New Obamacare Thread

[Isidore_of_Seville]

yeah that makes sense.  cause according to your logic, the catholic church should support more access to abortions, free abortions and more killing on innocent babies because that will help reduce abortion.  the church is actually causing more abortions right now because it doesn't support birth control, pre-marital sex or any other reason liberals give that will reduce abortions.  dang you catholic church for your anti-abortion stance.  support abortions and then we will reduce abortions.  i mean what's more logical.

 

Ah, alright I see why you're confused, no worries. Let me explain.

 

Democratic Policies:

 

1. Increase access to safe abortions: Obviously this DOES NOT help reduce the number of abortions that are had.

2. Increase access to sexual education: This DOES help reduce the number of abortions.

3. Increase access to financial help for the poor: This DOES help reduce the number of abortions.

4. Increase funding for public education, especially for the poor: This DOES help reduce the number of abortions.

 

Republican Policies:

 

1. Restrict access to safe abortions: This WILL NOT help reduce the number of abortions that are had (as I explained earlier, see post about War on Drugs, criminal issue vs health care issue).

2. Cut funding to public education: This WILL NOT help reduce the number of abortions that are had.

3. Keep Sexual Education out of schools: This WILL NOT help reduce the number of abortions that are had.

4. Cut funding to welfare, WIC, and SNAP, and more: This WILL NOT help reduce the number of abortions that are had.

 

So, if we're scoring these teams (Dems and Reps), the Dems get 3/4 and the Reps get 0/4. You could make an even longer list but you won't find any policy from either side that adjusts the outcome of the results.

 

Does this make more sense now? The Democratic party is in fact doing more to protect the unborn through their policies than the GOP is.

Edited April 2, 2014 by Isidore_of_Seville

[Isidore_of_Seville]

its selfish plain and simple and the democrats promote that selfishness.  that your selfish choices and your wants are more important than a babies life.  that your desire to have as much sex as you want without consequences is more important than a babies life.

 

Please read my earlier post where I covered the reasons why women choose to get abortions and what can be done to help lessen those reasons. I already covered all of this. Proposed Republican policy actually exacerbates this issue, it doesn't help, it hurts.

Edited April 2, 2014 by Isidore_of_Seville

[PhuturePriest]

The church teaches that we should help our fellow man by any means available. Do you think that Jesus would have a problem with the government helping out it's people?

 

As a matter of fact, the entire purpose of a democratic government is to serve it's people. so by definition, we MUST take care of each other through the government!

 

Jesus was killed by democracy (popular vote). I'm not what you might call a fan of it.

The entire purpose of communism is to help our fellow man. That didn't stop the Church from condemning it and helping to destroy it.

 

I do not support increased spending for military and lower spending for helping the poor. I would actually do the opposite if I were in charge.

[Isidore_of_Seville]

I do not support increased spending for military and lower spending for helping the poor. I would actually do the opposite if I were in charge.

 

You're starting to sound like a more reasonable person already!

Edited April 2, 2014 by Isidore_of_Seville

[CrossCuT]

Basically, the best way to defeat abortion is to create a world in which bringing in new life is supported. A lot of government laws/policies whatever that the republicans are pushing are very very very detrimental to the poor and are, in fact, making us poorer as a whole.

 

Thus, the poor who cant afford education, cant afford insurance, cant afford food and everything else, likely will want to abort their child rather than keep it. Having larger families is getting difficult in this economy and not everyone has a 6 figure paying job.

 

Also, if you think that sex ed will increase abortions, LOL. Obviously some kids who get sex ed will have unprotected sex anyways, but if you educate the children to understand what happens, how the female body works, and whatever else, they might make a better decision.

 

There was a girl on 16 and pregnant who said "I was usually really good about taking my birth control,  but I stopped for a little while. The last time I did it I didnt get pregnant,  but this time I did"

 

She had absolutely no idea how her body worked or how birth control worked for that matter. Thankfully she kept the baby, but not all of them do.

 

[havok579257]

Ah, alright I see why you're confused, no worries. Let me explain.

 

Democratic Policies:

 

1. Increase access to safe abortions: Obviously this DOES NOT help reduce the number of abortions that are had.

2. Increase access to sexual education: This DOES help reduce the number of abortions.

3. Increase access to financial help for the poor: This DOES help reduce the number of abortions.

4. Increase funding for public education, especially for the poor: This DOES help reduce the number of abortions.

 

Republican Policies:

 

1. Restrict access to safe abortions: This WILL NOT help reduce the number of abortions that are had (as I explained earlier, see post about War on Drugs, criminal issue vs health care issue).

