim

[Tab'le De'Bah-Rye]

The whole thing about refusing a baby the breast when he or she is hungry, is that you can teach the child to rebel. A hungry baby needs to eat. And the thing about pacifiers and bottled milk is the baby is asking for gold and your giving it a black market corrupt alternative which doesn't satisfy. Why is it you wan't baby to not be satisfied again elakim? Breast feeding is not only a source of food it is an intimate act of bonding between mother and child and not only mother and child but child to the world, and it is not sexual, my opinion is it is holy and righteous to some degree or another, sex may also be holy and righteous in it's proper place but sex is sex and breast feeding is breast feeding.

Edited March 27, 2014 by Tab'le De'Bah-Rye

[Eliakim]

No boobs, no sex during Mass, Tab'le. 

 

Bottles/pacifier/gerber are ok. 

 

E

[Basilisa Marie]

Whoa, hold on. I know you must be feeling like everyone is ganging up on you, Curiousing, because you seem to be the only one with your opinion in the whole thread. And yeah, we kind of are.  But you did ask for other opinions, and were the person who brought up that women should cover because the minds of men may wander, so that's how that got brought up. 

Frankly I don't think any theologians have really commented on the issue. A lot of times they don't on things like this, for a number of reasons, some of which are probably that it's a cultural norm and not a point of theology. If you're looking for the opinions of Catholic bloggers, I guess there's google for that. I may be wrong, but it looks to me in your OP that you were looking for some kind of rule about it that we could find based on what the Church has historically said about it. But (at least speaking for myself), I don't think it's the kind of issue that's best tackled in that way. Instead, I think it's better to approach it from a moral or cultural perspective. Heck, I'll even admit that I get a little uncomfortable when I see a woman breastfeeding at Church without a cover. But at the same time, I believe it's more important for a woman to be able to do it, for reasons I've already outlined. 

 

Maybe you're right, more men could provide their insight in this thread.  

[Fidei Defensor]

No boobs, no sex during Mass, Tab'le. 

 

Bottles/pacifier/gerber are ok. 

 

E

Man and woman were created naked. I doubt God minds a boob.

[Tab'le De'Bah-Rye]

I think the only problem i can see with breast feeding at holy mass is that you have to burp the baby afterwards and that can be kind of disruptive and not that necessarily but sometimes or often babies vomit after being burped and the babies spew going on the pews or the floor may not be okay, which because it is a food source can call in rats,mice,cockroaches etc. But what is life without a bit of baby vomit and what is the kingdom of heaven without children?

Edited March 27, 2014 by Tab'le De'Bah-Rye

[Tab'le De'Bah-Rye]

No boobs, no sex during Mass, Tab'le. 

 

Bottles/pacifier/gerber are ok. 

 

E

 

 

Boobs are not a sexual organ, and i have seen an icon of the holy mother breast feeding the baby Jesus. How is breast feeding in anyway sexual unless your a pervert, which would mean it is the pervert whom actually needs to go to confession and not the breastfeeding mother?

Edited March 27, 2014 by Tab'le De'Bah-Rye

[Eliakim]

Boobs are not a sexual organ, and i have seen an icon of the holy mother breast feeding the baby Jesus. How is breast feeding in anyway sexual unless your a pervert, which would mean it is the pervert whom actually needs to go to confession and not the breastfeeding mother?

 

neither is your ass, but I don't wanna see that either at Mass. 

 

After A & E ate the fruit, the privates need to be covered.

 

E