2. Cut funding to public education: This WILL NOT help reduce the number of abortions that are had.

3. Keep Sexual Education out of schools: This WILL NOT help reduce the number of abortions that are had.

4. Cut funding to welfare, WIC, and SNAP, and more: This WILL NOT help reduce the number of abortions that are had.

 

So, if we're scoring these teams (Dems and Reps), the Dems get 3/4 and the Reps get 0/4. You could make an even longer list but you won't find any policy from either side that adjusts the outcome of the results.

 

Does this make more sense now? The Democratic party is in fact doing more to protect the unborn through their policies than the GOP is.

 

 

its really sad thate your mind is so warped by your party affiliation you can't see the truth.  democrats are for increased number of abortions, not reducing that number.  

[Isidore_of_Seville]

its really sad thate your mind is so warped by your party affiliation you can't see the truth.  democrats are for increased number of abortions, not reducing that number.  

 

Dude. Can you please provide some sort of evidence for your claims? 

 

I am not trying to advocate for abortion. I am simply thinking critically and trying to propose workable solutions to decrease the number of abortions in this country and hopefully around the world.

 

The war cry here is "ban it all!". Well, both history, and all of the facts I've presented here today have shown you that your war cry is not a valid solution to the problem. So, you can either keep fighting with me, or we can work together to look at what really causes abortions and then we can think about how to reduce the number of them.

 

We're all on the winning side of this battle. Now it's time to unite with a winning strategy because no offense, but your strategy has been failing miserably for 50+ years, and you're losing ground every single day. So, let's hop to and get with it!

Edited April 2, 2014 by Isidore_of_Seville

[CrossCuT]

Yar, I dont remember hearing them talk about that in campaigns. 

[havok579257]

Basically, the best way to defeat abortion is to create a world in which bringing in new life is supported. A lot of government laws/policies whatever that the republicans are pushing are very very very detrimental to the poor and are, in fact, making us poorer as a whole.

 

Thus, the poor who cant afford education, cant afford insurance, cant afford food and everything else, likely will want to abort their child rather than keep it. Having larger families is getting difficult in this economy and not everyone has a 6 figure paying job.

 

Also, if you think that sex ed will increase abortions, LOL. Obviously some kids who get sex ed will have unprotected sex anyways, but if you educate the children to understand what happens, how the female body works, and whatever else, they might make a better decision.

 

There was a girl on 16 and pregnant who said "I was usually really good about taking my birth control,  but I stopped for a little while. The last time I did it I didnt get pregnant,  but this time I did"

 

She had absolutely no idea how her body worked or how birth control worked for that matter. Thankfully she kept the baby, but not all of them do.

 yes because pushing birth control as no worries sex is the right approch.  increased use in birth control leads to more abortions.  less pre-marital sex leads to less abortions.

[PhuturePriest]

Yar, I dont remember hearing them talk about that in campaigns. 

 

Pope Paul VI said that the more accessible birth control is, and the more used it is, the more abortions we will have. Why? Because over 60% of the women who have abortions have them because their birth control failed.

[Isidore_of_Seville]

 yes because pushing birth control as no worries sex is the right approch.  increased use in birth control leads to more abortions.  less pre-marital sex leads to less abortions.

 

Well, first of all increased use of birth control definitely does NOT lead to more abortions.

 

But even if it were true, less birth control definitely would NOT lead to less pre-marital sex.

 

Once again it's about thinking critically and using logic and reason to determine a solution to the problem.

[CrossCuT]

 yes because pushing birth control as no worries sex is the right approch.  increased use in birth control leads to more abortions.  less pre-marital sex leads to less abortions.

 

Dont assume that is my position. If you asked me instead, I would have told you that no, I dont support pushing birth control.

In fact I very very very much support education and Fertility Awareness. I think all girls should be taught how to read and track their cycles and understand what is going on.

 

We learn about all the other biological systems in school, we shouldnt skip the reproductive parts for the girls especially. I think we are doing them a huge disservice by not teaching them about ALL parts of the physiology. 

 

But I know its easier to assume Im a birth control pushing, baby murder right?

[CrossCuT]

Pope Paul VI said that the more accessible birth control is, and the more used it is, the more abortions we will have. Why? Because over 60% of the women who have abortions have them because their birth control failed.

 

And if there was no more birth control, people would stop having sex? Did the pope say that too?

[Isidore_of_Seville]

Pope Paul VI said that the more accessible birth control is, and the more used it is, the more abortions we will have. Why? Because over 60% of the women who have abortions have them because their birth control failed.

 

So let's pretend that all the women that birth control DID work for never had access to it to begin with. There's even more abortions coming in. Yours (and the Pope's) logic doesn't make sense.

[NotreDame]

and again i will say what i have said before in these threads.  the world is not conservative and liberal.  the world is not capitalism and socialism.  their are other things out there.  

 

Which I would grant coming from someone who didn't constantly rant against the tea party.  Coming from you, however, this just doesn't seem genuine.

 

BTW - it's "there", not "their."